The Race To 270 Genetic Tests! - Reptile Genetics Weekly Ep 82

hi this is Dr Ben moral welcome to episode 82 of reptile genetics weekly once again glad to have you here uh crazy day with all the uh voting and stuff that's going on it's nice that that's finally going to be over and not so dang many ads about that and people talking about that I'm excited I'm hopeful that uh we don't have to listen to a bunch more drama with that but I guess we'll find out but at least the voting will be over um but anyway glad you're here to uh see what our race

to 270 uh genetic tests will be and uh see where we're at on that um for sample updates uh we have as has been for quite a while actually a good chunk of the year now uh we have fast tests going out every day pretty much every work day and so your one to two business days turn around once we get your sample in the lab in most cases and sex determination is three to five business days for ball pythons and clubd and then uh I finally do have some fairly uh concrete dates for the

next panel run um so we should get the results um Mid early to mid next week and then by the end of the week so we're looking at about a week and a half from now um we should have the next panel results so I know there's a bunch of people on that now that baby season's slowing down and moving out of that um we we to be able to keep the costs uh cost effective we have to batch them and so now that uh the samples coming in or slowing down a little and that

makes it so that the the panel tests will take a little bit longer so we were doing them closer to like three to five weeks it might be more like four to six weeks um for the next little while um but you never know we do have a uh special going on in November so if we have a bunch of extra samples come in this month maybe this next one will be a little faster um but yeah we'll we'll talk about that in just a second as well um yeah I think that's all I have

right now Kayla how are you doing hey Ben I'm doing good uh had a very eventful weekend got tackled by a by a black vulture um I uh not many people can say that it's true uh I I'll I'll have to pull up a v message me if you want the video it's pretty funny um not a wild one he was he was excited about his pumpkin and I was too close to it and he said no it's my pumpkin and did what black vulture is do which is tackle their people um so um yeah

know that that was a thing um I cracked a rib by coughing which was very an experience um I've had rib problems a couple times I was no joke excuse me it is humbling um yeah know it's literally just like I've been coughing for so long and stressing those same same muscles I was standing in the one of the uh in the mamal room at work and just a light cough kind of like what I just did and I felt a felt and heard a crack near one of my store spots and I felt just

like a little just a little dose of adrenaline and I was like did that really just happen did I really just do that the first bone I've ever broken is done in the least cool way ever like not like you know breaking an ankle while doing like a kickflip or sick kickflip or something you know like yeah it's crazy Saturday sucked but it didn't because you know the day after is where you're really going to be in pain like I was laughing on Friday about it like yeah this is my life it's fine it's hilarious

honestly and then Saturday I wake up and I'm like Jimmy this is a lot less funny help me out of bed um so that was fun and you laugh or cough or sneeze or anything it just feel like stabbing you m I went to work the next day and they were like I'm so sorry is there anything I could do I'm like no it's fine I'm on pain meds it only hurts when I breathe you know um but it that didn't stop me from you know when we spotted this massive black racer outside the center

uh uh it didn't stop me from jumping out of my seat and chasing it down this rib be darn I'd be darn I will not be slowed down and sadly the racer got away no pictures no anything um but oh it was a chunk it had to have been like four foot long which is big for a racer um and oh so pretty and very spicy suckers oh yeah they are I got like like this far away from it and it zipped out um and we were like my co-workers were helping me they were like

I don't know how to grab a wild snake but I'll help you like poke a stick to get it out from under the shed and uh it yeah know Zoom pass and it was gone didn't see it see it again but oh so pretty um it was my lifer too so at least I got at least I got my lifer black racer so um that was good uh I don't think there was anything else CRA too crazy this weekend um those were those were the main ones though so it's um so I'm feeling a lot

better than I did Saturday and we're uh moving right along uh good yeah so let's get some business stuff out of the way um right now is an amazing time to uh get stuff off of morph Market um stuff specifically being shed tests and morph tests and sex determination tests um because morph Market is um giving you 25% off all shed tests all November long um so definitely want to take advantage of that uh it's really nice of them to you know partner up with us and to do this so um you can buy them

