Eddie Penney - SEAL Team 6/DEVGRU Operator | SRS #043

Hey everybody it's that time of year I'm in Franklin Tennessee and getting ready to release episode 43 three years ago today we kicked off the first episode of the Shawn Ryan Show and since then we've had 43 episodes and in just 43 episodes we have hit up to number 55 overall out of over 8 million podcasts I just want to say thank you all that's all you Guys it's the reviews it's the likes it's the subscribes it's all of that it's sharing the content it's sharing the love I think we spread a very positive message

here on this platform and we're going to continue to do that and um I just want to say Merry Christmas happy Hanukkah happy holidays whatever your flavor is this time of year me and the team at vigilance Elite just want to wish you the best we love you all let's Get to the next guest my next guest I had the pleasure to work him with very briefly at my time in Seal Team 2 before he went on to Seal Team 6 Development Group guys this is another really really deep one it's one of the best

episodes I've ever done if I had to say one thing about Eddie with my time with them outside of my studio is he's one of the few guys in the SEAL Teams that just has a Reputation and his reputation is he's just a guy that everybody wants to be around he's just a solid human being he's a solid operator he spreads a lot of love he's got a hell of a story ladies and Gentlemen please welcome my friend Eddie Penney to the Shawn Ryan Show please like subscribe and comment to the channel head over to

iTunes and Spotify leave us a review once again we love you all merry Christmas happy holidays Happy Hanukkah I hope you guys enjoy the show and uh it's going to be a hell of a year in 20123 Happy New Year too love you guys cheers [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] Eddie Penney welcome to the show brother thank you for having me man I appreciate it it's been damn near 20 years don't Again don't put the number to it you believe that it's crazy it's been a long time it's been a long time so former Marine then

you went to Seal Team 2 then you went to Development Group CEO of contingent group CEO of unafraid you got a podcast with your wife now who seems Lovely by the way she's awesome she definitely makes you happy she's the queen she's the queen for sure but anything else am I missing anything uh some you know some side hustles here for Like leadership or team building stuff that do with other other individuals organizations some speaking but yeah kind of i f under the unafraid brand or that that whole mindset piece so that's about that covers

it just getting into motivational speaking Yeah just recently it just kind of I wouldn't say walking away from contingent group but just kind of getting other people to take certain things on and then moving over to the encouragement side that's your passion Though right right now yeah it's like it's taking over and I and I yeah can't fight it it's just like that's what I want to do I like it well we got a lot to dig into yeah we do the first thing I noticed after not seeing you for 20 years your vocabulary has

changed quite a bit there's no more four-letter uh yes that's uh yeah I four-letter bad words in there about 6 months ago I was I've been trying to just better myself I like I don't want to do this I just kind of Noticed I'm cussing more and it'd be around my children not even realizing it was like kind of default from the military I mean you know who we hang out with we kind of have a bad bad mouth uh and I and I don't look at other people bad for it it's just like I

didn't want to do that yeah and uh yeah so I've been and it's been it's been a struggle you've only been doing that for 6 months about six months yeah and I'd say probably like The last month maybe month and a half that it's like okay I'm doing good I might have like one slip up a day or something but like ah gosh just just trying to better myself I just don't want I just don't want to do it man it's I've been trying to do it it's hard and I can't hard you don't even

dance around the words it's it's like it was never part of your vocabulary doing a great job yeah well we'll see here you know the things we're going to talk about I'll do I'll do my best uh but yeah I just I notic like certain podcasts and again it doesn't offend me whatsoever I mean I'd be huge hypocrite if I said it did uh cuz I used it probably too much it was like every other word and uh I just like man I just it's not a I don't want to be known for that especially

when you're talking to other people you're trying to encourage other people and my children like trying to be the example right and that's one Of the things that I need to get rid of and and it's been it hasn't been easy yeah we're doing a hell of a job I appreciate that buddy so but hey everybody that comes on starts off with a gift is this a box of donuts it might be it might be the Shawn Ryan Show we were just talking about this thank in America legal in all 50 states so far right

yeah right now they are I love it man thank you I appreciate that you're welcome and I'm going to Probably eat those on the flight home all of them good for you but and we we didn't say author you just releas your new book unra do and then yeah author of unafraid and now working on book number two and kind of number three how's the book doing it's do good man we're getting a lot of good feedback uh and that was kind of the beginning of like when we went in the beginning when we uh

when myself and Keith wood the co-writer great friend now we started writing I Was like hey there's there's one thing and and that is to help others and like glorify God like I do not want to skimp on that piece because for me that was my like saved my life it really did did and uh we can get into that stuff but uh yeah it it's been awesome the feedback we've gotten from it it's helping a lot of people uh both veterans single parents and people that are just struggling it doesn't really just go for

veterans it's really for anyone and Everyone because I mentioned briefly as you know at the end of each chapter we got the hot wash and it's kind of like a debrief or a critique of that particular chapter in my life and I'm just kind of talk about things and it it originally started to be letters to my children like hey don't make the same mistakes that I did and and we kind of Bren this like hey this this needs to be to everyone so it's kind of dedicated to everyone it's like hey and people that

Aren't even affiliated with the military law enforcement or anything that could be close to it or reaching out U saying hey this really helped you know my organization or my business and that dude just hearing that it's everything definitely needed it'll be linked in the description and everybody go buy his book and leave a review yeah leave a review for the book so I'll leave a review right after this interview but can't wait to dig into it uh we're going To talk all about the book one chapter in particular that caught my attention was kill

addict yeah so I want to get into that but um and then the interview we'll start with childhood this is your biography here so we're going to start with your childhood moved into your uh Marine cor years Seal Team Dev group the dreaded transition and and everything you got going on now awesome but um first before we kind of get into the weeds you're sitting here I'm sitting Here because of my patreon community the vigilance League patreon Community they support the show they support everybody that works here they're awesome and um anyways I give them

I tell them who's coming on the show they're all excited about you there's a ton of questions we only have time for one because this is going to be a long one make it easy yeah it's a tough question though it's a tough question so this is from Eric Covington what advice as a single Dab would you would he give to help communicate to a young daughter to have a foundation of understanding on how to deal with fear the woke world and how to keep a solid mindset growing up in today's culture as a kid

and a young woman that's a it's a great question and that's a great question he said the word mindset which I I love as you know um as a father speaking and this is based off personal experience uh as I Talk about the book getting custody of my children one was a boy and I had two daughters five and 10 and then my son was a 10-month-old and coming from an operator where you're kind of in Savage mode and then coming back and like you need to focus on these little people and the difference between

me talking to my son versus my daughters I'm used to talking to guys like us Team guys military guys that are getting shot at that are shooting other people so I Kind of had to change or shift by knowing my audience and I and it took me a while and and and I made a lot of mistakes I my tone I was kind of more of a do as I say not you know like I'm the drill instructor kind of and it was it was completely wrong uh but to answer that question I would say

that empathy getting on their level having those feelings listening this was very hard for me was listening you do not know it all just because you're a father or a Mother that's raising these children we don't know it all those little those little people running around can teach us a lot about just Humanity each other yourself uh they're trying to communicate and a lot of times that I've learned when they're at a certain age they just don't know the words to communicate what they're feeling they don't know what that is like the sadness they don't

a lot of them don't know that that's what they're feeling I mean we're Grown adults making mistakes like man I'm angry I should probably pull myself out of this situation before I maybe punch somebody in the face or do something I shouldn't do uh but getting on their level listening to them processing what they they say take that pause and then you know delivering that in a proper way by not raising your voice uh guilty uh but be the example they're going to watch You they're going to watch what you do they're going to watch

how you speak back to the cussing piece right watch how you speak how you interact with people how do you go grocery shopping how do you drive all these little things they're get they're like they're just Gathering they're little sponges they're just Gathering all this information um and then try to develop that relationship as best as you can but like to go off of that question from What I personally is what I failed to do was just listen listen to what they were trying to communicate get more information out of them get on their level

and just get in their world get in their world which is tough to do cuz we're we're like we're for the most part self-absorbed humans like we we kind of think about me me me and you know and I'm no exception to it um but that would be my advice is like and it's tough it is tough because if it wasn't tough Everyone would be doing it and we're not doing it and especially we see bringing in the media and we go to school and like twerking is the coolest thing I mean more people know

about working than they know about like being a good person or morals and ethics or integrity and it's sad so the the the place and we can't we I think a lot of us blame it on the school system and I'm not saying that they are not guilty but it starts in the home yeah I mean it starts in the Home for us to become an operator where did it start it started in buds the foundation this is what a seal is this is what an operator does and then we just grew upon that it's

like anything but the PE football to grade school football to high school football to college football to NFL and you're just stacking on this experience and wisdom as we go well the foundation starts back when you're in peeee how to treat people right what is teamwork what does it mean To lose what can we improve upon learning learning the lesson right but that goes back to the home so the parents yeah it starts with you and it ends with you plain and simple and I truly believe that and I'm not going to pretend that I

make all the right decisions I don't I fail almost daily I would say I'm like crap I got to fix that I got to fix that uh I don't want my kid to see me drinking a lot I don't want them to Hear me cussing I don't want them to hear me raise my voice to my wife because that's not okay because guess what they're going to do the same thing if I think if we take a step back and look how we were raised we're probably doing a lot of the same things yeah so

totally agree with that so long answer but that's uh it's a great question that that is a great question uh that's situation dict takes per family but great question yeah you know there was a Lot of questions on there for you A lot of it had to do with Dev group and stuff but I you know listening to your story um I listened to one of your podcasts from Mike ritland several years ago and man you think you know a guy and and uh and the parent piece in there yeah was really really powerful and

touching and so I thought that was the perfect question for you that's a good question but um and then just to add to that I do You know everybody these days is looking for somebody to blame and yeah school system it's all over the news you know what they're teaching and I disagree with a lot of it yeah so so do I with that being said you are your kid's biggest example and if you don't like that kind of [ __ ] they're you're the example just lead by example and they're going to follow and

which is hard to do and I and I about that is you never know who's watching you I go over like Coaches that I watched certain individuals that I watched but I did one little thing one certain thing that means nothing to them but I'm in the world to me that changed my work ethic the way I treat people it's huge just one thing there's a there's a study out there and I and I and I don't know where it came from but it's like for every every negative thing that we do it takes 10

positive to erase that negative so if we raise our voice at our kids or Do something we don't listen to them we assume that we know what's going on they're going to hold on to that they're not going to remember that hey good job on your football in your football game or good job on your grades it takes 10 of those good adab boys to get rid of that negative damn it just goes to show you how powerful that negative piece is and unfortunately my children growing up dealt with more Negative than positive from me

cuz to be honest with you I was the child I didn't know what to do I was lost and I turned to drinking I turned to pills to sleep at night and uh yeah they taught me a lot well before we get into that let's start with your childhood I know you grew up in Ohio yep Cincinnati Ohio uh played Sports pretty much the whole time uh mostly football baseball and then um were you good atam I was good at baseball I was good at Peeee football and then when I got to like seventh eth

grade uh I was kind of late L Bloomer Late Bloomer so I I told my dad I was like hey these these guys are these guys are too big and I'm like I just I just don't want to do it so I quit and uh and I'm glad I did and when I did that I joined the swim team which was great for buds not realizing that I was going to go to buds uh but as a child I was always running through the woods I would play Video games maybe on Saturdays I think my

mom would let me have her for about an hour or two and I play Contra you know up up down down left right left right ba start right you know the the good codes oh yeah so uh I would do that but mostly in the woods building forts running like a madman making Spears um all kinds of stuff man but that was like that was my passion just being on the woods and roaming The Creeks looking for snakes to kill them Cuz that was with a a good buddy odds that I I grew up with

that uh we call ourselves the snake killers and we just go out you know looking for Yeti or something and killing snakes but it was it was a great childhood man it was always Outdoors fishing just something swimming in Lakes uh it was it was a good time it was awesome brothers and sisters I had a cat a cat I did no brother and sisters only child I tortured that cat Alex I don't see you As a cat person uh yeah yeah I don't either but the there he was I think our neighbor had a

litter my mom said maybe this guy needs a cat cuz I'm not going to give him a son or or brother her sister so we had a cat I mean it was it was awesome but I like I would uh when we moved when I was in seventh grade I'd like drop him off the balcony we had like a The Loft kind of like overlooks I would drop him off and we had a couch underneath and he would kind of bounce Off the couch I mean it was out of good fun I wasn't like hey

let's torture this guy but he he did not like me I would like hold him I mean just yeah things you shouldn't be doing things I shouldn't be doing yeah were you popular growing up uh I wouldn't say popular I was friends with everybody like the jocks the like I was just nice to everybody um never really bullied or picked on but I I was kind of into my little click with the Swim team uh that was probably yeah friends of that every one well good childhood good child s childhood good childhood tie with her

parents and everything yeah so my parents were divorced um and I lived with my mom for for most of the time I'd go see my dad every other weekend and like dinner on Wednesday or Thursday night would go out to whatever get some food and he would Drop me back off of the house uh but yeah I mean like my dad when I was a child was like my little hero always would look up to him uh but yeah my mom my mom took care of me she was always there that's like been one constant

uh uh for a long time it's always her she's always been there what do they do as a profession my mom my mom's retired now my dad still does kind of drywall he's in the drywall business been in the drywall business for a long time and Then my mom does um she did like clerical work I think she did like Pig roll or something so she'd always drive downtown you know worked in like the highrises and stuff like that and then come back after work uh so she did that for the most time she took

some accounting courses on uh not online but like through like the Community College I guess or whatever it was I I don't remember what it was yeah but yeah she kind of like a business busy Type well where did your interest in the in the military come then uh I I guess you know my when I was my dad's weekend his his way of parenting was like hey check out this new Sylvester Salone movie or like check out Arnold schwarzen or check out this new guy Van Dam right and I would watch them all and

I was just like glued to the to the thing I like to the to the TV just like glued to it and I would watch them over and over and over again like Looking at their gear like what is that what is this and I would just like try to and we didn't have internet so you try to like magazines or try to figure things out or go to the library like military like what's what what's anything and uh I just fell in love with it like just something got stirred up inside me and it

like became a passion so I mean gosh as long as I can remember I mean grade school I was like dude I want to be in the military like I want To be in the milary real early they started real early and then I remember a specific day my mom took me to a night game a Cincinnati Reds game and uh you know they just got done with a Star Spangled Banner and and it was during uh desert storm so I don't even remember they had the yellow ribbons they had like a sticker with an

eagle head support our troops and like I mean very patriotic stuff from what I from what I can remember nothing what I kind of feel Like definitely not in the Vietnam era which I was not around we can hear the stories or kind of what's going on now but uh very supportive it seemed like at my you know to my young eyes and then at the end of the star spangle Banner which I definitely stood for uh you know took my hand down and afterwards they had like fighter jets fly over in just that noise

