okay and we are live welcome back everybody here to man after God and we have a very special guest um DrRoy verosa and he's someone that I really look up to um you know admiring you over the years you know what everything he's been doing and will you share a little bit about uh your ministry in the Apollo project and the the teachings and seminars that you have available all right okay so um after pastoring for 10 years in SIU in the Philippines an upshoot of my doctoral desert ation is uh how to develop and uh deliver expository sermons I found out in a survey in the year 2000 that uh 60% of Pastors in the Philippines have not been through formal theological education and so there's a great need to uh train them um most of these pastors you know churches are sprouting everywhere and we don't have enough trained leadership and they don't have the time to uh enroll in a seminary or Bible school or even have the resources to do that so those of us who have the trade should be the ones to go where they are and so that's what started it it's called the Apollo project it was launched in 200 2005 and so uh the Apollos project the name Apollos is taken from acts 18: 24-26 when Apollos was preaching and uh pril and Aila heard him heard yeah that's right heard him and they said something is not right something is incomplete in his sermon and so they trained him and so that's why it's called the Apollo project and so since 2005 we've been doing this uh in the Philippines uh every other week I would travel I got an invitation to go to Dubai to train Pastors in the Middle East in 2006 and so that started it uh the complication how to get a visa to go to these countries because with a Philippine passport it's not easy and so from Dubai I'm supposed to go to UK and then from UK I need to go to Spain that would be three visas to apply for and then uh somebody in my Bible study group the uh honorary cul of Canada said you know Pastor Roy if you're a Canadian passport holder you don't need to apply for this visas and so that's when uh he said why not fill up the forms and we'll take care of it and so we got approved in 2009 and so we're here in Canada based now in Canada since 2009 and that's a lot easier going from place to place on a Canadian passport right since 2009 we've been now to 40 countries wow and so conducting these seminars wow yeah and so from your experience Pastor Roy you said that that was a survey done in 2000 that's right do we have any idea what the numbers are today I don't have uh is that improved has it you know yeah I don't know I haven't uh checked the latest statistics for the Philippines at least but for sure with about almost 13 million Filipinos abroad and wherever they are churches are sprouting and so there's a great need to really train leaders in this area yeah and and what have you noticed you know traveling to 40 different countries countries I'm sure a lot of leaders and and pastors and Elders have given you feedback board of directors what what have you noticed in terms of their feedback when you know they're they're go they go through the the full seminar Yeah so basically we have three levels in the seminar we have level one is hermeneutics level two is exegesis and then level three is homiletics and so the the the feedback that I'm getting is that you know sometimes when you read western books about this you know from Seminary books it's so hard for them to really understand it but then what we did is to simplify it and try for streamline it so that they're able to see the connection in fact uh with the uh in Myanmar I I I've been going to Myanmar and training burmish pastors there the principal of the uh Bible school who translated my uh material into bouris he graduated from a seminary in India and he he said I didn't know the connection between hermeneutics and exg say because it was studied separately and so he didn't see the connection until we had a seminar so things like that I think uh what it's helping how it's helping people is just seeing how it has to be understood in a simple way layman's terms and so with a lot of uh visuals and so it's easier for people to absorb mhm what is the importance of that you know in in terms of and in that order as well right hermeneutics exog Jesus htics and how one kind of compounds onto the other and then you'll be able to go to the homiletics and actually preaching the word yeah why is that so important um why can't someone just you know go into the Bible and start reading it and start interpreting interpreting themselves and start you know teaching a Bible study or you know pastoring a church or so on so forth what's why why is that so important to go through these yeah the the the picture I I would present people is that T is like a recipe all right you need to have the right recipe no nobody gets healthy by just memorizing recipe so you have to put the ingredients together in the right amounts and then once uh we put that together when you have the right recipe then you do the actual baking and that's the exegesis the actual baking is the ex jesis and then once it's cooked that's what you serve for htics so can you imagine if you're serving on Sunday morning preaching and you have the wrong recipe and so that that's that's the main issue there and so they need to understand what at least just the basic hermeneutical principles so that uh when they read the word of God they'll be able to understand it the way it was intended by the original writer to the original audience before you bring it to your modern audience MH and so that's that's the a sequence there right yeah and then bringing it to the modern audience now now we can extrapolate the lesson the original lesson that was and now we can relate it to our day and that's right yeah and I noticed that from your sermons there it goes through that pattern right for someone you know just learning how to teach or or lead a Bible study it may be you know sometimes overwhelming like okay we'll have to go through this entire process how you know oh I I could never teach the Bible or I could never lead a Bible study because it's just it seems like a lot of work um what would you say to someone who has a you know a desire to lead a Bible study or maybe uh plant a church and you know there is this process