and one one of the toughest places for me too was it was relationships and it still is you know um it still is uh a really tough space for me it that also goes to unrealistic expectations you know I I don't if things get tough I I'll leave yeah you know um you know I I you know I heard you talking about fake intimacy once do you know what I'm talking about what were you talking about about it I resonated with that so every child Longs for connection just built but if you can't get it
you try to connect with Dad but he's always too busy mom's always depressed or angry you can't connect so you assume it's my fault I must be something wrong with me but I'm still driven for connection but I don't want deep genuine connection now cuz that's always led to rejection so let's try Bor room intimacy let's try fake intimacy let's just have fun all the time in sports pervert and yeah set yeah pornography that sort of thing yeah because it gives the feelings of connection without the true intimacy yeah but it doesn't satisfy no but
it and it sets up addiction um and that's where most people end up sadly straying into that fake intimacy world yeah like would you do do you think it's safe to say that complex trauma makes um having a healthy relationship impos like like it's got to have a huge effect yeah yes very much and impossible even no makes it almost impossible for a healthy relationship yeah so everybody that I deal with um as long as they're single they don't think they need to work on their trauma cuz yeah just me I'm I'm surviving soon as
they get in a relationship then they start damaging the other person then they have kids they're damaging their kids and all of a sudden they go I got to start working on my crap um but then they go okay I'll just change this I'll change this but it's not working why is it not fixing the relationship and it's cuz you're trying to fix the symptoms you're not dealing with the root issues that deep shame that deep lack of trust that deep fear of intimacy and fear of Abandonment and as long as those are still there
they're going to keep getting in the way of true healthy relationships um and so a lot of people as long as the relationships going along smoothly it looks pretty good but as soon as there's the slightest thing that triggers Their Fear of Abandonment or triggers their shame big explosion they go back to Old behaviors all of a sudden they're in fight fight flight or freeze mode they're lashing out they're running away and that's when all the damage happens um and after a while there's so much baggage from all the damage that you just can't repair
it yeah yeah yeah I mean personally I like I would yeah I've had problem I mean certainly problems with uh not cheating in relationships I've never I've always I think I've cheated in every relationship I've ever been in sadly you know um uh uh let me think oh um like like would have problems with sex and stuff but if the person was going to leave me then I could have it was like my body would then entertain it you know but otherwise uh like um yeah or if it was with a stranger it was easier
you know uh not a complete stranger like somebody at a mall or something but like a um you know with somebody you know a bar sex or somebody like that or just somebody you met at a service area or whatever but um yeah that kind of stuff uh oh staying with somebody man this is this is this staying with somebody uh B because I didn't want them to have somebody else who would really care about them yes or that could care about about him better than me yeah um even though I knew I was doing
a bad job yeah man it makes me feel uh yeah I'm not proud of that and I didn't know but some a lot of it man I didn't know until later you know I just couldn't see it yeah I would just think I was bad at relationships for a long time I would just think that um you know and I was I mean I I was just think that I was a phander and man you know kind of deal Gypsy whatever it is I don't even know what they call it Gypsy boy or whatever and
then um but yeah I was like and I still don't know how I'm going to do it like if I think about like being in a marriage a long term I don't know how I'll could do it right you know I mean I know for a while I resorted to pornography for a while and uh but that lost its you know I just learned through other 12 step just how negative it is for you and so that's not a solution I mean I still date and everything but I don't know if I when I think
about that it's like oh that feels harrowing yeah but it used to be like if I saw a family that was functioning I was like what the [ __ ] is this this is [ __ ] the dumbest thing I've ever seen that's where I started at yes and that's EXA that's a real thing yes and and to even get to the point now where I can even think about being in a marriage or something for me that's it's been a while you know it's been a it's been a it's been a ride you know
cuz here's where I found myself I found myself in a place for me where I couldn't understand why I wasn't able to do certain things like especially like with relationships and stuff like that I kept thinking that it would change and um and it and it just hasn't it's gotten better things have gotten better I'm a lot more aware I don't make a lot of the same mistakes as I used to I don't get people in a situation that I'm leading them to believe that there's something that you know if there isn't something you know