I was like dude it rocked my world I was like I I tugged on my mom cuz I'm like you know I'm looking up at her I'm Like that's what I want to do and I didn't want to be a pilot I just knew that I want to be in the military seeing that flag flow I just felt like the a great sense of pride in this country and it and I didn't know what the heck I was even asking for what I was thinking about but for some reason that planted a seed that just

morphed inside me it was awesome and that's that I remember that night it was a night game Cincinnati Reds game I'll never forget it damn and That was it that That's All She Wrote well so when did you start really getting serious and looking into it so I did this I did the swim team after you know for a while and I and I thought about it and then you know swimmers are going you know I was a freshman you know the senior they're looking at colleges they're going to colleges I'd go with them to

check out the university do a workout at their pool or whatever you know they would allow that to happen and I was like well maybe maybe I'll swim in college try to get a scholarship cuz I was starting to get a little bit better I I was I mean most of these kid guys started like when they're 10 so they were like freaks in the water and I was I mean started in nth grade I could barely swim a length of the pool and then towards my junior year I started getting really good and then

I I did not swim my uh senior year because my coach died who was a huge influence on me Uh but I mean there was like little segments of life I'm like I want to be a lawyer cuz I watch The Firm with Tom Cruz I'm like I think that's a good job I want to do that or I want to be a doctor CU I saw whatever it's just influ you know I mean we influence people or we get influenced by people and um everything came back to the military but a guy when I

was a junior year a really good friend of mine was a senior and he enlisted in the Marine Corps so he went Down to to Paris Island in South Carolina and when his graduation came around he had a brother and they reached out like hey Eddie would you like to go down there for the graduation so I asked my mother of course and uh she she yeah she like that'd be great for you so I I went down there and I like fell in love I was like just seeing the obstacle course and they're like

doing the puggle sticks and they're boxing and marching and the guns and it was cool like the Unison of them marching I mean I've kind of learned in the military what what looks cool is not the coolest like diving at night under a ship that's scary bro like that that like you know what I mean you didn't get any enjoyment out of that I when I was done I'm like that's cool but during it I'm like shark what shark am I going to get sucked up into the suction of the ship you know I mean

you know it's the the reality kind of Hits you uh but I just fell in love and I'm like all right like and I wanted to be a seal thing CU I saw you know the Charlie Sheen movie and Michael Bean with you know Navy Seals and um I I did the Marine Corps thing and just I was like I'm going to all right I'm going to go be a marine what what year was this I enlisted in I went August 23rd of 1996 okay I I left to go in the Marine Corps right out

of high school right out of high I was 17 my 18th birthday was in Boot camp sitting in my rack hoping no one would find out that it was my birthday you know you just don't draw attention to yourself right be the gr man uh but yeah it was it was cool it was it was a good experience I didn't fall in love with the Marine cores it's all about rank it's not so much about how you perform it's about rank I care more about your hair than how you operate or do your job I

you Picked that up at that young of an age yeah I started yeah I didn't know better but towards like year two two and a half three years I'm like this is ridiculous like like let's concentrate on like working that seems like a more important thing uh like having an operational fighting force than hey you look good like are those creases like okay cool cuz the enem is going to give a crap about that like it's like who cares I get the point of being presentable and The discipline I understand that but it seemed to

override people doing their job and influencing other people and being and being a leader and uh so I didn't like that what did you join the Marine Corps to do 0311 so basic infantrymen and and that's what I wanted to do so I did my ad this funny this kind of funny and sad at the same time is I did my ASVAB and you know they get the scores back and they're like so Eddie what do you want to do I was like I want to be an 0311 and they're like good cuz that's all

you're going to be able to do cuz my asab I guess was not the greatest so and I was like cool I don't I don't care like just I wanted like what I thought you know the Marines do storm the beaches you know get off of zodiacs go do the thing right be on the front lines and uh yeah that's that's all I cared to do I just wanted to be in the fight not knowing what that meant or What exactly came with that that package deal yeah so so when did you leave did you

do one enlistment and then I did four years yeah about my threeyear mark so the reason for me leaving um about two and a half three years in I was like I learned about marine scout snipers which everyone I saw that was a marine scout they were just squared away and scout sniper school was right there around quano where I was stationed so I would see him like running with their Ghillie suits on with packs they they had other you know their long guns I was like dudee I want to go do that but you

had to be a rifle expert so you got you know you got your three quals you got basic rifle or Bas basic Marksman then you got your Sharpshooter then you got your rifle expert just like we do in in the Navy same thing in the Marines but you had to be a rifle expert the best one to even go to sniper school and I was a basic Marksman so I asked my team Leader I was like hey can I can I go to the range to try to you know up my qual and I went

and I got sharpshoot I missed exper by one point by one shot and so I was like hey can I go again so they send me back like three months later I miss it again by one shot so I was like just give me one more chance and they're like hey we do this you get it you got to reinlist or extend to go to school and I was like I'll do that no problem so I didn't extend they Got but they a spot opened up and I got to go at within 6 months I

think I was back at it and um I missed it again by one freaking point three times man wow and I was done I was deflated I I was done I was like this sucks I'm like man I and I kind of chocked it up like this military thing maybe wasn't for me after all maybe I'm not as it's not what I've always wanted to be so I was like I'll go back to Cincinnati and be a cop like you know I just wanted to I don't like Evil I just wanted to somehow fight evil

the best way the in some way you know shape or form and uh I say probably around that time I don't know how much time was left in the Marines maybe 8 nine months or something like that I was like and I don't know what sparked it oh I know what sparked it we did a trip to West Virginia CU When I was in quanico everything that we did Was training the officers so officers go to OCS officer candidate school and then the Marine Corps you go to a thing on the other side of the

base it's called TBS the basic school so every Marine officer does this six month school it's it's all fieldcraft like learning to set up Patrol bases uh patrolling shooting how to do Mount military operations in Urban Terrain little bit of CQB uh all the like explosives grenades more shooting heavy weapons stuff like that So every officer does that which other services don't so I like applaud the Marines for that that's that's super cool so we were like the op four like the bad guys for for all this training stuff so I was in the woods

or in the field with these guys like my first year I counted the days it was 3115 days and it wasn't like overnight but like some would be like 9 to5 like for a week but some of them like all you're out there for three weeks straight and you're like You're stinking and just like it's just it's just bad but I learned so much and um and then but everything was for them everything was for the officers and I get it but you know at the same time it's like dude I have zero experience and

you want me to try to feed these guys so we just kind of played war games but uh we did a trip we were going to teach some off mountaineering and I and most of us knew nothing this was our first Duty stations actually at school Of infantry took all the names that started with a p there's nine of us like you're going to quanico like that's you know that's not like based off of anything it like okay alphabet somehow the P's got chosen which sucked and um so we go there uh to this to

West Virginia to learn mountaineering so we spent three days out there learning to repel make rope Bridges you know tying all the knots of figurat how to like do River Crossings all that stuff and I Like ate it up I was like oh my God there's like like cuz it was it was like making me better um so there was like it was training for us and I was like dude this is awesome so I fell in love I was like okay where do I get more of this and obviously the answers would have been

like sniper school well kind of failed that one Marine Force Recon learned that their budget for gear and Ops wasn't the greatest at the time they weren't even attached to Socom I believe So I was like all right let's go back you looked into all that at that young yeah wow that's impressive so I I look I asked questions I guess you could say cuz there was a a guy that came from Battalion Recon so you got Battalion at the time I don't know how it's set up now but you had Battalion Recon and you

had Force where force is my like you're kind of like more of your the way it was explained to me more your like your hostage rescue kind of like your tier Oneish type where Battalion was more just dudes that are more squared away have better training kind of infantry type like Rangers and for people that are watching that that if I butcher it I apologize uh but that's what I was led to believe uh by being told by guys that were there and uh I was like all right I'm going to go with my dream

way back when like I'm going to do the seal thing so not even making sniper school and then wanting to go to the hardest school That I believe the military has to offer the feedback from family and friends was not of the most encouraging way it's like dude like people don't make it people don't do anything but it didn't matter like my mind was like on it like it was on it like I I know I can do it I just felt it like I I know I can do this and so I crossed over

and went to buds you so there was no break in service you just went I had one day break I couldn't I tried to like sell back my leave like You can just have my leave just get me there as soon as possible I was like I don't need the 90 because I had like 90 days or whatever saved up uh and they're like no you have to finish it out completely be out for one day to so we can drug test you and all that stuff I was like yeah I'm going to get high

on this one day off before I could before I go in so you had to do the whole out processing piece for the Marines then You got to do the whole in processing piece for the Navy which is a freaking nightmare as you know uh so did that and then had to go up to transitioning Processing Unit which is up in Great Lakes for other services veterans coming in you go up there they kind it's really like a it's a it's a mess let's just put it that way and so we you know your paperwork

and then had to do a a school like get a job in the Navy because there was no seal so Like there was no job that started I think when we were in like a couple years in and um so I went to Gunners mid school right up there in Great Lakes because it was something they they told me it was close to infantry which it's not not even close I learned about circuits and positive and negative and resistors which I still know nothing about I know there's red and black and positives and negatives that's

about that's where we sto But you had to have a school so if you don't make it through they have a place to put you right cuz I didn't want to go open contract and end up on a ship painting it or something like that so did the school and went out to Buds and uh it was awesome man it was everything and more you liked buds I liked it it sucked at times of course but just the learning about my body what I can and can't do and then the mindset piece of it all

I was like oh my gosh Like we as humans have so much more potential than our goals yeah like we might have like I want to accomplish this the truth is you you set your you know the standard here bro you should be shooting up here yeah we see it all the time I see it all the time I'm sure I'm sure you realize the same thing it's like wait I can do way more than this yeah way more you know when you're like something as simple as like I can't do any more push-ups I

can't do anymore and And then they're like hey you're you're out of here if you don't knock out five more and you knock out seven so it's like we can you know our our brain you know brain is our our worst enemy and it's our best asset plain and simple what was your what was your favorite part of buds gosh I really I really enjoyed like the camaraderie of being with the boys I really liked it I I liked the surf Torture you liked surf torture I I mean it sucked I just I like fed

off of it like I get like if I do sparring or something like that or whatever and I get my bell rung it like amps me up I'm like ah yeah okay like I'm I'm stimulated by a little bit of pain okay and that would bring on a little pain and just motivate me more like you can't break me I just had that you can't break me you can't break me I'm getting stronger and stronger and Stronger and that's what I thought to myself all the time and then seeing people quit motivated me really yeah

like all right it's not made for you it's made for me though and I just I would give myself that selft talk uh and a lot of that got me through and and the guy to my left and my right you know I tried to hang out with the good people the the one with the good personality the ones that tried to make you laugh not the one like this sucks when is this Going to end like I did like get away from the toxicity so correct me if I'm wrong but I believe 9/11 happened

when you were in buds second phase yeah what was that like uh surreal it was it was weird I remember was getting my tray uh was at the cafeteria Galley chow hall whatever you want to call it getting my food and I was and I was walking out of the line to the table area and you know on the backside they got all these all the TVs And like everyone's like paused it's like someone hit pause on the remote and you know the the frame stands still I'm like what the heck's going on like I'm

not paying attention I'm looking looking at my food like I can't wait to devour this right I put my tray down and the guys that I'm sitting down with they're like just star they're just glued to the TV I'm like hey what's going on and they just like point up and I'm like and all I see is one of the I think one of the One of the towers I don't know if it was one or two one of the towers was was was going up in smoke and then the second one came in and

I don't remember exactly what I saw but I could I mean I could tell it was an attack and right at that moment it was like okay did we just get attacked and then you know the thoughts go will they push us through training like going to go to the fight it just you just kind of knew instinctively like hey like it's about It's about to get real not that it wasn't real before and and to say it didn't change the mindset a little bit would be uh don't disservice of that whole event but yeah

it kind of I mean you know yeah it it's different it's different when there's actively something going on versus something something could be going on which was which is what the case was you know first phase and a little bit of second phase which just like you know we we'll Answer the call when it comes but now it's like okay the threat is imminent it's real here it is let's go so it kind of tweaked tweaked your brain a little bit did you guys have any did you have anybody quit after I mean nobody quits

after H week normally uh I don't think we had anyone quit I mean we had you know the basic injuries we had to roll somebody but I don't think anyone quit to my to my knowledge there was guys that got kicked out you know uh that That wasn't fit in the mold I guess but I don't think anyone quit Okay so but I don't I'm not 100% on that you know it is doe you're like looking through your the toilet paper roll yeah not seeing you know the big picture of everything you're like God just

like just give me through this hour just give me through this minute just give me through the next 5 Seconds did the instructor staff change at all um after 911 my memory's a little foggy but I Mean they would have to I know one of our instructors had a is his fiance or wife was a uh flight attendant on a flight from somewhere to New York that morning it wasn't her flight but I I could see them doing stuff and we were kind of we were kind of brought into the classroom and kind of debriefed

what was known which wasn't a lot about what was going on uh but you know you could see it in their eyes you you can see it in their eyes yeah yeah you could you can See it so you finished buds you go did you go to Team two right away team two right away yep you went to team two I wound up a team two later yeah cuz you went to eight first I I went to eight first I went to two and when I got to two you guys's platoon or your task unit

I guess I should say was like the golden task unit I don't know what you guys did it was we had the influence from our tier one guys we're going to find out what were you guys Doing what what were you guys doing over there uh I mean you know we had our the way it started you know the first couple weeks cuz we jumped in right when workup was starting I believe okay for the first deployment uh and you know Iraq was I think or sorry Afghanistan was going or when did Iraq start kicking

off Iraq started kicking off right in 2003 okay so I would have been it was like during that time both of them were Kicking off so it was like okay where are we going and we we know we didn't know but we're assuming we're going to go get in the fight but our our leadership that came from from the other side of the street our tier one guys they um they changed the whole way we did business and they made it more like them so instead of like hey we got two platoon and you guys

were all doing the same stuff they kind of made it like hey we got our Mobility guys we got our Sniper element and then we got our assaulters and uh they changed it all and so I was with the assaulting side and just kind of fell in love with the breaching and that deployment I just want to go to breaching school but it was rare for new guys to go unless there was a spot yeah uh so I didn't go but I was like this secondary breacher I would like just I was mentored by a

lot of lot of solid dudes um and uh just like hung on to every word and just tried to like Soak up as much as possible and I just fell in love with the breaching world what did you think of the SEAL Teams when you first showed up was it everything you thought it was going to be uh I thought it would be it had a conventional taste to it and I only say that after being at the tier one unit I only say that I wouldn't have probably known better but it was like oh

we can't let you out until like 4: I was like are we are we babies like if we had nothing To do send guys home yeah especially when you're always on training trips you have deployments like we have a thing called families and I think that's a a problem we have is we want to know why divorce rate is 90% a lot of it's based off of stupidity because we think that this is the way it's supposed to be dude we we we preach this unconventional mindset this that we are unconventional we you we do

the gorilla Warfare right but yet when it comes to you know Sticking to the 430 or 4:00 rule like come on man like let's let's we're done we're not we're not regular military here yeah you're expecting guys to fight and get shot at where did you wind up deploying too on that first one the first one we were kind of like dragged around first we were told we're going to Germany then we're going to Guam then we're going to South America and we were like the heck and then we were going to Iraq and then