of getting the ingredients you know cooking it and then feeding it right and in that proper order so that you're not just you never go to a restaurant and you don't just they just the chef just gives you the recipe right just raw right um what would you say to someone you know wanting to go through that process but just being overwhelmed by it like like even someone watching right now just listening to it um wow that seems like so complicated um what would you say to someone who has a desire but maybe is overwhelmed by just even the idea of that well actually when we try to break it down it's actually uh enough for people to absorb like if you're writing a letter to somebody then obviously uh you're using a grammar you're using English or Tagalog and so you need to have a basic knowledge of that uh of that language that you're using I need to find out where you're coming from I need to find out your background the historical background why you said that what were some of the issues that you that uh you're confronted with why you wrote that letter so these are the basic backgrounds you know know so you need to find out basically the historical background why that letter was written you need to find out some grammatical rules you know why you CH why you chose that word in the particular why the uh arrangement of those words and then maybe some cultural issues there might be some cultural uh issues that I may not be aware of that uh uh is assumed in that particular letter and so again these are just a common sense in a way uh rules but uh once you get to know it it becomes second nature you know you begin to see oh so that's that's why he wrote that letter and so again of course there's I mean praise God we are in a generation where there's so much information in the internet there's so much uh so many commentaries available uh it helps a lot you know when you try to before I have to accumulate so many books you know for the background of this book and and right now it's just all electronic it's just there it's just that at the uh click of your mouse you can already see the background there m and so um it has helped a lot you know with all these resources that are available to us today MH the internet has so much resources and let's say you know someone wants to to dig into it right to dig into the background and to do a proper exeresis on it and to really find out what the word of God is saying um through that text but there's so much information out there and from so many different denominations also right so there's some who are you know maybe it's a a commentary by a presbyterian preacher or one by a Pentecostal preacher or one by a calvinist or one by an Armenian um how would you suggest going about that if there there's so many resources out there yeah um would you suggest someone just you know stay in their Lane like if they're going to a a Pentecostal church just just look at uh Pentecostal commentaries and you know um spirit-led commentaries or you recommend you know what get out of your comfort zone um see what the other side is saying um these are in-house discussions uh do you see that as something that is healthy for a follower of Jesus Christ to to to wrestle theologically even even if they're minor minor doctrines not not major doctrines but wrestling even with the minors that's right yeah I mean I always suggest a comparative study uh like for example just choosing the uh translation of the Bible it's always good to have at least four translations you know if you can have a new King James version you can have a New American Standard Bible if you can have ESV the English Standard uh version and then maybe the NLT the new uh living new New Living Translation this would be good uh uh study already just to compare because there will be some changes minor changes but uh sometimes when you come up with a Doctrine it's always good to base it not just on one translation but comparison of all these other translations and then one thing good uh right now is that uh without even knowing Greek and Hebrew there are a lot of uh software you know that's available where you can study it in the original language um and so it's all there and so again I'm not afraid to read from different sources or different uh denominational uh backgrounds because the best way is to really compare it you know comp which which for you is more uh uh more consistent with the text and so but then again I I suppose that when it comes to uh some doctrinal stand um then that's the that's the problem when you come across you know uh something that is different from where you're coming from if you make that jump from one uh teaching to another how will that affect you uh as a pastor if you're tied to a certain denomination so again I I understand that there are those issues but we just have to be honest and allow the Bible to speak for itself because there's no one denomination that has all the theology 100% And so we need to really seek the Holy Spirit and really ask for guidance and then our level of Faith this is what I can absorb right now this what I can accept right now and so again that that uh that kind of mindset right right and in terms of your journey um you know there's there's a lot will that will go into Ministry um maybe be a La leader or a board or an elder or Deacon um there's some will take on you know pastoral uh vocation what compelled you in your journey what led you to go all the way from you know pastoral leadership to even you know educationally going all the way and doing your doctorates um you know what what what has driven you um to just continue to study at such a depth yeah well uh I came to know the Lord at the age of 17 I was a first cheer in my civil engineering course and uh in those five years of Engineering in the Philippines I was involved with The Navigators and this is a uh campus ministry and so uh I really enjoyed uh studying the Bible I didn't I never entertained the thought of uh becoming a pastor what I've always wanted is to teach but then uh I don't have the resources to go to Seminary but then the church were uh my wife and I were involved in offered to us uh the pastorate and sending us to Seminary and I said wow that's an offer I cannot uh refuse I can go to Seminary and they'll pay for it but