in you can buy them now and then use them later on so this is like the perfect time um to buy them before you get next year's clutches out yes yeah it's they they will never go bad so you can pay for them now and get a really good discount and use them in four months or six months or in a year or whatever and yeah it's a great way that like we've talked about before this is something to help us kind of pay the bills through the slower months and as a thank you to

those of you that are willing to prepay you know we'll happily give you a better deal so jump on it while you can yeah but um and of course we have our bit about bulk discounts in general um let's so you know you've seen we've played these before but if you really want to want to see like how steep of a discount you can get for buying shed test in bulk you can um get a quote from us by emailing Sean rare genen Inc Gmail um it's like especially with CD sex determination if you're expecting

you know several clutch as of babies like corn snakes or Hogs uh next year you can get them down to as low as $15 per test uh and you know that will save you the uh the popping and wriggling and Tiny biting and musk flinging it can save you the stress so um definitely something to look into um and uh did I miss anything on that Ben I would just say it's even better to send that quote for a bulk order to Shawn during November because yeah you already know you're at least going to get

25% off and if you have enough numbers coming um he'll likely be able to do even better than that so so this is time to do it this a great time to do it definitely all right so that's a really nice thing um and we're actually uh gonna be at the St Louis NBC show um St Louis St Louis how did the locals say it someone help um but we're going to be there so at the St Charles Convention Center Shawn will be there um so you can catch up with him uh definitely hand him

sheds whether that is you know tests that you've ordered or if you have samples that you want to help us out with for future uh research runs um we'll be taking them there and also Sean he'll he'll do a better job than I did those of you that went to shows I was the only one there sorry I didn't do a very good job of getting your your test run quickly Sean will do a better job of that because he take it back the the Texas lab is the one we do stuff fast I I

get stuff done here but he gets it done fast there so oh yeah Sean's got the yeah yes that that would be good the other thing is he will have at least shirts I don't know if he'll have anything else but he'll at least have shirts there and they're you know specifically for 2024 they'll have the morphs that that came out you know over the the year previous and so next year he was kind of joking we might actually have to do 2025 a shirt and 2025 B shirt because we'll likely have a whole bunch

more next year oh man I haven't even seen the design so I'm excited to see how those look yeah it's pretty cool it's similar to the one we had the first year but it's got more morphs on it because we have more tests come out so oh exciting awesome well sound off in the comments if you're G to be at the St Louis show this weekend yes um so the race to 227 genetic tests so then uh what is uh why two did I say 207 I meant 270 genetic tests whatever I said words are

hard what is your uh what's the thought process between 270 tests oh just because of the the voting tonight you hear all of the stuff about you know who's gonna get to 270 so oh oh this isar 270 oh got you I actually I didn't catch that that's cute I like that awesome so that's why we we uh you know we're we're hopeful we can get into the couple hundred tests um 270 might take a little while but I I think once we get things flowing in other species some of the tests will come a

lot faster so we're getting better at it faster at it we'll we'll likely uh kind of like the last batch of new tests we had 10 at a time that'll probably be more likely what will happen when we do release stuff it'll be like five to 10 or a dozen or something like that at a time um with Monsoon since we've put so much work into it and worked with other people that's one that we're very close and we talked a little bit about in a Show recently and did a post about it you know

that one is 98% correct that one is really really good uh but it's not perfect we know that it makes some bad calls we had both one that I ran and one that Charlie ran that uh were clearly not visual monsoons and shouldn't have been um um but they tested homozygous so we know that test is not perfect but that was two there's one other one that tested incorrectly so that was three out of like 215 or 220 um so we're we're all still working on getting that just that last little bit uh we know

for sure we're in the right region now so we got to find the right mutation and get that test done but that's one that we might release on its own because so many people have been waiting for that for so long oh yeah but other than that we we'll probably release five to 10 or 12 at a time something like that for the others awesome uh so how is Monarch looking Monarch is still stuck at the kind of 80 to 90% correct we do have a test that's right a good chunk of the time but

it's I haven't been able to improve that in a while um I have focused more on Monsoon than Monarch uh but I I will have a whole bunch more data coming here soon uh that Monarch will be a part of so so yeah we are we are gonna sometime soon we're going to do an episode where we really go in depth um about that process what it's like when we say you know oh we think we're really close and then we end up saying ah never mind it's GNA be a while or we say where