I pulled out Then we went to Iraq so we we went to missou up north and we were just like you guys are going to be doing Das we're like really like yes like yes so we went up there uh and our first two months was up there and it was it was cool it was really cool like it was it was eye opening it's like just busting breaching the doors down going in and kind of like SWAT style but the whole time we did there I don't I don't believe one shot was fired I

mean because you're not Obviously getting the the high value targets the hvts you're getting kind of the lower ranking or whatever the Intel says that we should be going uh but it was cool it was like in the in the progression in the progression of my career and like inting the experience it's probably it was awesome like it wasn't like boom boom boom right away mhm it was gradual that would come later uh but it was good until and then you know two months in we get the PSD piece The the the security detail down

in bag dad uh when the interim government came in so we packed up all our stuff which we weren't proud of yeah and to be honest we like didn't even train for PSD yeah really so we were kind of like all right this is what it looks like I mean we did a little bit uh but not not like hey this is going to be your mission overseas here we're going to do a work up for it we didn't do that uh it was Kind of like on the job training but you know we pick

you pick it up right yeah you know like bad guys the way they think think all right let's defend but instead of you know up in bazo when you're you know when you're taking it to the enemy when you're on the offensive now you're on the defensive you're waiting to get hit by the vehicle born IED on the side of the road your guy that you're watching or constantly around is a Target uh I mean when we had aoi uh years before he was up in uh England and Saddam send his guys up there and

and he got send assassins to kill him and and he had scars all over his face from hatchets that they took to him when he was sleeping and he survived it like it took him a year to come back but like just seeing their scars on his face like much respect you know and a lot of people say he was DC's p uh puppet and he might have been you know now that We're learning right um about this government uh I but I don't know but you know the guy was anti Saddam I mean especially

when someone tries to kill you I'm probably not going to be friends with you after yeah so but it was it was an experience that led to my company later so I can't uh it was it was good to do yeah not fun at the time but it was good to do pretty discouraging probably it was very especially I mean that's every team guy's dream I think Yeah kicking down doors right taking it to the bad guy and then you got to go watch somebody yeah I don't want to Babys say you nothing against you

I just don't want to babysit you yeah I'm trained to do more yeah not when there's a war going on exactly but so you come home do another workup yep and during that time my second child was born probably 3 months for the second deployment so when I was In the Marines found out that my first daughter Kayla was born she was uh when I was in the Marines so when we went out to buds I she was two or three so I had one one daughter and then before the second one my second daughter

came Samantha so I think I left on that second deployment was 3 months old was that hard for you at the time it's sad as this is to say I don't know I didn't want to leave but at the same time I wanted to leave I wanted to Be over there like I was just itching to get over there I just wanted to fight like we don't you just don't go through all this training and volunteer to be put through hell right pretty much and then just not then to to be back at home uh

yeah it was it was sad to leave and I missed him of course but I was like that's where I'm supposed to be is overseas that's that's where this is and that's where this is so yeah and then when I came back it was you know she Nine months old and just like it's ridiculous wow so was that so the second deployment was that the one we did together that's the one we did together so I think there was three or four guys from our task unit we had to get more guys on yours MH

so I volunteered cuz I've never been Afghanistan so I was like yeah please send me and I cuz I did not want to go to P PSD again yeah and uh I almost said PTSD again because it's about the Same so uh I volunteered I was like I don't care what I do just like get me over there like because I heard the fighting was more intense there was you know was a a more formidable opponent uh but I yeah I just wanted to be over there so I volunteered right away to go with you

guys and I'm glad I did yeah it was pretty boring [ __ ] deployment if you ask me but yeah but it was cool to see the landscape kind of get to know the people and that was like My first like troop in contact encounter it was nothing big but got to shoot the 240 at some trees where we were getting shot at yeah and I was like okay and then just like what I was saying earlier like with uh doing the Das in in Iraq it was just a small progression like okay you got

your first like troop and contact nothing crazy but it was just like adding another layer of experience so um I mean that's just the way I I look at it cuz there's no other way to Look at it yeah would after that so that deployment got cut short we went down and to kandah hard did a little bit of stuff with the cansoft which didn't really amount to much right and then then I'm not really sure what happened at the top level but I'm fairly certain that we got kicked out of country I believe you're

right cuz we shut the whole Camp down yeah was it camp oet or something is that was called yeah we shut it all down and then we went back To back to Baghdad yeah so what did you guys do when you so we split ways there I went to another platoon in Baghdad you went to I believe your original platoon yeah so I went back with them and they were doing what they called a mentorship for p PSD almost did it again uh PSD and like training their like a Iraqis on how to do it

or other entities that were taking over and it was a lot of sitting down and then we we're like we got to do something I mean the worst thing you can Do is get a bunch of Team guys sitting around doing nothing mhm it just good things don't happen we're like a bunch of children which that's fine like we want to go operate that's that's what we're created to do and that's like that's what we feel right and um finally we started getting some of the sniper apps like I know solder city was going crazy

some guys got lucky to you know drop some bombs and I think our snipers and radiomen and Medics got a Lot of those which I was none of uh but got to do a couple sniper Ops again no shots fired uh on where I was I know a couple guys got some yeah um was that who you were with that that side our we were the lucky ones that kept getting okay I thought so yeah yeah I thought so but yeah nothing but it was just cool to like another mission I guess you could say

to get experience on doing mhm but it nothing and then I realized like I don't ever want to be a Sniper this is so boring like I want to kick down doors man yeah it it was it was it was great experience it really was so from there that was your was that your last deployment at Team two okay yeah so uh I I I screened or send in my package to go over across the street to a tier one unit and um they pushed it back I was supposed to get back and go right

into like a month later a couple weeks later and I got Pushed 6 months and started going go to the train our training Detachment and then I told one of the guys I was an operator over there and he did something because he's like hey dude you're you're going to you're doing the the to Green Team like right away when you get back and all I was doing that deployment was jacking steel like me and Jason Workman that's all we were doing when I got to uh Baghdad was just jacking steel as much as we

could so I put on like Probably 10 pounds so I'm taking all the supplements have my wife at the time send over anything and everything just like to try to bulk me up because I'm like if I'm not going to do anything at least I can do is like just get bigger and get stronger um but definitely not faster so I was like crap I like started stressing about the run I was like okay I'm going to start running so I kind of tapered off on the weights a little bit and uh so like probably

two or three Weeks later once we got back home or total time I had to be doing that uh screening test to get in and I passed the run like I had no problem with any anything else but the run I made by like 12 or 13 seconds oh but it didn't matter as long as you pass they give you a time as long as you pass it doesn't matter how close you are yeah so but yeah so you went right to Green Team right after that deployment no downtime no doubt maybe a couple weeks

how's your wife and Family I mean what do they think of that uh I was very self-absorbed I really I mean I I'm sure I asked but my mind was made up like hey here's what I'm going to do MH and I would justify as like hey we get more money if I go over there versus over here deployments are shorter like I would get pretty much turned into a Salesman where I wouldn't you know I was like is that cool with you but I really Wasn't asking I was like is that cool with you

but inside I'm like I'm doing this no matter what you say um and that was kind of it but but she was supportive from what I can remember she was supportive but I mean the cracks in my family life had they already they already started before you went over I would say I'd say they started around after my first deployment okay the cracks you know they weren't they weren't little Baby fractures anymore they were splitting and uh it was starting to get worse cuz I was partying hard yeah I was drinking a lot mostly on

trips when I come home cuz the kids I really wouldn't drink too much unless we had like a a backyard barbecue or something uh but I noticed she was thr a more so I guess she she was kind of coping with her own you know dealing with it and I really didn't take her into consideration at all like I was like hey dude like suck It up and that's just not the way to do it and uh so that that didn't help I did not help I I mean I take ownership that I I really

failed I think I was definitely majority if not soulle owner breaking that marriage apart for sure like I just I was so self-absorbed all I cared about was the teams I cared more about the boys than her yeah do you think that looking back now do you think drinking was definitely part of the culture yes at that time oh of course Yeah I mean yeah it's better than cocaine or heroin you know what I mean so I mean and of course in our society it's socially acceptable what not L acceptable is when you're you know

just doing it to try to go to sleep and and my in my brain and I wasn't like cuz I didn't really see too much in those those first two deployments I really didn't see like a bunch of dead bodies you know your Buddies getting destroyed I I didn't see that in the first one I mean I think the the biggest thing that I saw was that probably that second deployment it was the first deployment there a huge roadside bomb and I remember going out to the the Prime Minister wanted to go out there and

look and I remember just seeing like shoes lining the streets cuz and the people blown out of their shoes from the from the over pressure yeah but their shoes remained and it was and it Was it was a crazy sight and I was like oh man and like it's one of those images that you like you don't forget but uh I really didn't see or really experience the stuff that you're like man that was a close one or like woo like well like okay that's all right we're good yeah not those first two deployments well

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I got a little more numb as the years went by uh I think there's an evolution and empathy that occurs in combat that people don't talk about very often Christians in the Middle East have been persecuted for years Sadam was one of those people that was a part of that process in my last deployment I went to Uh the hook right around there there was this compound with these hooks that came out of the walls yesterday December the 13th at around 8:30 p.m. Baghdad time United States military forces captured Saddam Hussein alive uh they shifted

over and hit the next Farm uh and then yeah shortly after that they uncovered the rug with the Rope to the cork plug in the Hole uh Pulled the cork out and saw this looking down on a guy pulled him out of the hole and it was Sadam just hearing that and being in that place was made me realize how evil that son of a [ __ ] actually [Music] was Christmas Day 2003 we had caught Saddam on December 13th this is 2 weeks later and it was Christmas morning and we're like what the heck

is that and we're like Listening and we walk and we look over and we look over the balcony and down on the lower level is these guys that work for us that are singing Christmas carols for the first time probably ever damn in English because they were so happy that they were in a place where they weren't going to be prosecuted for their religious [Music] beliefs all right Eddie we're back from the break you wrapped up Your fairly short career at Seal Team 2 you're moving on on to Development Group let's talk about what that

transition looked like I was excited you know it was it was like you know you hear the stories like they're doing these operations and you know they get in these firefights and again I still didn't know what I was asking for um but I just wanted to be there I was so excited I I was like it was like Christmas daily being over there was Like Christmas uh I mean just some great operators they treat you uh like a season operator I mean you're still learning from everyone these these guys got so much experience and

I just ate it up uh great influences man I mean just the the mentors that they were and then you know they took you under your wing and you just show you the way they kind of operate and it was just it was awesome it it was super awesome like I loved it what was Green Team like Showing up there uh it was good I mean you're you're around all the guys that are you know are putting out to get to that that you know the uh next rung on the ladder and uh it was

I think green team was harder than buds really it seemed like there was more stress you had more to prove your your ego was kind of more on the line okay like you know you you could go back to the to the teams back to team two as a um I mean you would call yourself a failure like I Failed or whatever it is not to saying that like and the guys that didn't make it through they they're they're great individuals great operators but just it wasn't I guess what they're looking for and um it

was tough man it was extremely tough but you know the main thing they concentrated on was CQB and that happened to be my strong suit it just like it was like I can just walk in a room and I can process really fast uh I can't process in the relationship world But we're with my children but for some reason you know on CQB that just I just got it like I just understood threat bad guy done not you know hostage don't do anything wrong like I just I just I just got it like I comper

him in the Angles and doorways and windows I just got it and uh and and I say that humbly I just and there's so many other things that I really took me a long time to get like I just didn't I wasn't that great at it uh I guess probably more of the passion Piece uh but there's nothing cooler than going through a hallway running and gunning and like peeling off coming back out of the hallway going to the next room like what do we got it's like a surprise behind every door you just don't

know what you get uh but it was I strived in that I did really good um and I'd say probably you know the two things that I found in green team that they they get rid of you for was uh well minus your if you have an attitude or You're just like don't fit the mold was CQB in the beginning of it all if you do a crazy safety violation throughout and then jumping if you know you're not landed on the a you're not deploying correctly because I mean when you're asked to be at altitude

at night time stacking to fly into wherever you got to you got to be I mean dudes die and uh I remember one I talked about talk about this in the book is like it was like our final jump like our final test jump and I came down with strip and I had like a 102 103 I mean it was hallucinating I was I was out and they came in like one of the instructors like hey do you got to jump and I was like hey can I just do it tomorrow like just let me

pump in some meds and he's like no he's like you have to do it now and I was like all right so I went to got the medic and I was like Hey dude I don't know what you have to do pump me up with do something and get me on that freaking bird and and I dude I I thought I was like I would I mean if you have a strey for and you have a t that K sucks and you want me to jump out of a plane which I didn't like to begin

with uh and I was like screw it dude I I really didn't care if I burned in and I got up there and I even think that there was only a couple guys that needed to pass like they let me alone cuz they knew I was sick and like okayy just you get this is your shot and uh I just kind of like fell out Of the plane you know stabilized myself pulled and then I I landed where I was supposed to I was good to go took off my shoot dropped it right there in

the DZ and went right up to my rack and went back to bed I I was done man but uh that was probably the hardest piece uh minus the runs it's always the runs dude that is like yeah like take the knife out of my freaking back dude this sucks I hate the runs but those are probably the two hardest things that I thought but it was Again the camaraderie it was all it was kind of like buds on steroids like hey everything's operational like we're doing you know an FMP a full mission profile uh

it it was cool like it was it was exactly where I wanted to be it was exactly what I wanted it was awesome and then the final stage of that and I actually heard this on uh Shipley's is uh was sear School the final thing yeah and the final thing or the exercise is they drop You off wherever and you have to make make your way back to the command uh out there where to the schoolhouse and you have no money you have no IDs and you have to figure it out how far are you

they I think they said like 20 miles or something 20 miles she kind of like got a smoo yourself and all that stuff but what we did was took a razor blade and we cut in the soles of our shoes and we put like our ID and wrapped some hundreds around it stuffed it in there Cuz I check you and uh soon as I dropped a off found a cab went to a bar got ripped and uh I was with Marcus Capone and we get back we get to the schoolhouse like one guy is coming

in with a case of beer this is like an Air Force freaking School the final stage of Green Team not pay we're just so excited like we just did it like it's over you know it's it's all good and uh we come in hammered I mean I was hammered and we Almost got kicked out had go see the master chief when we got back uh to to our Command back in uh back in Virginia and I was like are you kidding me the last day I'm about to get kicked out like I am a [