like but I still have a just a severe fear of a lot of it um and as you get older it's like well how the heck am I ever going to have a family then you know will I ever be able to have that or should I just you know keep to myself more you know not in a negative way but in a POS you know it's like so I would and I say this all the time to people that come to Ouray program there is hope but be prepared it takes a lot of work
and it's not a quick fix this is going to take a lot of time um because this started in childhood and you don't undo that overnight but there is hope yeah I heard you talk on one of your thanks thanks for saying that to me and just anybody that's listening you know and I believe that um I believe that when I go into meetings and you see guys at like two years years ago were like addicted to prostitutes and now they're getting married and they're having children it's like you see people change their lives or
guys who had never even been on a date in two years and were just addicted to pornography and didn't even realize they were addicted it was just a pattern of comfort y I remember when I found my wiener dude when I was probably I don't even know once I found something that could make me feel good yep self soothing I yeah you could have play all the uh you could play all the Madden you wanted I was like I had my own game exactly you know what I'm saying dude and I was two-point conversion and
all the time bro I was doing it it was like that was unbelievable to me I I would bike across town to go look at pornography at my buddy's house going and digging up pornos over there man it was just cuz it was the first time I also had a relationship with a woman even was just on a damn page or drawing we had a dude who would draw you some ovies or something for the weekend Oh thinking that my partner a woman if my girlfriend or whatever if they did something wrong then it was
me doing it wrong yes like um yeah oh gosh if they if they're a little off or something or they uh do things away that people don't like that's a reflection of me totally yes you know those are some symptoms that I had you know so can I talk scientifically again 100% you can talk in any pass you want about it so to me it's so interesting especially living in the west is so much of our dating and attraction in relationships is really what we've come to understand is the lyic or the emotion part of
the brain and the chemical oxytocin which is what makes me feel in love and so that's released through when I see somebody pretty when I touch them when I kiss them when I have sex all of that releases those Feelgood chemicals and I feel in love I feel it's going to last forever I feel intimacy though it's not true intimacy it's the feeling of intimacy um so that's a great starting place for a relationship the problem is you can't sustain that just through sex just because you still got life you got to communicate you got
to learn to accept and love and respect each other but if you've never been taught how to do that you don't so you just keep trying to have sex keep trying to have fun but the feelings are dying it's not releasing the same oxytocin and so the relationship is designed to start there but it's designed then to move to the cortex which is the thinking part of the brain which then releases all of the serotonin that comes through safety through connection through acceptance wow and that's through building a life working through issues resolving problems really
respecting trusting each other that takes a lot of work that takes time and most people from complex trauma are scared to death to go there so the sex is just or the that that intimate connection up top is just like a fuse kind of exactly and then the other part is like a fire exactly yeah man I just yeah and but most triy with complex trauma I just think I can live up here in the fuse yeah I'm a Fus monkey I'm up here yeah and that's going to be great it just never satisfied yeah
never and then it's yeah I just and then the second piece to me is what comes out of complex trauma are you familiar with the term gaslighting yeah but what does it mean I always hear people say it but I'm just too bored just too lazy to look it up I think so if Dad is angry instead of him being honest and saying I'm sorry I'm having a bad day you didn't do anything wrong it's all on me he goes you're a bad kid it's all your fault that's God lighting he's twisting it and making
you believe a lie and so what happens in complex trauma is constant gaslighting of a child so that whenever any parent or authority is having a bad emotion the child has made to feel it's their responsibility to fix that emotion no it's not they can't fix their dad's anger only dad can fix his own anger but they're made to feel if they just did more chores if they weren't making noise if they were more agreeable more obedient then Dad would never get angry but Dad always gets angry but you keep believing the gaslighting LIE yeah
so now when you go into relationship soon as your spous is a little bit sad what did I do wrong oh maybe I should do something here maybe I should do this you still take responsibility for everybody else's emotions and that sets up relationships to be codependent for