we think we're close like five or six times and keep failing um we're we're going to kind of give you guys a detailed uh idea of of that process what it's like and give you an idea so you you don't think that we just suck at our jobs or we're crazy we're Liars or we really are working hard and trying our best this is just how this kind of test development goes you it's an iterative process and sometimes you're on a path that looks really good and then you find out it's a dead end and

you got to go back to the very beginning again and and sometimes you got to do that 70 time well not 70 we haven't done that yet but we're with Monsoon and Monarch we're probably on like uh five or six something like that so rounds of and each round costs money and time and focus and anyway so yeah we'll we'll do a whole episode where we'll go into some specific numbers what it's like and you know how often we uh get new tests and then find out there's more than one mutation like with yellow belly

and we know for sure with special now and stuff like that and so anyway there's a lot of cool detail we'll go into to in that episode in in more I'm looking forward to it yeah um so where are we sitting with confusion so confusion we know we're in the right area because we do have an acid test that works well but the confusion test is is also in that like 70 to 85 I think that one's over 80% uh the test that I have for that I actually have two different tests for confusion but

both of them are are only in that like 80% range so okay that one also like Monsoon or Monarch I'll have more data um in that big chunk of data I have coming so okay and what about red strip so we have that test but why what's so there's an update going on there what's what's the situation yeah so with red stripe what we think we're seeing the uh the feedback we're getting and thanks once again to all of you for using testing and sending in sheds and then when we give you feedback back re

feedback I don't know what you call that but we say hey can you send me the sire and the dam or you know blah blah blah or help us kind of Trace lineages to figure out where so the the thing that we see is some every once in a while we'll have a red stripe like in a panel or from a breeding like that the breeder like hey from from these babies this one has to be a red stripe but it's testing negative so there's just some times where it seems very clear that that animal

this is including some that Justin kabela has and some other people that you know I've seen a lot of red stripes so like you know this one has to be and and we've had Justin send us several that he knows for sure are and then a few of those have popped negative and so we've kind of figured out it it's likely there's a second mutation that also causes that red stripe look which we know now is is not an uncommon thing that happens a lot it happened with yellow belly and with ultramel and with uh

for sure with special and yeah you know many many more that uh we we'll talk about some others here in a second too we'll be doing updates on but yeah it seems to be a fairly common thing and so the interesting thing with red straping we just talked about confusion um so far in breedings where people have bred a confusion red stripe or acid red stripe to something it's acting like super and so we're pretty confident and what we're seeing in the tests that we have they're fairly close to each other so so it it

may be like banana and the sex determining region in ball pythons where 96% of the time they'll travel together or it may be closer to 100% or it might be at like you know 85% we don't know but they seem to be close enough that they they travel together and I guess they could even be in the same gene like yellow belly and asphalt and gravel and all of them but but we'll see we we don't know for sure yet but they are close enough there seems to be some it's called linkage disequilibrium there seems

to be some linkage between red stripe and then confusion and acid and so we're we're playing with that and another one that I'll I'll have more data on in the next week or two and you know it could be that that data comes through I'm like oh this has got to be it and it works well and you know in a couple weeks we have more information or it could be that it's not helpful at all and we got to sequence more so but yeah we're we're working on those and and making progress that'll be

exciting to see um so what about black pastel I know there's uh some been some stuff going on there too yeah so with black pastel you know we we knew that cinnamon looks similar sometimes people aren't totally sure whether they have a cinnamon or a black pastel and our black pastel test is definitely negative for any cinnamons I've run several from different people it's always negative so cinnamon is definitely a different mutation and it does look a little different um so that's not surprising um but uh we did come out with a with a Barnhart

black pastel test and we still have some animals that um especially in Canada the feedback we got from Canada their main line of black pastel up there tests negative for for our black pastel test and then for us we have some people they'll send the picture like hey yeah this definitely looks like it is a black pastel but it tests negative for our black pastel and for Barnhart black pastel so there seems to be at least three different black pastels and then you have cinnamon on top of that so that's four different ones that look