__ ] like I am an idiot and uh they kept us and I was I was I was scared I was like man like what I what what I do yeah I was like that this is stupid what like come on man grow up what did they say to you just kind of like again don't Remember exactly the words but like hey we can't do that we represent this command uh just can't be doing that stuff you got to do the course to get the experience all that stuff and I was like I understood I

mean I was humbled I was like I'm sorry uh whatever I I can't remember what I had to do I'm sure I had to do something uh but there was a punishment and I I I can't recall what it is but it didn't matter they didn't kick me out And I got to graduate and go uh with my you know with my Squadron so that was literally the last last day last event all we had to do was fly home holy [ __ ] damn dude dumb that would have changed a lot of things a

lot of things but for some reason man for some reason yeah you know you had mentioned that a lot of solid seasoned operators didn't make it through for whatever reason that's not what they were looking for do you can you describe maybe What the Seal Team 6 command is looking for an operator I I think um out of the box thinkers I think that's a big thing a team player mhm um I wouldn't say someone that goes with the flow they just went out of the box thinkers and some of the guys that were awesome

they would just get flustered and do the same safety violation like three three or four times in a row like just cuz it's it's a lot of stress man it's a lot of stress uh And then you just got this Cadre these instructors just like watching you and they don't miss a thing I mean you you know for buds right like they they say it all it's like dude how'd you how'd you see that but um yeah I I I really just think like you like kind of put it like you didn't fit the mold

or I heard and this I believe this is probably true is and I know from being up there you get a list of Green Team guys and you right there like this guy's Not a this guy's a turd there this guy's a turd this guy's good to go and you write it down like this guy's a turd and you got to obviously give a reason and I'm sure some of those guys still some of those guys aren't invited and some of those guys are invited but watch that guy because I'm sure if you got one

guy saying this and another guy saying the opposite you know they got to you know do the right thing but there's some of that how much of that is legitimate Turds versus personality conflict I can't really speak on that piece uh but there's there has to be some personalities I mean some people take things very personal like they had to run in mouthin off whatever it is I really didn't like what you did you an idiot when you were drunk you did this when you were drunk it usually comes down when you're drunk uh so

yeah I mean it comes down to a lot of things and it's it's Nerve-wracking you're like you're going to tell me I can't go before I even get there to prove myself yeah uh but you know there is a little bit of politics I would think into it but I don't know the grand scheme of it all so I would I would you saw that list come around a lot when you were I saw you know when new green teams would come in if you're if you're in town um and I even think you'd get

it overseas and you would just kind of eyeball don't know anybody all Right cool like whatever it is like hey we need to get this guy this guy's awesome like freaking yeah yeah it just depends I mean the same time you're like dude this guy's awesome like he's got to get in like and they they I think they they have to take that in to make decisions because you know there's always more than you know they only have so many slots versus the guys that are applying yeah or that you know requested to be there

so they got to do their due Diligence so you graduate what how do they determine where you're going uh they have a draft kind of thing um and I think a lot of it is like having good buddies at certain squadrons kind of pulls you that way I mean I had the guys that I was a team too with I mean I ended up with you know with my at my Squadron because of those guys they're already over there yeah they were there they came back and um and so I'm sure they you know rallied

for me to go there but then it's like you meet a good buddy a good instructor that's at a different a different color and you're like uh what do I do cuz this guy's told me this I'm like I don't know I'm like I don't know anything just get me up there yeah but uh I went where I was supposed to go so you went over to Gold Squadron yep there are a few people in the military that have experienced more loss than gold Squadron in your time Frame which we'll get into chills yeah but

I want to say that because it is I I can't think of any unit that has experienced more loss than you guys we went through the ringer and it was a weird time yeah it was very weird how was it showing up to Gold phenomenal phenomenal just walking in seeing the pictures seeing the stuff on the wall you got you know HUD and C's freaking goldplated Guns hanging up you're like there's like AK-47 chandeliers it's just it's awesome it's just like big old table in the middle it's like nights of the Round Table it it

was it was awesome it was the coolest thing in the world and the people that were in that room made it the coolest place in the world I mean they're professionals like the number one thing that was always talked about is doing your job J better and better and better And better and pushing you and pushing you and it wasn't like you're a turd like figure it out it was like hey let me show you how to do it and it was awesome like it it was it was a great show of leadership and camaraderie

and teamwork it was it was the coolest thing that I've ever experienced which is great being out and you see other organizations other businesses and they're not doing a quarter of it it's like man you can really fix yourself if You do certain things wow so it it was I have nothing nothing but respect for the men over there that I served with I mean they were they were true heroes was it a welcoming environment or was it a what are you doing here who do you think you are there's always a little bit of

heckling but it's in good fun it wasn't stupid it was it was fun but it's more like hey you're a part of the team man here's your gear we all love gear yeah how many guys went over there with You uh from your green team I'd say probably five or six I think five or six I think so um Adam Brown was one of them oh Adam was one of them we were in the same green he was uh was a team leader at Green Team he was in my uh Team dom dom what over

with me we all we all went over together oh and a couple other guys so what happens when you get in there uh you know you get all checked in you get your cages your your your Beautiful cage I heard Chipley talk about that too it's it's so like you know we got the cages right but just like seems like every time you come back to your cage there's like a little package like Santa just came and dropped it off more gear it's like dude like where do I put this stuff like I need another

cage like there's just so much gear like for different regions different uh climates all that stuff different Missions and I'm like I don't even know what this is but like okay I'll put on my shelf over here of things I don't know what it what it is I need to learn uh but but it was cool dude and then you you know you do the uh again which I talk about in here you do the yard yarding in you know we got the big yard of beer and they drop in a couple shots down it

start to say a little speech I tell you to shut up you get your patches and those patches man holding those Patches it was like better than my Trident getting my seal Trident which was a great time I don't want to take away from that but it's was just like dude this this since I was a kid is what I wanted to do is be here and finally go get to to fight like really fight and I say that not knowing what really fight meant yeah you know you don't realize it until you're till you're

doing it uh but it was dude it Was it was the it would be like if Christmas Fourth of July and Thanksgiving and every other cool holiday plus your birthday were wrapped into one day that would be it nice it was awesome for me you know each one of the obviously I never spent any time over there so I don't know and I am curious I hear each and I've picked it up especially with gold um there seems to be kind of a culture Or a Vibe at each Squadron and from what I've been able

to gather just from knowing you and Dom and Adam Brown and you know some of our other mutual friends that wound up going over to Gold it seems like Golds were everybody that I know went for the most part but seemed to be very religious seem to be a very religious God-fearing Squadron that's funny you say that cuz I've never thought about that really No I was never I was not a man of faith when I was in at all but I mean if you look at it the Crusader yeah we have crosses and a

lot of those guys were you know their faith was strong and uh yeah but and again I don't know other ones you know what the other squadrons are doing but yeah that'd be fair to say that'd be fair to say was there a lot of praying and uh not that I was a part of I mean to be quite honest with you I'd be like get that crap away from me okay If someone was pushing it in my face but at the same time I was always I was kind of like what I like to

say Christ curious like what does that exactly what does that mean and I I remember asking Adam and Dom a lot like hey you know I been asked stupid questions like what book do you like better the Old Testament or the New Testament not knowing what the heck I'm even asking like what what kind of question is that and uh and I would ask dude and I would Just try to like get just a little bit of information before I get get to it probably good to to give you a little background on that which

I've kept locked up forever until this it's when I was my parents went through a divorce probably when I was seven or eight years old um and I was in my bed one night and like if you can just imagine a room I'm against on the far side of by my window my bed was there and then the doors on the other side and I wake up for some reason I look over and I see Christ I see Jesus and I knew who Jesus was and I and I my mom never took me to church

a lot I went a couple times but you know you always see the picture I knew who Jesus was where did you see him in my room where in a closet on the wall he was standing in the middle of the room and he was transparent I could see my bookshelf that was behind him and he Just stood there he made no facial expressions kind of had a u like a a glowing light to him long brown hair beautiful face like just perfect who was he wearing a white robe a white robe and you could

I just remember I could see my books behind him because he like I was like Wow and I didn't know what to think I didn't know I didn't know and I looked over and you know I'm looking at him and I'm just like and I'm I'm not scared I'm not screaming I'm just so I'm getting Chills man I'm soaking this in and I'm not knowing what anything is I was awake wake and I saw that and for however long he was there he vanished and soon as he vanished my room was the blackest of black

I've ever seen in my entire life it was so dark and the fear that came over me was overwhelming it was the scariest thing it ruined it wrecked me really soon as that Darkness hit and I tried to scream for my mom and I couldn't and I finally Got the courage and I guess you could say strength I I was like paralyzed and I went to her room and I really didn't say anything I don't know if I mumbled anything or like hey I saw something or whatever it was uh but I freaking um went

to bed in her room and then the the next couple nights just thinking about it wasn't the greatest sleep but I was scared so I would I'd covered my head up turn on you know my use a nightlight which I never did Before I mean a nightlight that was like pretty much Batman's fre signal it was so bright I was like dude I don't want any more of this stuff I was like this sucks like that that scared me um and I was confused I didn't know like and I and like a couple days later

probably about a week later I think I somehow my arms made it out of my little protective Fortress of my of my blankie and uh I felt tickling in my arm I heard Orchestra like organ music you know Dorans or whatever at church get at church yeah which is the creepiest sound in the world and I I feel tickling and I wake up and nothing's nothing's there just my light and I'm like freaking out I'm like what is going on and I the chills are ridiculous right now like seeing it all I go to my

mom's room again and just just a lot of weird things happened during that time during my parents divorce but I know what I saw And I know I was awake when I saw it and um to me Jesus became the boogeyman I want nothing to do with him keep it away from me I don't want to be near you I don't want to see you it was so bad I went over to spend night spend uh spend the night with a friend that that I met at seventh grade when I switched schools like I we

were were awesome played basketball together like just cool dude went over to his house not knowing his father was a Pastor and we and he like kind of had a loft uh where where we were going to sleep for the night and I was walking up the stairs and on the left there was a picture and it was Jesus's face and instantly I was like I got to leave I called my mom and had her pick me up I was like wow this hurts to talk about I was scared to death of him I slept

under my covers until I was a Sophomore in high school are you serious I was scared to death of him I'd be sitting on my couch watching freaking say by the Bell and I would make myself think about Jesus busting in like a Navy SEAL and taking me away from my parents just scooping me up and taking me away to God knows where I would have those thoughts often I I I I painted this picture that he was He was evil he was wrong he was bad and I didn't know anything about him did he

ever reappear no no I mean other ways which we'll get to but uh no that was I mean I didn't want anything to do with him I did not want anything to do with him whatsoever I wouldn't I mean I you know I you know got married at a church my my first marriage and went to other Weddings But I would never go to church I didn't want to stand I don't want to be around I Would drive by one and I would cringe I was scared I I was scared I was extremely what was

it that helped you overcome that fear after you were a sophomore that came a little later um do you want to go in timeline or you want me to jump to it we'll go in Timeline okay we'll go on timeline well it is very strange that you had this connection to Jesus as a young young kid all the way up what through high school And then you wind up at gold team as I mean I'm do they they call you a crusader heck yeah yeah so interesting so you get over to gold team we covered

the culture a little bit um what's the cycle like kind of like you know being a team two you know you do your you you do your individual kind of work up going to schools I mostly did breaching schools or lockpicking alarm bypass just like the fun stuff like I just dude I was that's all I wanted to Do I mean there's other schools you do um but mostly was breaching stuff like I just wanted to be a breacher and uh so you do that then the second you know few months you're kind of working

together as your team then your troop and then you're on standby for any real world calls um you're alert as what you'd call it where you have to be have to be within you you have to respond come to the command within a certain time limit To be to be there to a real world event anywhere in the globe and uh that's a few months and then you go on your deployment and then you just repeat the that cycle and every we just rotate our squadrons just rotate doing that stuff did you jump into a

full cycle or I came in I came in right when they got back okay they were back for I think they came back a week later okay and then they went on their leave Did a little family time somewh some stayed and then we were back in the cycle so you got you know guys walking around they just got all this experience they're doing all they did all this crazy stuff they're they're telling the stories you're just like I want to be a part of these stories and um so it was cool and they you

know they they all were experienced they were all experienced they all had multiple deployments over to either Iraq or Afghanistan they just they knew the deal they knew how to fight they they were Fighters they were Warf Fighters they knew the deal and they kind of raised me so at that point I mean you know for a fact you're going to get what you came in to do figh you're fighting no doubt in your mind mind no doubt in your mind there is no I hope we it's when we I can't wait to that's what

it was how long was it when you showed up to Gold before your First deployment 6 n months that's it something like that how was that where'd you guys go uh first one was Iraq Western Iraq nothing but DA's all da it was breaching nonstop non-stop breaching kicking indoors shooting dudes every night multiple times a night I wouldn't say every night I mean there'd be like the stent of like Hey we're going you know It's like hey this is the 10th day we've gone out and we're getting it on I mean there' be like a

day or two here that we you know there was nothing going on or we're letting something develop but for the most part you're going out man so when you got when you got over there you got on your first appointment to Iraq you know in a regular Seal Team it's you're probably going to I mean I don't know I can't remember it seemed like three Weeks maybe even a month before you really start getting into a type of GrooVe when you go over with Team Six is it like that or your targets are developed by

the guys are relieving they pass their target set off to you okay and so you're running and gun it man so you drop your bags in your you got about 1 to three days that's a to to get it to get ready for it and you're you're on I mean it's it's game time who are you guys going after Usually your hvt your high value targets I mean some mvts medium value but uh I mean whoever Intel is telling you this is you know this is the cell we need to hit or this little tribe

whatever you want to call them that's what you would do and you know I think I can recall maybe one or two dry holes do you want to describe Des your very first hit I I can't remember okay I can remember my first Kill I can't remember my first hit do you want to talk about your first kill sure uh we were remember the guy he was wearing his white man jammies and he had like black and white peppered hair or peppered hair and at this T compound at this particular compound they were they were

sleeping outside usually they're up on the roof uh and in you know in summer it was it was summertime but they were in the in the courtyard or the like outside So there's like these little bodies and these little bodies and you can hear our our wrecky guys our snipers you can hear their silenc 45s just taking dudes out taking their little sentries out and I'm like okay that's like cool sounding this is probably my my I don't know 10th timeout maybe uh never found myself in the right position I'm like and I was hungry