then I need to come back as a pastor and so I said before I make that decision I I want to be experienced pastoring first for one year if uh God really has something there for me so I pastored for a year and then after that one year I said okay we'll go for it so I went to a seminary for 3 years years took um took up my um master of biblical studies and so as a repayment I uh pastored the church for 3 years as well and so that 3 years uh you know it was uh done again for another 3 years and then I went to the US for my doctoral studies and then I went back and then 3 years and then after that after 10 years of pastoring I said uh I need to shift now to my actual calling I believe it's more on teaching and that's when I uh launched this a Ministry called the Apollo project in 2005 wow that's a really interesting you know Journey that you've been through how I guess God really wanted you to go through all those studies and then the the kind of repayment for it right but but still from way back um knowing that well what I really want is to teach yeah for someone who is there right let's say you know someone your age um back then 20-year-old a 30-year-old who's considering going into Ministry and they know I want to serve God but I what capacity where should I be an evangelist should I be an apologist should I be a pastor should I be a missionary there's so much out there how did you ared to that in terms of okay well this is where God wants me to be is was it just a moment by moment thing for you where okay where do you want me to be right now Okay who wants me to be pastoring right now cuz well they're the ones who sent me to Seminary so I'm going to pay back yeah how has that those decisions been for you yeah after graduating and uh getting my license as a civil engineer I already wanted to serve full-time in the Christian work but my Bible study leader said no it's better for you to experience your profession first so that when you Minister you have you know you have background you know what they're going through so I work in the construction industry for three years and then uh I got an invitation from The Navigators to go full-time in the ministry and so after 3 years of uh civil engineering I went for the work in The Navigators uh leading Bible studies and uh inang professionals my first Ministry there was uh broadcasting we had a uh radio program in the Philippines called the discipleship hour and so then uh after getting married that's when we were moved to to ceu in uh central part of the Philippines and uh when I got involved in a small Church in a local church that's when I gravitated towards church work because they asked me to preach once a month and I just enjoyed doing it I just enjoyed the preparing the sermon and uh and I said wow this is really something that I really want to be doing but to be actually pastoring uh it's something I was not really excited about but anyway uh if I'll be training uh people especially training pastors I need to know what pastors have to go through and so I think the 10 years of pastoring has uh helped me at least get a uh uh an idea what pastors go through especially in terms of uh the preaching uh aspect aspect of it and so uh yeah so that's how it came about wow yeah now now now that you're equipping other pastors those those 10 years I'm sure are so valuable to be able to relate to what they're going through um instead of maybe preaching at them you're preaching with them when you're teaching them these things so in those in those 10 years pastoring what would you say is I mean what's different between okay I'm pastoring or I'm just teaching cuz you you know now you're not in an official pastoral role but you're a resource pastor and and you're teaching a lot of different churches a lot of different church leaders what is the difference in in in that capacity and in the capacity that you're in now well pastoring a church is more than just teaching it's more than just uh preaching I mean the administrative work that is involved the counseling the relationships with people and and the the planning and the vision casting and wow there's so much there and and my gift is is just limited my gift really is more just the teaching aspect of it and so uh you know as a pastor you have only so much time and there so many areas that you need to allocate time for and uh and yet the Sunday preaching is really the uh main Ministry that you have and if you don't have enough time for that it can be it can become so frustrating and so the preaching Ministry can be the most exciting but at the same it can be the most frustrating for pastors because of uh lack of time because uh you're facing so many issues I mean you're a father you're a husband you're a pastor you're a counselor you're an administrator in all of this and so uh and so now I can just uh Focus really on just developing materials and then uh uh training pastors on these uh different issues and so I'm really enjoying it because it's more streamlined and really aligned with uh what God has given me and that's in the area of teaching MH and do you find that you know in operating in that gift um and in discovering through pastoring for a decade did you discover you know the you know you're talking about there's so much administrative work and counseling did you discover that through that process that wow actually my my main gift is really you know teaching and um is is that a process that you went through through through that as well where I was like wow you know what I I really love this and this is where I really Excel but these things are are are very difficult for me or maybe I'm not as naturally um gifted in these yeah at the very start as I said uh my desire has always been teaching and so I always uh you know I try to coin this statement I'm a civil engineer by profession but I'm a Bible teacher by Obsession and so uh it's just really the the teaching aspect of it and so um yeah uh it's been there since the start uh um although again it helped to have 10 years of background in pastoring in the Philippines and three years here in Toronto pastoring here for 3 years as well but uh right now The Cutting Edge of my Ministry is really in the teaching aspect yeah going to where the need uh is right now and uh training people