very similar but there is at least four different mutations and we could find out there's even more maybe we find that third black pastel line and then we still have some that come back every once in a while negative it could be another mutation you know so so anyway it's a it's something that we we can't make that progress without you all helping us and so we're very thankful for people that let us know hey this test doesn't make sense that's one of the biggest reasons why the panels are such a a benefit because sometimes

people send something in that they know is a black pastel clown and it tests you know and they're testing it for poset hypo and poset you know this and that and the other but it comes up negative and they say Hey you know here's the picture it has to be a black pastel we're so thankful that people do that because that's what helps us key in and know all right there's more work to do on Black pastel so so any of you that have had a a black pastel or red strap we just talked about

that you're pretty confident it's there but it tested negative um just know we are working on updating those and each month that goes by we'll know a little more and as soon as we know something for sure we will definitely let you all know man so much going on and just what it's it's so funny where we think we have something locked down and then you know these snake makes genetics decide to throw us a curveball um you know even if you're not the one hatching the eggs it's going to happen so yeah all right

so what about special adding on to the same line of updating these curve balls yeah so this is another one that we'll be updating um we have enough from Twin City reptiles for their TCR line of special that definitely does test negative for our special test which is the one that Dr sadell found and I'm pretty certain any anyone doing tests is using that same test um but the TCR is definitely test negative it's a different mutation uh obviously look similar but a little different in some of the combos um and then there's another line

called the Noco line or Northern Colorado um reptile Northern Colorado or NOCO uh reptiles had that line what we don't know is if it's the same as TCR or if it's a third one uh we just know that both of those lines when when we've gotten those those tests negative for the current special test so they're not like really prevalent in in our U at least US population these two other lines but the few individuals we have definitely do test negative and so we uh we are working to sequence those individuals multiple individuals for both

of those lines TCR and NOCO to be able to update that be able to say hey here's a second line a second test that covers both Noco and TCR or maybe we'll have to say hey here's special here's NOA special and here's TCR special we'll we'll find out over the next month or two probably yeah and special is part of the Blue-Eyed Lucy complex right okay that's what I thought um that complex these complexes keep having more and more things added on to them it seems yeah it can get complicated um so once again going

into the yellow belly complex we have asphalt yes so we've had a couple of customers at least um with very frustrating asphalt results where we've tested and retested and you know ask for sire down all this kind of stuff and it just really does test negative even though the animal should be an asphalt um I've had some people send in uh I think I've had three different uh reptile creation line asphalt or RC asphalt thank you for those those of you that have sent those in and in every case when they've sent those RK line

asphalts they test negative by the test that I use they use it in Canada they use it in Europe like it's the test that that Dr sadell published um but there seems to be at least one other line of asphalt also and once again it's not really prevalent in the United States so the chances that if you have asphalts that yours came from that line is not very high but it is something to keep in mind that it's a possibility and it's something we want to be able to make sure we can test for for

our customers um so we'll we'll hopefully have that as well in the next month or two we'll be doing some sequencing on those three individuals that I have and hopefully we can find it since it should be you know near the other yellow belly complex animals we know where to be looking and so hopefully we'll nail that down very cool it's kind of like the Ultram melb of of the asphalt Gene I guess yeah yep yeah all right so high-intensity OD um how is a test for that going yes so I got to talk with

Chris hernon and with uh West uh of muscles and Geeks reptiles uh and quite a bit at at Tinley about this and it seems like what's happening is the high OD line does test the same as OD but clearly there's something different that amps those animals up um so what we are doing we're collecting even more both Chris and Wes gave us a whole bunch of samples but then some other people that have heard us talk about it on here have also sent in you know even if you have only an animal or two if

you want to send it in let us know um whether it's a high OD or super high OD or what the pairing was or who it came from or if you produced it just as much information as you can um but we're continuously sequencing more and more of these so it's it's kind of a a more complicated thing to find I'm assuming that what we'll eventually find is there's a secondary mutation close by in the ones that are super OD you know High Odes I mean um those High Odes have a secondary mutation that kind