I was like oh God I think Dom got his first one I'm like God I would it be you and uh and he like you Can just see the smile on his face I'm like oh give it to me please and uh so this dude and his his wife was were were sleeping on the ground and we're coming up and it was enough to go white light and I just see him reach over and he and I can see the pistol grip goes for it and then I just dropped him just dropped him right there

but he was already down just shot him there as he lay and and I remember one thing that was so crazy about that is his wife right next to him Did not make any peep did not cry she just looked over and just stayed there she sat up that was it she had no emotion are you kidding and I was like that's that's weird right it's weird it was very weird it's like she knew his time was coming she was just waiting for the night for us to hit him do you think she was relieved

possibly I mean who knows I she could have been forced to be there but she had I mean I would be led to believe That if we have no emotion I mean seems so I hope my wife would cry or something but there was nothing man it it was just seemed very weird and then we just like take on the targets and then that feeling of putting those bullets into him was just like h I know crack is extremely addictive extremely I've never done it but you hear the stories right talk to some prior users

or Whatever that feeling was like I was like I want my life to be this feeling like I want to shoot as many bad guys as I possibly can and that was my mission is like bad guy you're going you're going down like that was I mean that's what we're there for anyways MH is to take it to him and I was I loved it I loved it I like it was my oxygen it was the blood that ran through my my system do you remember all of Them no uh at times I'll think about

something or I'll see something it will make me think of one uh but I can't there's no way I mean there's dozens I can't think of them all how many times was it just you engaging a bad guy versus our whole team or something yeah dozens lot yeah I mean I never kept count I tried to and not much luck I I mean a lot I mean probably 50ish or something around there Solo ones I mean not not including assists or whatever it is did you did that feeling ever start to change I wanted a

more you wanted a more I wanted a more as time went on I wanted a more especially when you you know you get into our later deployments and your buddies are passing and it just it stir something up and you just want to take it to them I mean you want to take it to them and Just get their evil once you really learn what they do to women and children to an American Convoy to other people other contractors or whatever we had I mean we had to paint a picture for you what I mean

is we had one op where I took a shot on a guy he was he was reaching for his AK he like head in his hand he was like about ready to swing it around dropped him and I don't know why I felt this way but I felt a little bit of remorse like I was like man what like I just felt bad it wasn't like it wasn't a Justified shooting it just it felt weird it felt different than the other ones just felt weird and so I was curious so I we get back from

the op and I go to the you know our Intel Shack and I'm like hey man if you find anything on this dude you know we do our pick up whatever they have at their at the Target and uh exploit it I was like hey if you find anything like please come get me and a Couple hours later he like hey follow me so we go to his little computer and one of the CDs we found it's this guy that I just took out he's got KBR contractors truck drivers from like the Philippines staked on

the side of like this highway in Iraq they're tied up with their hands behind their back and their feet wrapped around the post and there's probably I'd say somewhere between three and Five and this guy these guys where this one dude was one of them was doing ballistics on them he would stab him he would shoot him in different parts not like shoot him in the head and like take him out but like your leg your side stab them stab them here and they were just they were just they were laughing and they were giggling

and I was like how could you do that and then I'm like you're dealing with pure evil That's how you do it I mean it's pure evil and uh that was one of the times something a thing kind of changed I was like you get you get no more remorse from me you don't you get nothing I don't feel sorry for you at all and I was like after that like things upped it yeah I was like if there was a way to kill harder I sure heck was searching for it did that did you

see that early in your career what do you mean that specific Incident saw was probably man I mean they all kind of run together I'd say probably third or fourth deployment okay over there how many deployments did you do probably third total of seven okay five with um the dev was were you always privil to that kind of information you know seeing you hit a guy at a Target or you the team takes somebody out or you take somebody out in the Intel team does The SSC and the target you guys always get to see

the information in in in in the the what am I searching for the like what they find pretty much it not all of it what these guys have been responsible for doing some we do but it's like a it's like Cliff note version like a couple liners hey this is what they were doing they just hit this Convoy last that killed you know five Americans you'll hear about that but not like the details like we've been looking for this Guy for x amount of years unless you really want to know and you just go talk

to them and they'll tell you you know you get the information okay that guy I wanted to know about and he showed me had I not probably asked him I never would have known about that I'm glad I did but it kind of calloused me we hear the word callous right military oh we're getting callous like yeah you're right we are and there's a reason for it and yeah Just heart of my heart I look at I looked at Humanity a little bit differently yeah I can imagine so you went to Iraq for your first

deployment at some point in time the area of operations changed for Development Group in Delta Delta took Iraq Development Group took Afghanistan I don't believe there was much crossover yeah so when did that happen that's kind of a jumble when all that happened but we kind of got kicked Out because the Army wanted to get their they wanted to be where the fight was and then when we moved it blew up over in Afghanistan so then they're like oh crap we want to go there they're like chasing it we were just you got it you

know what I mean but we were still sending guys to um Tyra we we were both places okay we're in multiple places and I think that one when all that was going on I think I was back in Iraq again I think I think I only did Two to Afghanistan and the rest were Iraq oh really yeah there majority of them were Iraq for me I mean it did couple like full ones over in Afghanistan okay more in Iraq we came home from your first deployment with gold how did you feel after that you had

you had been very busy yeah uh kind of numb and just went down the rabbit hole a little bit more of like hey this is priority the country's priority shooting bad guys is Priority I don't want any I don't and I put the kids in my family behind me and I mean not behind me as I like left them but uh you know that like I said those fractures turned into cracks they turned into gaping holes and it was getting worse and it's getting worse and I was doing nothing about it to try to make

it better my wife would at the time was like we go to counseling I said counseling's stupid I'm not going uh and just wanted to be on trips I would Volunteer for any and every trip just to be away from my house uh I just didn't want to deal with the emotions I didn't want to deal with the the noise of and this this is this is the truth but it's it sucks to say I didn't want to deal with the school my kids school I didn't want to deal with you know the freaking we're

having a plumbing problem I did not want to deal with hey can we talk about What's going on in our marriage I didn't want to deal with any of that I was like leave me alone I want to play with my gear and I want to go overseas like that's all I want to do that's all I wanted to do that's it I mean things were okay you know but you could just like like it just the the root of evil in our freaking marriage was just coming through and it was just like I started

looking at her with disgust Uh why I just she would not knowing it that was really me causing it she was drinking a lot and I was getting ticked off like you can't be drinking all the time my anger started getting worse her anger was getting worse I mean to the point where she during Green Team um she tried to commit suicide no during Green Team so before Green Team man I'm like and I knew like this has happened before like it happened one other time when was at team to uh she downed a bunch

of Pills I had to take her to the hospital get her freaking pumped her stomach pumped to pretty much save her life I'm like jeez like what are you doing so before green to I knew that this was there so before green to I'm like hey like please I need to concentrate on this like this is like my brain everything needs to be into this like I have got to be 100% Allin I have to and she's like of course of course I'm here to support you all that stuff and it was Like I maybe

a couple months in uh it was a seal reunion was in town for the first time I'd ever been so we went and uh sitting down with a buddy and his wife and my wife and we were having a couple drinks and I guess she she got irrit she always got irritated if like she wasn't like the center of communic like center of the conversation and we're just talking about stuff we're talking about Green Team mostly and you know we're interjecting and like we're Talking about other things and all that stuff and she got like

irritated she's like pulls me aside like hey why why aren you talking to me or I'm like dude if you want to talk like engage in the conversation like we're having a we're in a group setting and she got weird she stormed off and and about an hour later I get a call from the babysitter we had at that time two children so both my daughters and she's like something's wrong she's like uh Leah your wife Called and said or texted like take care of the kids and she's like it really worried me so I'm

letting you know I was like of course you did I'm like here we go again and so I get a call or text I don't know if te yeah te I think texting was yeah and um something she communicated to me she's like I'm at a hotel you will not find me I'm like this and she's like this is it and I was like gosh and I really just wanted to be like it's a cry for Help like let's get like I really just want to be here and drink with the boys that's I mean

so sub like just bad things so I started calling hotels trying to find out where she was it was on the fifth time uh I asked if she checked in and she did I was like you need to go to her room get her out cuz she's trying to commit suicide right now so they went up there she wouldn't answer the door I was like you need to get the cops there right now so we got The cops there and I was like you need to and I gave him permission like you can bust down

that door I'm like I will pay for whatever the damages are and get her they go in there she's in the bathtub by the bathtub with just blood soaked towels everywhere she sliced her wrists it was a bad one it's bad enough where she got put to a psych wward for a few weeks I believe believe so her parents came down to watch the kids so I could finish off Training and it was just like so every night I'd be done with training exhausted smoked and I'd go see her so walking in sitting down at

a table which just like very weird you know she comes out in a robe and what do you say I have no idea what do you yeah I didn't either what did you say I don't know I was like I mean you can't like what are you doing like what's wrong with like I'm sure there was some of that like suck it up was always my go-to Like suck it up like what are you doing like it's fine like what what are you flipping that about no compassion whatsoever zero compassion from what I can recall

I mean that was really me in the day which just zero compassion I would show some to my kids of course uh not to her not to her at all I mean there'd be those rare instances where itd be like H everything's perfect this is so cool but for the most part just I want to go work That's all I want to do is go work damn man but that was that was a that was rough that week I think a week or two she was there and I was like thankfully we were in town

doing whatever training at the command so it wasn't no crazy bad but dude it was just like and all I wanted to do was leave and go get like rest go see my kids I didn't want to be there you did want to see your kids though yeah I did want to see my kids like that yeah I always Wanted to see my kids always want to see my kids were they old enough to put together what was going on at that time uh I don't think so I think my oldest now she can remember

things she'll talk about it she's like I didn't know this after you know she read the book she's like uh excuse me listened to the book she's like I'd thought that when this happened that this happened so but she's like I I I could I get it now like okay so I mean she she knows but I never Really told him or I mean I never told him about any of this stuff yeah uh until my oldest was like 18 they didn't know anything and I got thrown under the bus by their mother for years

I never said anything because it didn't matter I wasn't going to tear their mom apart yeah I didn't want to do that that's not okay no matter what she did to me well you went back you went back to let's get back to deployment schedule You went back did you go to Afghanistan your second deployment man I don't know I I think Iraq I think okay and I I I can't remember I think this was uh when we lost Mike Nate and Louie and I don't know if it was I think it was like the

third or fourth deployment somewhere in there I I really can't they they all seem to mesh together uh but that deployment that that's the one that changed my world um We did we went to a Target and our team our troop kind of broke off we had three different buildings to hit and I went to one or my team went to one and then the other guys hit like another compound maybe 500 yards down the down this dirt road and uh we get up on the wall because we're doing call outs because we don't want

to go in because this network was known for suicide vest uh a lot of them because we we shot a couple dudes and every one of Them every single one of them had a suicide vest every one of them and uh so I'm up on this wall and I my vantage point is I can see through the door and it's light inside dark outside there's maybe a couple like dim dimmer lights on the outside the exterior of the building and I could see in there and a guy stops like right where my vision is so

I got my not even can't even use my DOT because it's light in there so I'm going to Red Dot uh on them uh with my doubler And I'm just on them so I can see them but I couldn't tell what he had he had something on his waist but I couldn't tell and I saw kids like pretty much when I could tell someone was around the way I see kids come in I think like two or three and he like brings them in and he Clacks himself off whoa so those kids just evaporated he

evaporated and that roof of that house lifted up and by the time it settled down that over press pressure Got to me and I was knocked off onto my back and I was like trying to come to like what was kind of you know get my bearings and I was like holy crap that dude just killed all his kids it was uh another time was like these guys are freaking animals these guys are savages they don't care about human life they care about their agenda or what they want to do killing the Infidel that's all

they care about enough to Where they're going to kill themselves and their children and I was like how do you fight that kind of enemy you know what I mean yeah it's uh it was Heavy it was heavy so that happened so the other team sent like two or three guys to help us out because they're like all right this is seriously where the action is we're calling in air support by a couple sorters um just taking as many people Out as we can because clearly they're like they're not coming alive so we're like pulling

in the arsenals and then we get coms on our radio that two guys our guys got shot and that was Mike and Nate and so we finished what we were doing we go back and uh Mike and date had passed and I remember I walked by and Mike was on the ground and I could see him I could see his face I could see the Damage Done by The machine gun fire and that was we saw a lot of death over there but death seeing from the bad guys and death from your guys two different

worlds and I can still picture that every detail everything and I and Mike excuse me Nate was still struggling he was still had breaths in him and I could hear the wheezing and hear him Fighting and then it just got quiet and then we had like had to move to xville we had to like dump some grenades take out as many dudes as we can uh at another building the third building um buddy Eric uh fro who we just actually had on the unafraid podcast uh he was walking into a building he like cuz we

were we were we were doing the pieing technique we weren't just rushing in because of these Suicide guys and he didn't see anything and he walks into the room and I guess there was some a stack of blankets and the guy was like in a fortified position with blankets kind of blocking it like kind of concealing it dude unleashes a full magazine of AKA uh and it went all around his body didn't hit him he came out of that room from what I understand and from what he said and then like the his number two

man just kind of like True Lies where He's like they're checking the body yeah he's like checking all his body didn't get hit once wow this not the first time I've heard that happening yeah so it was a it was a crazy Target uh and that was my first exposure to losing the good guys our guys and uh what ensued was more drinking to stuff it didn't know how to process it yeah you have some guys sleeping it off you have some guys can't sleep personally I would get a couple hours I Was up for

a few hours get a couple hours I like didn't know the difference between night and day I wake up thinking it's day it's night go to sleep wake up it's day did like just everything ran together like nothing made sense and we were on a standown after those maybe maybe two or three days and then Adam Adam Brown he injured his leg prior to that to us deploying he backf felt came in he was his surgery was done he was healed he came out and then a Couple of our army counterparts came up from Baghdad

to help us out and kind of see what was going on and then about exactly one week later was the night of the Super Bowl we like had this huge I'm sorry that was the night of the Super Bowl we had this huge party like planned to watch the game chill out get a bunch of pizzas but we ended up going out and then Mike and Nate you know passed on that one then a week later same same um same Target set Same same crew um we go to the another the the compound and we're

we're very weary now that you know they just took out two guys um you know they're blowing themselves up they don't care they're blowing houses up so we extremely weary like we didn't move up to it so we did another call out and nothing was going on like one dude came out everything seemed to be good then stuff started happening in The house started building up a lot of women and children were starting to get stuff by the front of the house so like if you can imagine like a comp like a house front door

and on that front door there's like an overhang a very like almost like a carport but the carport is like a huge slab of concrete it's not like a tin roof it is like a bomber with like two big St at the end to keep this thing like big ones uh rectangle ones I can I can picture it all and uh I I Called over to Louie Louie sront and I was like hey dude because he was our EOD guy I was like hey bro uh and I was taking over team leader that one because

my team leader was was down he was sick that night so I like just took over a spot for that that night so I came over comms I was like Hey Brother Louis for whatever uh nuke 04 I think was this thing called him up and said hey move up and try to to help out with the uh you know getting all the the the women and Children back and searching them making sure they're not carrying anything he's like Roger that two seconds later he jumps over a little three-foot wall runs up to that one

of those pillars and it was getting crazy like we by that time we had a team moved up um the other team that was primary entry moved up so on the this wall there's a door and then Louis over here by this carport or what whatever it was front porch whatever you want to call it and it was getting crazy And so I was like crap they need help so I come around my wall maybe like a the wall was probably up to up to my shoulders like I can see perfectly to take shots duck

down if I needed to it was like it was amazing spot it was like right in front of the door somewhere in there a dude got shot uh byro actually um and so I moved up right on Louie I moved up I got my gun and I and I put my hand on his right shoulder I was like what's going on he's like a Just craziness man just freaking like we're just trying to get out so you know they we're trying to get people out and I think I've told you this before I've got serious

Tom's disease yeah terrified of missing stuff I always want to put the breach on the door I want to be the first guy in the room if anyone's getting action I want it to be me when Dom got us kill and I didn't I was like a little little baby like why does he get to play and I don't you know what I Mean yeah um so for some reason man I I can still see a beita sweat going down his neck I can still smell it I can still see it I can I can