in that particular area MH and so I have different topics that uh can help pastors or uh church leaders uh at least have an as to what that issue is all about oh this is a question that uh I want to ask um especially how do you navigate the tension between maintaining faithfulness between the the biblical text and embracing the dynamic nature of the spiritual gifts in interpreting um in in the uh you know in in hermeneutics and exog Jesus uh and Faithfully delivering the word or is that just a false dichotomy that you know we see in the church today where you have okay faithfulness to the word yeah and then you have let's say on the far right you have okay we have to be faithful to the word and then let's just call the far left okay well we we just have to be led by the Holy Spirit where uh it's okay we don't have to be organized or anything we don't have to have any type of structure or order we can just be led by the Holy Spirit and you know God will speak to me and tell me what to do in in this situation right you have that kind of on on the far left let's say and on the far right you have no no the word is is enough we just need to stick to the word uh there's no new revelation coming in um the gifts have seized etc etc where is the balance for you there because you just faced a cataclysmic event in your life and has brought inspiration to so many like my my cousins were telling me about your story when we met I think it was I'm not sure if it was Thanksgiving or or before that another event in our family and he was talking about how you know you had stage four cancer um and you told the doctor I'm I'm a man of faith and I believe that I won't you rejected chemotherapy and so for someone to be teaching about expository preaching and proper exegesis and and hermeneutics and to to have such a grounded base in the word of God yeah but at the same time having the faith to say you know what if God is going to heal me he he is able and that if he does heal me then I will continue to serve him at stage four there's not a lot of people with with that much Faith MH um they might say it but encountered with that you've actually faced death itself mhh and it's almost as if you have said death where is your sting right um so how do you how do you see that and and the balance there yeah so uh again um first of all we need to realize that the holy spirit in the Bible they always go together they're not against each other yes and so the balance well balanced Christian is founded in the scriptures but he is filled with the spirit so to be filled with the spirit and but then founded in the scriptures so that's that's the kind of balance there the holy spirit will never tell you to do anything that will go against the word of God the word of God is your way to confirm if it's really from the spirit because it can be coming from just from your mind or from different voices and so you need to really be founded in the word of God and uh that's that's very essential especially during these times that uh we are in right now and um in terms of uh uh you know what uh I went through or going through the this year is a very significant year for me as I've uh because again when people talk about cancer it's almost like a death sentence already you know I remember last January this year when my urologist said that it's uh prostate cancer but then uh it has already metastasized it has already spread to your bones and so he said it's stage four already and um and then he said the word incurable this is now incurable and uh you know I was listening to him my wife was beside me and uh I know that only God is the last word I know doctors they mean well but they're limited by science that's all they know and um and so he said if you'll go through some uh treatments like chemo or ration we can extend your life maybe two to three years he said and so that's when I said uh well doc I'm I'm a man of faith I said uh I believe that God can work uh in a miraculous way and so uh later on when I talked to my oncologist I I said to him I don't want to go through Kimo I don't want to go through because again you can extend somebody's life the quantity to to three years but how about the quality you know what kind of effect I mean because in a way chemo and R these are toxic uh aute to this issue and besides science is still divided about the cancer and so there are some scientists who believe this is a genetic problem the others think it's a metabolic problem and so uh it's not really decided yet and they and so that's what I said um uh I really believe that if God still has a plan for my life is this purpose is not yet done God will extend my life and so that's when I said uh I won't go through Kimo but of course for others it work it's okay but I God has given me enough Faith to uh believe that uh he has work in my body in such a way that uh since January last year I started with my PSA count my prostate specific antigen count was 124. 5 the normal is only between 0 to 4 mine was so elevated 124. 5 but then last month uh when they took again my PSA count it's already down to 0.
02 wow and so again and uh I gained weight uh 12 kilos and uh if I went through Kimo I know I would lose weight I know I lose hair and all those uh um side effects but um again I'm just uh thanking the lord uh as long as you give me strength I'll continue to travel I'll continue to conduct seminar and so that's that's uh where I am right now wow yeah you know your your your your testimony of that has been such an inspiration to so many and people just seeing uh God working in that and uh God being Jehovah Rafa God being healer God being the great physician did your doctor have a reaction to it did they have a comment like were they wondering how this happened without any you know chemo and um did they have something to say Well they're very respectful I mean here in Canada you have to make your own decision of course but uh yeah my oncologist said 0. 02 is the threshold so I was doing an injection before this is a hormone injection once a month and now uh we shifted to once every six months because I reached the threshold of 0. 