of amps that up but we don't know for sure um so we're going to do it's it's going to take more sequencing than finding OD originally we're going to have to do even more sequencing and and hopefully be able to find that secondary mutation um but you know it we we may not ever be able to or it might be really easy and we'll find it in a month or two we'll see hopefully we can that's they do look really nice I do like a good IOD yeah um and so lace and white lace yeah

so we got a whole bunch of samples uh Justin really focused Justin Kela really focused and and pulled a whole bunch he said he specifically pulled ones that he is confident are white lace or confident are lace um animals like the in the lace project one of the biggest difficulties is that sometimes when you hatch out babies where they're not coming from a white lace um you don't know for sure if it's a lace breeding you don't know for sure which ones have lace and which ones don't and as they kind right when they hatch

out versus after two or three sheds versus after a year or two um it can be more or less difficult to kind of make those calls um so so we do have a whole bunch going to sequencing so it's going to take a little while um for us to get all of that data back um so it's probably at least a couple of months out uh before we'll get a big batch of data for lace but it's very likely that when we do get that that we'll be able to nail it down because we've had

a concerted effort Justin especially but then some other people have as well and once again thank you all that are sending sheds in you you are the ones that make this possible yes they are um and so Mandarin how are how are we looking with that the mandrin is right there with lace um Justin Kela collected a whole bunch of them that he knows for certain whether they're Mandarin or super Mandarin um so that's really good really important to have samples that we have high confidence have been identified correctly Mandarin is in the same boat

sometimes it's a little difficult to know for sure what you have um so so that's also going to be in the same boat uh with lace it's going to be at least a couple months but we are working on it and uh we've got a good batch of samples coming um coming through and so we're excited about that awesome so zebra zebra could pop loose any day I don't have like a you know a 70 or 80% test yet um but I do have a decent location and that's another one in the next week or

two I'll get more data on and it it could pop loose or it could be one that I gotta work on more so so we'll see on that one but it's hopefully coming soon hope so I've got a soft spot for zebras like I was looking for photos to pull um uh for you know so we could give examples and oh my gosh the combos it makes are so pretty yeah this snake is just like oh amazing gold gold star Adam jesla repes um so uh GCR and MJ athic which this one is the same

boat as Monsoon this one we have a test that is correct 98% of the freaking time unfortunately there are in this case there were three two or three samples that from everything that I know and that the Breeders knew there was no aanc lineage they were ones I picked as NE no negatives to to run as part of the validation so when I'm validating a new test I have to run homozygous animals so in this case you know actual visual GCR Andor MJS anics um then I also run known heads and then I also run

known negatives because I need to make sure the test works on all three of those I need to make sure if someone send a a shed in from a CET clutch that's negative that it the test will say negative and if it is an actual hat that the test will say hat um so so those negatives are just as important people probably think a lot about you know how many homozygous and heterozygous ones did you run but it's actually just as important if not more important to make sure that the negatives are called negative and

so the problem the only problem that I've seen so far with GCR and MJ is where a animal two or three animals that were from lineages that there's no known aanc anything and shouldn't have been any but they tested as hats um so that's that's concerning we don't yes that is um so it's it's really dang close obviously you know again that was another close to 200 and we only had you know a couple two yeah I can't remember for sure it was either two or three uh that were problems so there's like about 200

that were 100% correct there's just a couple that were wrong so so anyway that one's super close and hopefully we have it I will have more data specifically on GCR and MJ in the next week or two so there's a chance or we may have to go back to the drawing board but at least we know we're in a in a pretty specific region we know that that has to be the correct region all right um so stranger stranger is one that also could pop loose um I'll have more data in the next week week

or two um we have a not as specific a region as Monsoon and and GCR and MJ um but we do have a little bit broader region where we know it has to be in there um so it's it's looking good but you know it could pop loose in the next week or two or it could take another round of sequencing but um it's it's one that we have made some significant progress on awesome now mahogany how is that looking that one's right in the same boat as stranger that one could pop loose um in

the next week or two I'll have more data on that one too so lots of good stuff coming yeah lots of good stuff coming in the next week or two and then there's GNA be kind of another big batch in in about a month or two when I get another um big run of sequencing new stuff coming through but mahogany and stranger are both in the the one to two week range I have a chance of hitting them all right because you do a research run when whenever you also do the panel runs right at