I can feel it for some reason I was like there's too many people here and it's like I heard this voice I got this feeling I can't even describe what I got it was it was like everything wrapped into one saying get away get out like an like an intuition whatever you want to call it whatever You want to call it something that said get away from where you are right now and go back behind that wall just came from and that is not me I've never done it before besides that one time that I

can remember I've always had to be there especially when we got to deal with some stuff we got to work I'm ready to work I want to work something told me so I told Lou I was like hey man I'm going to go back by the wall we got too many guys up here And I'm like are you good he's like I got this bro like I'll see you in a few I was like all right dude I love you you know we do our like little I love you brother so I like had my

arm on them on that shoulder I rolled out soon as I button hooked that wall out that gate and made that turn where I was covered the house exploded and it wasn't a baby explosion half the house was gone that team that was on this side was covered blew a Couple guys out 30 50 ft against the back side of the wall which I was behind dudes were covered in rubble and I was like what the heck I got I mean I got hit with debris on the back of the helmet nothing nothing compared to

what these guys did the Dust couldn't see anything like everything was just gone it was like well you would hear fog of War it was the first time I was like wow this is this is the real deal like I was just discombobulated didn't know What's going on I didn't know what way was up down left right didn't know I finally you know got my bearings WRA back around and like I'm I remember I'm in the middle of this Courtyard and the dust is just settling and I'm like what I left and what I saw

were two different things two different pictures and I felt some on my foot I'm like man what the heck and it was our dog Deo he was buried and the only thing that was sticking out was his mouth and he Latched onto the first thing that came and that was my foot so I I ripped out my uh my hiking boots out of his mouth and went back to where I thought Louie was and he was gone and I'm like what the heck and there was one of our our augment was over on the side

and I saw him like what's going where do you have Louie he's like yes and Louie was underneath the slab and so like there was a hole held Up by some Rubble uh some rock some Boulders from the house and we're crawling in there trying to grab him we can reach like a calf to try to grab some some fabric to like pull him out when I grabbed his calf it felt like Jello-O there was no bone structure it was like when that thing fell it folded him like an accordion and took out pretty much

shattered all bone it it didn't feel like a leg it Felt like a jell mold damn or putty and he was stuck under there and we couldn't get him out and fortunately the guys inside the building died I think there there were some random shots by our snipers doing containment stuff uh but we finally got them out our PJs came over with our I think they're called Sava or Savvy uh talk about more a little more detail in here but they lifted it up got his body out and we Just started X filling um I

think by Bradley I think the qrf came and uh xfill out and to this day like man what if I didn't what if I didn't come over that radio and say move up would he be here why did I hear that voice and he didn't I'm no different than him why these are questions that I somewhat still answer or ask myself is What makes why did I hear that why did I tell him to go over and um yeah it's been a it's been a tough one I'm sorry man it's War right yeah I mean

and and I know Louie I know that man wouldn't want to go out any other way I know that for a fact none of our boys that we lost they were they were warriors man they knew what was they knew was at stake they knew It and they were they were proud to do that job and they would do it again there's no doubt yeah but uh yeah let's take a break [Music] you're an EOD guy explosive ordinance disposal a Navy SEAL an actor a director a writer a producer a stunt Man a video game

director and a master of some self- [Music] awareness rumor has it and I want to know if this is true rumor has it somebody hit you in the face with a baseball bat and you took the baseball bat and resolved the issue is that is that true that is not true that's not true it was a stop sign Pole we went into solder city that was uh one Of our big ones um I had guys on the Zara hit when you go into a place where a guy is chopping off head setting it on the

neighbor's porch and then threatening them that they're next any day and they don't know when it's coming when you go remove that cancer there's like this dude like way the way the hell down there and I'm like he's like peeking out from behind this car And I'm like there's a dude right over there you need to keep eyes on when he pops his heads up pop it I was like that's exactly what the [ __ ] you're saying I like what makes you think that we can go down range for years and take live for

a bunch of people that obviously don't give a flying [ __ ] and I wouldn't do 10 times more for Those closest to me [Music] all right Eddie we're back from the break just had an emotional ending to that last portion there it's a good time for a break yeah and I want to I want to ask you because you've experienced more loss the guys over at Gold Team have experienced more loss than anybody else that I know and I'm I'm always curious how you deal with Loss initially and how I deal with it now

are two different worlds before I would drink and I would take pills or I would take any nighttime medicine I could to sleep because I couldn't sleep it it was it was always to the bottle beer wine captain of Cokes just so I wouldn't feed feel just so I wouldn't feel I would stuff it and stuff it and I didn't you know I didn't I I Didn't know you were supposed to feel we signed up for this for that we're supposed to do this this is just part of War but uh that's not the correct

way to do it because what that was doing is I'm drinking more and just stuffing is I'm drowning out my family I was drowning out my family I wasn't I wasn't present I mean remember I I I to talk about this as well um do you Remember American Sniper seen the movie right M Bradley coer comes Chris Kyle the character comes back I think from I don't know what deployment and he's he's sitting in his chair with a beer and he and it kind of the camera pans around and shows what he's looking at which

is a TV but the TV is not turned on he's just sitting there there and he's physically there but he's mentally checked out he's back over there and that's that's I saw that and broke into Tears man I was like that's it that's the realest thing I've seen out of any combat movie that I've experienced I was like that's it right there and I felt like that I'd be back home I'm not I'm not with you I'm here I remember going out to eat with my family or you know going to a pumpkin patch or

whatever it is and I'm not even paying attention I'm thinking about stuff over there I'm thinking about the wh ifs the should have couldas the why did I the why Didn't I all those things and just replaying these things over and over and over again nonsense it's like on a loop and I couldn't stop it and I didn't want it to stop it was like I just could I I don't know everything was about that it was about the teams it was about being overseas it was about fighting it's about the losses how do you

deal with loss Now versus then And we'll get into this but uh my remedy has been Christ 100% saved my life saved literally saved my life saved my life what is it about what is it about Christ that you find comfort in or maybe Comfort is the wrong word but when you're when it comes to dealing with death dealing with loss friends teammates what is it about Christ that brings you comfort that I I read there's a there's A verse and it's actually Proverbs 3 and I don't I don't have verses remember but this one

I remember Proverbs 3:5 is do not lean on your own understanding because we as humans we just don't get why this why that like why' I miss that one shot at sniper school I'll tell you why CU I was not supposed to be a sniper I was supposed to be a Navy SEAL and you we we we talk about these Un answer prayers and all that stuff but dude there's there's always this bigger and better thing usually if we're if we're doing the right thing and we're being obedient and uh it just gives me peace

I can't I I can't really describe the feeling inside what it did to my heart and my brain my soul I should say I just find Comfort like hey it is what it it doesn't mean I don't struggle I still struggle but I see the loss for what it is is I couldn't Control certain things and that's life man War evil good it will always be here always has been always will and uh he's just my he is my my pole in the ground that no matter what storm come comes through no matter how crazy

the winds are no matter how bad anything is I can hold on I can hold on to that poll and I'm all right I know I'm all right I I know It I know it I know he's got me it doesn't mean that everything's peaches and cream it doesn't mean that at all but I know he's got me and I know if I go through some troubled times I'm just going to get stronger I will get stronger and the life lessons that have happened getting my kids dealing with that struggle has only Made Me Stronger

didn't understand at the time time it's always hindsight and I kind of you know I keep Referring to this but that's I mean that's my story in the hot wash as I talk about it looking back I should have realized this or I should have done this I you know thank God I did this but it just it sues my soul he does it's just I can't explain it I ran from it I was terrified of it until I allowed it and we can get to that we'll get to that we get to that I

got one more question on loss and uh I've never asked this but I've always been curious of what other people's thoughts are and I don't know how to word it but um so I'm just going to do my best but when it comes to death and and loss of friends who do you when you experience a loss and it's it's it's a friend who do you who do you feel worse for do you feel CU we have we have two different kinds of losses happening in the veteran Community you have loss and battle and then

we have the suicide epidemic that's going on I go back to the used to like I dude I there's there was Eddie old Eddie mhm and then there's the new Eddie old Eddie would have been like you're weak you're coward how could you not handle your stuff you're an operator and this is how really you selfish piece of crap leaving your family like that leaving them like This that was my thought I have a different thought because I've been put in that position so I my mindsets a little bit different on it now what is

it now it's a real thing man it just sneaks up on you it sneaks up on you and all of a sudden you find yourself holding a freaking pistol and it's like what the heck am I doing luckily for me I was able to stop Myself uh or put it down and walk away but I get it it was just like everything my world was just crumbling in and I was always like how could anyone do that I mean how could you do that you selfish piece of crap and I find myself in the same

situation and uh yeah that'll humble you real fast so I have a different approach I take it way more serious if someone speaks about that I know it's very Real are some going to cry for help absolutely are some extremely real absolutely do you wish some of the guys that have taken their own life would have died in battle I I do me too of course it's What It's A Warrior's death man yeah right it's what we read about it's what we watch it's what we dream of it's different it it feels different it feels

a lot different but but one thing that I've realized is there's the battle that We refer to in the spec ops world that's over in Afghanistan Iraq Africa wherever wherever the war is but there's another war that we still fight daily um there's evil present everywhere we can see it pick up your phone scroll you'll see it look in the school systems you'll see it look at things government officials are pushing you'll see it like evil is real and it is rampant and it needs to be crushed Yeah well getting back to deployments got a

little Sidetrack there but I wanted to ask those questions before I lost them let's get into Afghanistan versus Iraq you spent a lot of time in Iraq we've talked about Iraq let's talk about what you were doing in Afghanistan Afghanistan was awesome um I like that a little bit better because it was a little tougher terrain's tougher the fighters a little bit tougher um and It really depended on the fighters uh where media was like is are they over here or are they over here and they would seem to really you know beef up their

fighters in that position but all in all Afghanistan was way tougher it was a harder Target they didn't care as much they were I mean they've centuries of fighting uh so yeah naturally and they're they're ruthless they're Ruthless People Um we I remember one we did One op and we usually go through the gate you know get to the to the door do a call out or hit them when they if we can sneak in without them knowing we're there and uh we we get there you know we kind of do an L we cut

a couple centuries I think the Rangers are pushed off blocking like the next block or two over they might be hitting another house over here and um we just take started taking machine Gun fire like crazy machine gun fire like they know you know I got talking guns over there grenades start coming over things are blowing up I'm like holy crap like this is like they've it seems like they the grenades are not stopping so we had to push back and go on this like the other side there was like the like a canal like

a low canal with a little wall was the best cover we could have so we went back and then my team leader came up and we we developed this Charge we used to I'm sure you've heard of the book bag charge you put it on the wall but it's like 20 lbs I carried on one up I'm like I'll never carry this thing again dude like like no so we worked on uh making a smaller charge that can do the same effect so we came up with like taking two blocks and the over pressure will

make a cutting with C4 it will cut through we can drop a thermobaric grenade in this little hole and then that pressure will bust out a Huge hole uh so we can get guys in so like all right we're testing it on this target so how the hell did you figure that out are you the one that figured that out I was I helped so my my buddy Travis who was a was our Master breacher he's like hey we put it started putting together and he's like we started like testing it because we did not

want to carry that 21 so he's like if we take he's like if you take two blocks the pressure from this and the pressure of This will meet and they cut because you know there's like the science of explosives and then we we like let's try it with a thermo baric to blow it out with the over pressure and it worked and uh we hit this Target and the First wall I did I actually grabbed Dom I was like let's go cover me so we run up there do the First on this like you can

see like on the back side there's like there might have been some windows but they were up top you couldn't see but all you Could see was like a flat mud hut like mud but you could see where the rooms were divided because it was kind of sticking out from the adjacent wall whatever you want to call it so the first one the one closest to us put the charge on there blow it and the explosives was enough I didn't need to do a thermo and we go up there we're clearing it and there's like

a donkey in there so like okay you're not like just kind of looking back at us like all Right you're you're good bro so uh so we go to the next one and I like I started like calling like hey give me my Chargers like I had them like space throughout the team like people carry a couple of them uh for this very reason so we go do another one a little bit further down where we think they would be blow that one down it was a kitchen no one was in there I go back

cuz we're like setting it up I'm running back getting in our little Canal command Detonating and there freaking so it's like it's crazy there's dust everywhere explosions are going off um I get one one more of my charges put it in between the two holes that I've already made put it up there uh blow it and I believe I I did not throw a thermo in that one either the second one I did uh but it made a big enough hole where I didn't need to do a thermobaric so the dust is going out like

the the dirt was like kind of make a little Ramp and uh so Dom kind of wraps goes far as the dust is so he was concealed by the dust go we just kind of pan we start pieing off like doing our cross cover and we just start seeing dudes and there's like machine guns like grenades start we fin took off the couple dudes that were still breathing they couple guys with their AKs in there just trying to take over the next explosive that was going to come and when I walk into this Room like

after we took out the dudes like we we call in the team and we're just kind of holding on our adjacent doors that we're going out to the rest of the compound and I'm standing and I'm like man this is really weird like the things you think about right and I'm like it was like like a a perfect carpet like a very nice carpet I was like huh interesting like I got to check this out later so we we clear the compound come back to that room I got to check this Out later put on

the white light to like cuz I want to see what exactly we just did cuz the dust I mean it was it was it was hectic you know mhm and I go to where I was standing and I felt it I put my white light down and all I see is a freaking eyeball stared up at me so the dude got flattened by the breaching charge like folded and uh I was like that was my first breaching charge kill and I was like that's awesome wow oh my gosh but It was weird man like you

just see this dude flattened out see the side of his face and just his eyeballs just like staring at you totally I mean he's done so you weren't on a carpet I was not on a carpet I was on his insides interesting yeah I've never felt that but dude folded his back had to been right on that wall like he had to be like on it that's I I can't even I can't even picture it to be honest with It it was uh it was weird it was weird but cool at the same time yeah

yeah like don't shoot at us or this is going to happen right what was the op Tempo over there in Afghanistan it it was it was big I mean it was it was was a lot it was fast it was we went out a lot a lot and the targets they weren't like cheesy targets they were like they weren't like one or two guys they were Like a lot of guys um like how many we did one these guys took over um whatever cell whatever whoever they were uh bad guys took over a school and

there was probably I think there was 11 11 bad guys on that one I mean they were just everywhere we had another time standing right by a door and I moved positions and about a minute later I saw looking down saw 30 I can't remember it's like 30 to 50 men run out of the door I was standing and like went Down and went down uh to the draw and back up they were getting away cuz I knew we were there wow poured out right where I was I was so mad I was like dude

that was a lot of kills I just missed yeah I was like dang it damn but dude I mean it was it was real like there was like it wasn't you know ones and twosies it was um like dudes like gathered together to go fight that's who it was it was different it was different in Afghanistan than Iraq I Mean Iraq had some targets where there's a lot of dudes but not not not like what I saw in Afghanistan were you on the operation that Adam Brown got killed okay so before about 2 weeks before