02 and so uh just last month I had my first injection for once every 6 months now so that makes it better for me to travel because before I mean this year whenever I travel I can only travel for three weeks because I need to be back here for the injection for the first week of the month so now I can space out again my travels uh like before covid my travels uh were one month abroad and one month here in Canada one month abroad one month here in Canada and so I can shift back to that uh pattern in my teaching calendar yeah that's incredible that's really incredible um you know through the process of that when when when finding that out you know when when learning about your uh was it the PSA PSA the PSA count and the doctor saying this is incurable this is stage for it's metastasized and the Chan is I'm sure maybe they ran you through statistics on you know this is the chance um what was your reaction to that spiritually um did you some would you know some might shake their fist to God right and say hey I've been serving you I'm serving you why did this happen but your reaction doesn't wasn't like that your reaction was well if God is going to give me your reaction was God is Sovereign that's right um did did it did it do something to your relationship with God did did it um did you have a realization did it somehow do something to your spiritual disciplines um what what how did that affect you and what was your response to the news of that to a doctor telling you yeah it's cable mhm again the first thing that came to my mind is uh only God has the last word I was seated there in the doctor's office and he was saying these things and in my mind I was saying only God is the last word but of course being respectful to my doctor uh that's what I said uh doc I'm a man of faith and I believe that God can work miracles and so God can work in the Supernatural and so um anyway I think it affected my wife more than it affected me uh listening to the diagnosis that he gave us but uh in my heart of hearts I was just saying to God lord if this is the way you want me to end I mean it's okay I mean I've been serving you I I mean there's so many things that uh God has opened doors for me I mean there's still some more things I want to accomplish like uh because at the start of this year I just completed one seminar uh this uh Divine sovereignty and human responsibility I was doing my research during the two years of lockdown I have 40 books to Wade through to come up with this seminar and I said Lord uh if you're going to take me home what will I do with this seminar at least give me a chance to uh uh conduct the seminars first before you know if you want to take me home so that's the only thing that was uh at the back of my mind and then of course uh thinking of uh uh how can I um because there are so many people who are asking Pastor why not just write a book so that people can just study the book or do a video of all your seminars so that people can just go and so right now I'm just uh asking the Lord Lord just just lead me to the right people if this is the way you want me to go then I'm willing to go for it but then at the same time I'm excited as to how God will manifest his glory because all my three doctors you know my uh my my uh urologist my oncologist my uh there are two types of oncologist there all of them are Jewish you know so yeah so I said Lord I pray that they will be they will be uh confronted with uh the reality of God and the miraculous and I pray that this would something that would uh you know prick their their conscience and then really see that uh there is indeed the Supernatural That's my prayer for them wow and so um again I'm just excited as to how God is uh moving right now so many people actually um came by our house to pray for me and then one Church said we're doing a healing service we want you to be there and so they prayed for me and I really believe something happened in that prayer service and so um yeah and so that's uh where where I am right now just uh I have no pain at all anything I mean there's a side effect of course of the injection and that is uh the hot flashes but that's all but praise God I can my own call said you're free to travel and uh yeah so God still got work for you to do that's right I know that it's still not done and I'm still going to Cuba next uh year wow uh I want to complete the level three because we already did level one level two in Cuba and uh I mean the whole what is the level one level two level three level one and so when you go when you went there you just did the one and two but you didn't do the htics not yet so we did that level one and level two and this is the whole denomination the Assemblies of God is the biggest denomination in Cuba wow so I trained 12 of their professors in their Bible School in Cuba and so those 12 train their pastors and they told me Pastor Roy we already trained 3,000 of our Pastors in level one level two come back to Cuba because we want to complete it with level three on htics and so I was supposed to go there January but then because of the uh the health issue I had to cancel it but uh next year Lord willing uh in March uh we'll be going there and complete level three and you know in my heart of hearts I was saying to God lord if I'm completing this then I'm okay you can take me home if you want because this would be really something that uh would really help the body of Christ there in at least in Cuba mhm yeah well well I hope that God will keep you you know because you're such an encouragement and uh what you're doing for the body of Christ equipping the Saints uh is so is so valuable to to the kingdom but yeah this has been uh incredible for me I've learned a lot and thank you so much for your time uh for those watching how can they reach you uh maybe somebody watching from a different country or a denomination or Pastor wanting you to come in and train their leaders how can someone get in touch with you yeah so I'm again I'm based here in Toronto Canada um my email address is Roy verosa so that's just one word Roy r o y vs in Victory e r zosa gmail.
com that would be the easiest way if they're from other countries there is a website actually of the Apollo project it's the Apollos project. org uh somebody again it's not me but somebody just put that together the problem is uh I haven't really updated it and so I need to really update that but it's there uh the Apollos project.