least sometimes we do uh in addition to that yeah we're doing lots lots of these are all thou thousands of dollars runs um yeah there Lots we we definitely are putting a lot but right back into everything we're doing to make more T we it our goal may not necessarily literally be the the 270 like in the next year but you know one 150 you know that that's I think something that we could reach by the end of 2025 so we're we're close to 50 now but I think we'll be able to find them a

lot faster and in other species and stuff like that so so it's going to be a fun 2025 is going to be a lot different ride than 2024 and 2023 have been I'm excited so how about Carmel albino caramel caramel however you pronounce it so I've had many people request a test for caramel especially people that have Ultram Mals and uh they're concerned that there's some caramel albino mixed in for those of you that that aren't familiar um the caramels are famous for having some kinking problems and then also the females are not able to

reproduce oh wow so so it's a significant issue they're they're beautiful and it's really really unfortunate um one of the two the first year there were ball python combos made one was the Bumblebee and one was a caramel albino with a hypo and they called it a caramel glow it's it's been a part of ball python breeding for a long time but people have bred away from it but every once in a while someone working with ultramel will pop out of caramel and have some problems and so lots of breeders have asked me to make

a caramel test and then I say okay great give me some known caramels as samples to be able to develop the test and for for a long time nobody ever actually gave me anything but I did finally get a decent amount I think it's like about a dozen so I don't know for sure if we'll get it but and this is kind of in the more one to two month range when we get more uh big batch of of data from sequencing in a month or two um that we hopefully can if we get lucky

we can find that and then that would be a test for you know people that have ultral or or other animals that come from background where there were some caramels in that line that you could use that test to essentially breed that out of your population and so we're we're working on that uh thank very very thankful to those of you when that test does come you all are definitely going to hear who who helped make it happen as long as they're cool with me letting people know some people that have caramels don't want people

to know they have caramels because they don't want people to be worried that they're going to end up getting something so but anyway we're thankful that that we have some and any of you listening if you have some caramels or know somebody that has some known caramels um we could definitely use more sheds to to make that test there you go all right um oh phone and so next let's talk about non-ball python species so our our Bloods our retics our BMS oh my yes yeah so we in 2025 we expect to be able to

develop tests and and these other python species at least these three um I do have some carpet python especially like aanc carpets we're doing a lot of aanc in other species obviously we've done it in ball python so we have it coming in some other species too other one that I've got some I've got some blackheaded python aanc blackheaded pythons I think I might even have some albino and some albino and all of python so some of the even less common uh python species I've got samples going um but Bloods rexs and BMS we we

should have multiple tests in 2025 oh that's awesome um any sex determination tests for them as well yeah yeah we're we're working on that also that's been more complicated with all of colubrids we were able to find tests that were fairly General and and it wasn't too hard to figure out how to do the vast majority we obviously haven't tested every colubrid known when someone sends a species that's where we always ask what species it is yeah they send one in we haven't tested we let them know hey we haven't done this one before um

so we'd love to if you have a known male and female to send as well we'll run those and make sure our tests work on that but but yeah we uh definitely would like to De develop those in in pythons the clue brids it was easy to find general ones that that covered several species several Genera uh but with Pythons the ball python one doesn't work on any other python species and we've found out in Melia especially that's the the green tree pythons and the carpet pythons their set chromosomes are very different from all other

python species all other gener outside of Melia so so the sex chromosomes in pythons seem to be much more variable than what we saw in clubd so it's it's going to take a more work for each species of python than than we had to do for all the clue brids fair enough I think evolutionarily speaking um I know that I'm pretty sure pythons and boas are a more basil um lineage of snakes and so I wonder if the fact that their sex chromosomes are so wacky has something to do with the fact that they've just

they're just uh older than say some I don't know some colubrids and Vipers and what have you that's just me spitballing a random thought though so it may have nothing to do with it um I know that there's a paper about Morelia pythons coming out as well at some point but we hope so there're supposed to be fingers crossed because I want to read that too yeah so uh side tangent onward uh let's go to um corns Hogs boas indigos and maybe even some lizards yes yeah so in 20 25 we should be able to