we I was actually going to go to um an out station for that one two weeks before is when I got custody of my my three kids so I my command uh My Head Shed knew I was like I can't I can't deploy I was like I'm going to be out of this command they're leaving me and they Just uh pretty much told me like hey on this deployment figure out how to be a dad they left me alone I was alone learning how to be a dad that whole time and about halfway through I

get a call about 2: in the morning from my team leader who was had to stay back too cuz he had to get surgery done on knee or shoulder or something and uh he's like Adam just passed and um and I was with Adam at Team two mhm Green Team I remember you Guys were really tight when you showed up to arpon in Afghanistan yeah he he's just a good dude to be around yeah he was just fun to be around his stories uh he he I mean nothing some things might have slowed him down

nothing stopped him I mean when he lost his eye I was right at the top of the stairs as he was coming up I was next to the guy that shot him in Afghanistan when he lost his fingers I was the one that put his Fingers back on and tried to wrap him up the best I could uh I knew Adam well he was a he was a dude Legend he had a great energy about him great you know and uh he was I don't think he was always a standup guy but he became a

standup guy he did I never knew him previous to to when he was a standup guy he was just a picture perfect team guy I was very upset all the time uh cuz I wasn't doing what I wanted to do he had a great way Of kind of mitigating that remotiv me and I learned a lot from him and we also had a conversation last night at dinner about and I've had this conversation with several other um former work colleagues or guests on the show and I mean Adam was he was just a he's a

great role model for any human oh my God yeah and he wasn't he wasn't a [ __ ] team guy like me or like you who was I mean I'll speak for myself who was boozing bar Fighting womanizing pills everything uh that you shouldn't be doing I was doing Adam wasn't that Adam was a family man Adam cared about his kids deeply spent a lot of time with him he was he was he was a man of God he made you wonder why he was like that that's yes he made me Christ curious he was

one of the guys I was like and he you're right everything you just said you're absolutely right he was he was different why him a lot of a lot Of it seems to me like a lot of the guys that die in combat it's like why the [ __ ] wasn't that me or why wasn't that Eddie or why wasn't why wasn't that the guy that's [ __ ] three other chicks on the side and not paying attention to his wife it's always the standup good example to others that winds up dying do do you

feel that yeah I question that a lot yeah I'm I Question you know a guy that seeks God why why that but I've also learned that when we look to God and like why would you do this that there's another there's a thing out there called evil that can get into evil men and and I don't it goes back to lean out on your understanding it's really not up to us to or our business to even know why yeah we like to think of it but I but I don't know why and maybe with his

book Fearless the lives that he's changing by His story maybe that's why I don't know I don't know these answers well I mean I I like to think about this stuff you know and yeah yeah it'll get you to go down this little thing called a rabbit hole it will it will and then you know when you think about it and and everybody everybody has their time and everybody has their their place yeah and they make their Mark and he made you Christ curious which kind of formed you into Who you are today which you're

spurning a very positive message and it's impct impacting thousands of people and maybe you wouldn't have gotten there without knowing Adam you know and now you are carrying that torch but it's a big torch yeah it's a big torch but um can you talk about that night that he passed yeah even though you weren't there I you know I know the story I think it was like in a tree or on a fence or on a wall or something like that and then got Nailed from an adjacent building but I don't know the details I'm

I was told but I don't recall I just know on my side got the call and we started drinking at 2: in the morning when I I woke up and just started doing shots and I'm like not again another guy and again and I'm like man like it just seemed like every deployment we were losing dudes it's like you know you question yourself like is our tactics Wrong like what are we doing wrong it just you know it's War it's War it's not supposed to go the way you think it's just not you mean that's

why we do contingencies that's why you have multiple lzs when you infill right because if this one's messed up we're going to go over here because nothing goes as planned we what does Mike Tyson say everyone has a great plan until they get punched in the Face it's very true war is no different you know just like business we're so set on this you can't be set on this you got to flow you got to flow you got to move what's the recovery time after over a Development Group what's the recovery time for the next

operation if you do take a loss I think the ones that I was I'm sure it's always different you know um not long maybe two to three days that's It I think so how do you Su the guys off we usually do a wood like stand which just turns out to be a cross you know we put our put their gear on it their uh their carrier plate carrier and then we put their helmet on top and one thing I've learned is we won't mess with it I remember with one of the guys and we'll

just keep it I mean just the blood the you you know those pads and the Mitch Helmets they soak up they soak up blood if you would like press on it blood would just seep out it was covered every one of the pads you know you got the different pads you can move around based on your head shape and com comfortability it was just covered with blood and you put that helmet on and the the weight of the helmet and you just see the blood trickling down this wood stand and it's just like oh my

God Man and you got the rifle out there and I think we put the boots out there we put them right by the flag pole and they stay there after we lost those guys they would go with us every every deployment we would make it we'd bring it holy [ __ ] and um you lose your guy you get the alcohol that they have and the next morning because you're you know you're running Ops at night and um next you know it's daytime by you Know by you get everything done and you get in a

circle with with those still there in bottles just get passed around you take it and you pass it another one comes you take it and you do that until every bottle is dry and the crazy thing about that is you don't feel anything you don't feel it I don't recall feeling it I don't recall feeling the drunkenness the buzz it was just Empty fluid it was you just don't you're not there your brain's not there man your brain is shut off from that like just shuts it down and uh then you walk around questioning everything

questioning all of it why why you know the why a lot of guys start to question why we were there in the first place do you question That again at the time no I was like Hey we're we're we're fighting bad guys like we're going to get the bad guys I was like I was sold on it all now knowing government and agendas I question a lot of it if not all of it I question a lot of it I do too and and I hate saying that I love this country more than I mean

more than anything but one thing I've realized is that government Officials you aren't the country if you're doing your shady crap you're nothing but a terrorist you're the exact same thing that we were hunting down over there you're just domestic that's why we do our oath right foreign and domestic there's a reason for that and we can see the reason so yeah I uh a lot of it's BS now and it hurts yeah thought you're really part of something thought you're making a difference which in a roundabout sort Of way you are you're killing you

know you're killing the bad guys they're not can beef up and get stronger but I I don't I think it's all comes down to an agenda and and unfortunately I don't think we're ever going to find out what that is I don't either but yeah but I totally agree with you I don't yeah let's move on to your family life so you missed a deployment yep got cussy the kids y got cussy the kids how did you get custy the Kids so around the depl employment storm of leaving and going she when we were separated

she's like hey her her family lived out in Tennessee here and she's like I want to go out there take the kids and live with my parents and get on my feet and go to school and I was always gone always gone and a shooting school that we go to quite a bit was right right by close to where her uh where she would be and I was like hey Just let me talk to him when I want to talk to this this wasn't like a okay sure like I had to really think about this

one and I was really thinking about her well-being and the kids I'm like I'm always gone I'm like this train ain't stopping which which it did but um yeah I was like maybe this is the best thing is for her to go cuz I really wanted her to get on her feet take care of those kids be a role model and do the right thing so They had a good example so she goes out there radio silence couldn't text couldn't call nothing the only thing that I could in like a span of maybe I I

don't know how long it was a few weeks a month two months maybe as I was out um in Oklahoma and I drove 6 hours to get my kids and she's like she she like you have two hours if they're not back in two hours I'm calling the cops on you and I did not want to deal with that being where I was so As a good little boy I dropped him off in two hours and drove my six hours back I took him out to dinner or like a early lunch or something like that

early dinner that was it and I was like this is enough so I went to my lawyer I was like here's what's happening this is this is BS like let's we got to do something so we get her to court and she paints this beautiful picture for her horrible for me of how I caused her to do this I'm the reason for All of it and she was probably right but I mean all blame was on me on the other side of you know of the of the tables and I'm like and I was and

I'm like that's not true that's and I just wanted to speak out so bad as she's she's telling this amazing Academy awardwinning acting scenario and uh but I had one card to play and I knew she was not clean and she was saying she was clean and before we went in there I told my lawyer drug Test drug tester and I'm like I volunteer myself I will totally do a drug test I know I'm clean let's go so at the end of all these stories my lawyer doesn't say they they asked me a couple questions

and I said I will stop deploying I was I was in there in court in a suit with a full beard Shaggy I look like you know the caveman from the Geico commercial M I pretty much look like that dude like trying to get my Children just all I wanted her to do was I wanted 50-50 custody to move back to Virginia Beach that's it I didn't want full custody I still want to work like I figur like I could still do you know get both of both of the both best world World both of

the best worlds and um so I I tell him I'll stop I'll do a training position all this stuff and uh he awarded her to stay out there and he just all he said was hey if he wants to talk to him he gets to talk to him if he Wants to see him you make it happen that he can see his children end of story period And so my lawyer before is like hey drug we request a drug test and the judge said Roger that so we both I didn't even she didn't even want

me to do one she knew better she did it and she popped and um she lied so everything she said was BS so the judge told the lawyers you need to move back to Virginia Beach right Now and uh she refused her lawyer dropped her and the judge found out about this and told my lawyer to tell I to go get his kids I was deploying in two weeks holy [ __ ] are you my command knew about it all my command about I I kept him informed I was like Hey and no one no

one's like team guy is not going to get his kids I'm like I'm not getting my kids that was the last thing I thought would ever Happen and uh I had a choice to get my kids or keep deploying and to be transparent I had to think about that yeah and it wasn't a long thought it was maybe a few minutes but it wasn't like yes awesome I get my kids it was like my world was closing up really thing I mean really really fast and it was it was rough that world closing up had

was had sharp edges and it was Hurting and my identity as a seal which I lived by was was was dissipating really fast um so I asked that I asked if I could do one more deployment my lawyer's like no so I got my kid I went out there my mom and my stepdad met me out there I got my kids and we drove back to Virginia Beach and went back to the house that I was going to let let her have because it was where the kids grew Up started to refurnish all that cuz

she took everything out like everything like I had no birth certificates I had no social security cards I had no shot records I had nothing I had a bag per kid I had no idea how my 10-month-old what diapers he had minus what I was in there I had no idea what he ate what formula nothing she gave me nothing she told me nothing zero I had to start fresh on everything getting birth certificates and all this stuff and just Figuring it out refurnishing a whole house getting groceries I didn't I had to ask him

like what do you guys eat I don't I don't I didn't know what they ate oh man so how old how old are your kids at this your son's 10 months old 10 months old Sammy my uh middle child she was five and Kayla was nine or 10 I think she was 10 so that mean Kayla Ste up the plate and she um she's a rock star putting those kids Through that life dealing with honestly a turd dad that only cared about himself was not fair it was not fair at all but they got strong

man I had some strong strong kids and uh we we did it man I mean my my thought process was like all right just keep them alive don't let him die that was everything man just like don't don't let him die and um we made it Through and my and the command was super cool with me figure it out figure it out started coming back uh in a little bit working in in the breacher cell like just picking locks and you know doing some RSO stuff and um but they let me like hey figure out

how to be a dad and and I did and you know started to come into work a little bit more and then after about a year of that maybe two I about a year uh we were going back on on Deployment my boys were going back on on deployment and my kids their summer break was coming up and we worked out I worked out with their mother like hey since you never see him you could have them for a few weeks in the in the summer cuz the kids still need to see their biological mom

they just need to and so I realized that we deploy a week after my kids are gone so about a month out month or two a few months out I I talked to my old team leader or to The command I'm like can I can I jump in and hear and they're like how can you and I explained it they're like Okay cool so I started training with them they train locally I try to jump in with them go to the Rain shooting do CB together do any uh I would have babysitters come by watch

the kids I'd go do a training exercise come back you know Dad's all freaking opt out and um I deployed that that was my last deployment I think I was going to do a It was like a 45 or 60-day deployment just to because my kids were coming back they had to come back for school and 3 days before I was going to rotate out to come back home extortion happened oh man and um we were supposed to go out that night so we were in jbad alabad and they were in I can't remember where

they were but they were we had the birds or or so like our Our 160th guys we had weather or something they couldn't they couldn't they couldn't fly so we didn't go so they couldn't get our birds so they use National Guard ones to go who do their up and I remember being in my you know we got a deployment you got your individual rooms and you got like a common area where you know the coffe is made and you got the video games and you watch TV and got the couches remember sitting in there

with my freaking feet Propped up just chilling watching probably rescue me or something some something good and uh my team leader comes in he's like hey bird just went down and he's like it's our it's our boy's bird like there was two of them one of them had all our guys and other one had just the air crew devastating regardless of which one shot down so obviously we're hoping it's the one without our boys less lives lost right so we all like rush over Um and they got it up pulled up on I can't remember

if we were starting to get our gear on or we were trying to get ESS situation awareness of what was going on but I remember watching the TV screen like this huge Monitor and they had uh the thermal uh from ISR looking down and you could see the helicopter down and uh there's bodies Spilled Out Of The Backs side that of the open ramp of the of the 47 and I remember seeing like in a Thermal you know heat signatures are white right M um and you could see their white bodies slowly slowly turned to