have at least some tests in in all of these groups as well and and hopefully at least a couple of lizard species we've always been interested in blue tongues and monitors and heloderma and you know some of the really common ones like uh crusted geckos and you know there's many things we would love to be working on um but we've got to get through um some more ball python tests and and kind of break into a few new species but I think once we get all of that smoothly rolling it will make it even easier

to pick up other new species and get a few more developed so that's that's why we're thinking that uh 2025 we should have a lot more tests coming awesome um and for those of you who are who are you know sitting back like come on it's always the ball pythons ball pythons are help paying the bills for these other tests um because it's really expensive to you know sequence these and to run these different things so um that's the main reason why we're well and also there's a huge demand for it so um you know

keeping the the business solvent while also solvent is the correct word right yeah um keeping the business solvent in addition to going down these routes of species that we also really really want to see who maybe aren't on every single table at an expo um being a reptile keeper and breeder for over 20 years that's what I want the most is to develop tests that help lots of other breeders and Keepers and so the the the ball python one there's so much interest and and money in that that that helps us to be able to

learn first of all some of it's learning you know we're learning how to find new mutations faster and better and more efficiently and then also to know where to look and things like that so so not only is is the ball python work helping to pay the bills to be able to do other species but it's also um helping us learn how to do it so we can do it more efficiently so when tests come out in other species they're going to be less expensive we're not going to go back to you know charging $65

a test uh more than likely when these new species when tests come out for them they can be more in line with you know after we've dropped the ball python prices a time or two or whatever it ends up being um those will be able to come in at a similar level and not have to pay as much as as we did early on and you know that that is you know a big part of it is it's it's great to make things cost effective and cheap and all that but if you make it too

cheap and your business goes out then that doesn't help your customer at all yeah you go out of business then we don't have anything to help you with um and just hope that someone else does an okay job but uh we would not be able to help so yeah that's a big part of it is making sure people understand what we're doing and how it can help them and then also to have enough money coming through that we can do other side projects and things and get them going and you know if if at the

end of 2025 if we have as many tests in other species as we do in ball pythons you we may only have three or four or five in one species and seven or eight in another species but if we can get you know similar numbers might be more species many more species but a similar number then that helps our volume that would essentially double our volume if if things were linear um and then that makes it so we can do everything cheaper whether it's sex determination or another new morph test um if we can double

our volume coming through by the end of 2025 because we have twice as many tests and several new species um then that makes it so we can get those tests done for you at a cheaper price and that's that's what we're hoping for yeah all right so this week's shed donor shout out is from is a McLure Hatchery they have sent it sent in sheds that have helped us develop new tests and we're very grateful so we wanted to make sure that you guys uh got a chance to um check them out uh they have

really nice photos on their Instagram of you know eggs you've got them uh candling some of their some little growing embryos there um lots of pretty ball pythons um and they're also on Tik Tok so if you're on there and you like to follow people who uh do snake stuff they're definitely someone to check out that's McLure Hatchery and beautiful animals and thank you once again for sending in sheds they that's like we've said many many times on the show even this show today that's literally why we can do what we're doing is because of

people sending in sheds and letting us know what it is and then we put that all together and and figure out new tests definitely um and uh on their um on their bio there they said that uh it looks like they're actually one of our neighbors they're not too far away in North Carolina it looks like jaguar is one of their main projects so if you're in a Jaguar they'll definitely be somebody to follow yes yeah they did send in some Jaguar sheds yeah well that yep that makes sense yeah awesome all right so I

think that's everything we got for today so um if you liked if you like this you know General Roundup of where we are with the more popular morphs um you know definitely let us know um oh weird the formatting on my on the like on the Scot all wacky I don't know how but whatever it's fine um I guess you had to upload a different way this time right that's true well you know that's okay um you know if it wants to be creative who am I to stop it uh so uh everybody make sure

you like comment subscribe um it tells the algorithm that we're cool and that you know other people should watch our stuff especially if they're interested in snakes and uh genetic testing so um yeah thank you guys and and Spen we got anything before we call today no that's it thanks thanks again for watching and we'll be back again next week all right thanks guys don't forget to go out and vote if you in the US um catch you later outro in three two one [Music]