Black and their life was leaving them and they they were gone so we see that we finally like figure out like we need to get in there once we finally got it like crap that is our bird that is our boys like we need to go so we all go get our gear on we're grabbing Quicky saws in case we got to cut dudes out we're grabbing anything And everything that we think for this rescue operation slash keeping the enemy up a and uh they wouldn't let us go out they were sending the Rangers and

the decision was made by our CEO and at that time I wanted to I wanted to I wanted to stick my fist through his face I was like how how dare you that's our boys that like how how dare you but thinking about it now always hindsight Right uh he didn't want he didn't want those images to be our last images of those guys uh but you know s the Rangers more than capable of of taking care of that they did a great job they were out there for probably I think three days dealing with

that getting the bodies so we get the bodies back and we had you know I think it was a total of like 38 or something like that um and they had we had two c17s to get all these bodies back to Do and it was my time to go back a three a couple days later so I just I was one of the guys that there was like four of us escorted all the bodies back to do to meet the family members of all these guys and when I was was over there I somehow I

was told by my team leader cuz the command was got in touch with everyone and work Jason workman's really sneaks up on you Jason workman's wife and family wanted me To Workman was my boy wanted me to ask what his body back uh to Blanding Utah for memorial service and then take him to Arlington where he was going to be put in the ground so of course I would wouldn't refuse that so I talked to the doctor or or whatever who was dealing with the bodies and I had them point out workman's and most of

the Bodies were you couldn't they were charred they couldn't you couldn't tell who they were but Workman had some tattoos and they he he showed me his casket so steel caskets and um I put my my ground pad uh next to him put my sleeping bag next to him sat there laid there ate there and you know how they always tell you like on takeoff like please sit down buckle Up they wouldn't dare ask that just lay there the whole time next to him put my back on his casket and just escort him all the

way back get to Dover and then we land the whole family's there and just seeing got a whole new bucket to bust out with my therapist when I get back just to see the fames man and their faces and um and the tears and the kids that had no Clue man that their dad's gone their uncle's gone it was the most it was traumatic it was traumatic to try to find words to comfort them and those words they were hard to come by if if any what do you say by I know I know I'm

sorry he was awesome what do you what do you say And um and Obama came out and we and and I'm not a fan of his policies or anything whatsoever not a fan of him at all but I will tell you this he greeted and shook everyone's hand in that room and there was a lot of people he went to every single person and I was like I was like that's cool I was like regardless of what what BS you're invol D with I was like that Was cool and when we went to the hanger

to offload the c17s with all these caskets flag draped he stood um at a hand salute a very crisp one the whole time that dude did not move and we were like going on like three days no sleep I mean we're sitting down cuz we're like exhausted our backs are killing us from the pain of just operating and that dude did not move he was Just crisp did not move for 45 minutes like nothing the whole time and as much as I don't agree with his policies and all the corruption I think that he's may

be involved in I he earned some respect for me on that day for that for showing that right there to the respect for those men I have to give that to him I have to I saw it as my own eyes um so after that they have to do their autopsies and try to put body parts with whoever I mean Gosh however you do that I mean there was caskets coming back with just body parts like no names just body parts legs hands heads cast like I think there was like two caskets full of this

so I had time I went back to um Virginia Beach I got my Blues stayed one night I had my girlfriend at the time flew in from Oklahoma saved one night went back up to Dover to catch an Angel Flight with Jason and um so we get on the bird and there's another casket that gets on I'm kind of confused I've never done an Angel Flight before and it was a uh an army guy that passed at a different operation and his little escort was on there too so we fly we Dro them off I

think it was at St Louis they get off and then it's just Jason and I um went on to Blanding and I just Remember just like staring at his casket like just attempting to process things and I and I just could couldn't and uh when I got to Blanding his brothers were there he's got uh three brothers and his mom and his dad and they're amazing family amazing family and his his wife and his son Jax who was the same age as my son Tristan so that made it worse seeing that seeing him and um

and we had you know we had a Memorial service out there and we I was out there with him for two weeks because there's all these Memorial Services going around cuz there's so many guys and our Command like ched a huge bus I think a couple buses and they're just hitting all these spots and we were like 2 weeks in line and I'm just sitting out there with his brothers and every night what do you do you get tore up drinking suppressing stuffing cuz I know what to Do there's not a there's not a manual

out there that tells you what to do because no one knows what you're feeling no one knows your insides we can put a scientific name to it but they don't know they don't know and everyone handles things differently and mine was drinking to the point of passing out every night so I could sleep because I would not sleep if I didn't have something or at least that's what I Thought maybe I just developed a habit I don't know but I I felt like I had to have it to think about Mike Nate Louie Adam two

troop on extortion Josh Harris Colin Thomas guys that I did training with so I mean axelon and buds with him like just the just the numbers of like all these guys I went to training with and now they're all gone and it's like I knew before I went that that was Going to be my last deployment but that was like I was like okay I need [Music] to stop the Eddie show and think about your kids and I did not want to do that I did not want to get off that train it's like the

train was going on the operator gets left at the train station but the identity is Gone so um finally had his memorial service out there in Blanding and uh one of the guys at the command Jason loved Robert oen you know if if you're familiar he's an awesome singer and uh I I didn't even know anything about him until Jason then got me he'd always come over to my trailer when we were in Baghdad that second deployment that was his first we'd watch movies and you know drink and all that stuff and uh he we

don't we Play Robert 'en someone reached out to Robert kind of explain the situation he shows up at the memoral service gets up on stage sings uh coming home and finish the song everyone's in tears no one clapped no one did anything he got his guitar sat down in the most classy way I've ever seen like he Um he just you know gave us respect no questions asked from what I understand that that conversation was like I'll be there there was no oh are you going to cover this it was none of that it was

like I'm there I that was one of my fans and he did that and he was doing this I'm there that is America yeah that is America that is respect that is how you earn it by example and that man is an example he is a phenomenal phenomenal Man never talk to him I don't need to I watch I watch his actions the way he handled himself he didn't want to do signatures he didn't want to do anything he just walked in with his Johnny Cash all black suit on played that guitar sang a song

that Jason was definitely smiling down on did what he came to do left and then after the memorial service that night we went to a place called Spirit Cove drank of course and just talked Jason stories And had fun about the buses were there from all the all the people going to all these Memorial Services I mean we're we're just like can you can you imagine this like it's just death you're just consumed with death I can't imagine that just you're consumed everyone's like crying you drink too much you're crying you're not drinking you're crying

like but you don't know what to do with yourself it's like what do I do with my Hands you know what I mean you just don't know and uh after that it was time for him to go back to Arlington so we go back to Arlington and um we're we're there and they've got them all lined up next to each other all the guys that decided to go to Arlington and and Jason was right next to MSY was a really good friend with and uh Stacy and Jason had this thing for rainbows and sure enough

she looks back I'm kind of standing behind them you know we got Jax and I got Stacy family and I'm kind of behind them and she looks back to ask a question or something and she just looks at me she like pauses she gets like a weird look on her face and she goes there's a rainbow behind you wow I turn around and it was the uh brightest most colorful rainbow I've ever Seen and that rainbow stands for one thing and one thing only and I'll tell you this much a't homosexuality it's a covenant that

God gave and just seeing that I was done I was taken out of the knees emotions took over that I was stuffing and stuffing and stuffing and trying to be a Pillar of Strength for his family I was just standing behind him hoping they would not look back at Me balling it's took me out it was like internally took me out I was done so that we do the service you know do the put the Trident on the on the coffin I had a couple extra I had another tried and had to do MSY put

one on him and then put one on Jason and then went back Home and uh the kids weren't home yet and the rest it start to go downhill more downhill than before did that rainbow you saw did you start to believe in Christ more was that a sign for you I I didn't think about God then I didn't think about God then I I you know I chalk it up to what a coincidence how weird you know it's because of the Rain and the Sun and that's what happens right you get a rainbow I didn't

I didn't put the two together I didn't give it the time of my thought um it came right after that um I had to leave the command I was at the breaching cell and and I knew I had to do something I think I was at my I was like 16 and a half years in 17 years and I'm like dude I got to finish this out I got to get my retirement like I'm Not going to stop but I couldn't operate so I found out about the coordinator position that they had around the country

uh you were you familiar with that I'm not so you kind of like you got mentors like usually retired like seal swick EOD divers uh air rescue guys and you I think there's like there was like 28 around the country and the point of the whole or the the program was is to help train guys up get them more awareness About what they're about to go do because we're losing the Navy was losing so much money about guys showing up the water's cold and they quit well the Navy just paid for you to go out

here now they got to pay for you to go somewhere else so they like we'll start these programs and you kind of like run him through the ringer give them workouts a couple times a week kind of answer questions kind of give him some mindset mindset stuff talking about some mental Toughness and I remember my first workout I had like there was I think there was probably like 10 these like high school maybe like a college or two kids there they were like in tears and every one of them quit and I was like am

I being too tough and and I and I'm like and I didn't know and but my job was like Hey man like you need to know where you're going and if you're you're quitting now You're for sure going to quit out there like I'm I'm saving you I would like I'm saving you but the Recruiting Command it's like you got to have this amount of number you got to have this many and I start up told them like that's ridiculous like you cannot force these programs on individuals they have got to have their heart and

soul into it that's that's it it doesn't work any other way there is no I think I might try that it just doesn't work I mean you weren't Like that no I know for a fact you weren't like that you got to be all in you have to be all in and uh and I didn't you know it was ridiculous that whole recruiting piece like you guys are like morons uh to like give you get like you have to and like you're just like making people go like all right cool like if you need some

like we'll give this guy a shot that's totally gon to wash out and they do they wash out in boot Camp and uh so we did that so during that time drinking got horrible cuz I was away from my guys and I was just on an island I was in Tulsa Oklahoma no friends uh I think she was a fi my fiance at the time my children it seemed like the right thing to do moving out there because I get help with my kids and then try to build my business I started a contingent group

I worked on my degree got my Degree in Security Management uh because I was 100% tuition assistant like why not do it like I was just you know trying to do anything and everything to like try to stay busy uh to like not think about the past that I was not involved with anymore which which hurt was it hard for you to leave the command at that point or were you ready I did not want to leave you didn't want to leave I did not want to leave I did not want to leave but I

Knew it was the time for me to leave and looking at my kids and thinking about them over me which was hard to do to be honest it was the it was the right thing to do I I wasn't going to try to do more deployments pwn them off on this try to figure out a sitter for this trip or the I just like they needed a dad and uh I to step up to that and I and I um I messed up a lot of things as a father I didn't know what to do

I just didn't Know what to do I remember the kids would come home and I didn't know what to do with them like what do you do with these kids like you're not going to work on my gear with me like what do we do you know and then you just kind of then I like dug back to my childhood like what did I like to do let's go play wolf ball in the back let's go play tag dark hide and seek um and just like started to make sense slowly and then my uh girlfriend

of the The time she was a Christian go to church all the time would talk about God and I would just kind of like you know going back to my childhood when I would we had a long-distance relationship she was in Tulsa when I was in Virginia Beach and when I would go out there it would you know sometimes I'd stay as long as I could so she'd go to church Sunday morning I'd have her drop me off at a bar so I could drink and watch the Cincinnati Bengals play football well she went to

church I wouldn't go to church with her I didn't want to go to church with her I did not want to go in there I knew the things I would hear were going to strike me like a lightning bolt and I didn't want to deal with it I I I I started to feel it kind of like No And and I did that for quite a few times I was like drop me off I'm not going with you and I I kind of told her Like here's why like she's like that's not like that it's

I'm like you don't know you don't know I do you don't know I do and uh it kind of came to a head once I moved out you know I was doing the coordinator position starting conja group it came to a head we went out to we left Tula went to Oklahoma City for her work her brother who was her boss had a um like a work party had like a party Bus meet at this part at five we're going to go all night have a good time right up my alley so 5:00 comes Captain

and Coke and somewhere around 9ish 10ish I guess I'm blacked out I had one of her co-workers giving me lap dance right there in the bar in front of her all her colleagues and she pulls me outside and I think she pulls me outside and uh she's like you're hambers Yeah you are a mess and I straight up said word for word I will cut your [ __ ] face off classy right you said that to her I said that to her with her brother Sloss right there I didn't care I didn't care and of

course literally I didn't mean that but in my brain that's exactly what I was doing bright and I looked as I looked into her eyes that's exactly what I was Picturing and um that's one thing crazy about killing I guess is when you you know when you're engaging and some of those engagements are close real close not sniper shots at a thousand yards but like come here dude and you're holding dead bodies as they fade and you see those eyes looking at your eyes you see the whites of their eyes and uh you just watch

The Life drain from their Bodies and you love it picturing that was not a problem picturing that was a joy and I would never do that to her but in that moment hammered I was doing it in my brain and uh the next the next day I end up at my house uh cuz we were living in two different houses I woke up by myself in my clothes with shoes on on the couch and knew this was not good yeah I knew this was not good and she came over And she goes do you remember

last night and I go absolutely not and she tells me the story I just told you and uh we were engaged at that time she took her ring off threw it at me and she said I want this in my life or in my families because she had she had two kids as well and I couldn't say anything because she was right I had some things I needed to work out So it's probably a good time for a break let's take a break the Jihadi Manifesto was recorded right before his December suicide bombing which killed

seven CIA employees and a Jordanian agent at this base in eastern Afghanistan so everybody wasn't supposed to be outside there it was just supposed to be the GRS team to meet him uh Darren and the Jordanian uh officer were supposed to be there and that's it that was a last minute thing Everybody comes out to to form a greeting line and unfortunately that gets a lot of people killed that wouldn't have otherwise been dead today we will get you CIA te inshallah will you get you down and he boastfully showed off the trigger or the

bomb strapped to his body look this is for you it's not watch it's Detonator to kill as much as I can unbounce them there's like let go outform this meet and greet line Uh I don't know if you know this I mean we worked at the same Department over at CIA [Music] I want to give a big thank you out right now to all the vigilance Elite patrons out there that are watching the show right now just want to say thank you guys you are our top supporters and you're what makes the show actually happened

if you're not on vigilance lead patreon I want to tell you a little bit About what's going on in there so we do a little bit of everything there's plenty of behind the scenes content from the actual Shan Ryan Show on top of that basically what I do is I take a lot of the questions that I get from you guys or the patrons and then I turn them into videos so we get right now there's a lot of concern about self-defense Home Defense crimes on the rise all throughout the country actually all throughout the

world and so we talk About everything from how to prep your home how to clear your home how to get familiar with a firearm both Rifle and Pistol for beginners and Advanced we talk about mindset we talk about Defensive Driving we have an end of the month live chat that I'm on at the end of every month where we can talk about whatever topics you guys have it's actually done on Zoom you might enjoy it check it out and if zoom's not your thing or you don't like live chats like I said there's a library

of well over a 100 videos on where to start with prepping all the firearm stuff pretty much anything you can think of it's on there so anyways go to www.patreon.com vigilance Elite or just go in the link in the description it'll take you right there and if you don't want to and you just want to continue to watch the show that's fine too I appreciate it either way love you all let's get back to the Show thank you all right Eddie we're back from the break this been a very heavy interview it's been tough yeah

I know all right I know this is going to help a lot of people I hope so but um let's get we talked about you know you left EV group you're at home you broke up with the ex fiance or she broke up with you what's going on with the kids at home uh just you know trying to do dad life whatever what ever the heck that is Trying to figure it out and I mean this is this took years of struggling and still drinking uh I quit drinking after that night when I told her

I was going to cut her face off um I quit drinking for almost a year I think I quit drinking and and the reason why I quit drinking is she had me or she gave me an ultimatum to go to this certain conference but we'll get to that in a second but uh I mean kids are at school Doing their thing um I would do you know during the day I would do contingent group work or schooling or go you know train these kids to go to uh one of the special programs in the Navy

and uh then they come home and you know try to figure out how to entertain these kids make what's for dinner all that stuff just all the mundane stuff of life um before you quit drinking would you try to hide your drinking from your Children I would do I think I would put it sometimes in a different cup like just like a normal cup that I'd be using but usually no I didn't and I usually did not I would have like a glass like with dinner or something but usually that stuff would start when they

were in bed I would bust open the wine usually the wine and down a bottle sometimes two and then go to sleep but I usually I mean there was Times where I was like I don't care like I need it I need it right yeah um so but most of it took place when they were asleep what kind of pills were you on uh I had to get a lot of surgeries after I left um Dev group so I had to get my knee done my foot some hernas B shoulders had to get some some

anchors put in um so they'd give you you know oxycodone cot whatever the heck you want to call it and I fell in love with that stuff dude I was like so happy it was Like my happy pills and I would take those try to get more if I could and uh I would take it all all the time until like until the prescriptions ran out I would just keep doing that but that was really the only pills I would like like I think I need surgery on this like is it's bad and come to

find out it is bad um just to get some more of those pills U but mostly I would do like nighttime usex you you were getting you were doing surgery just to get the Pills yeah there was like there would be time like I could deal with the pain it really would bad like maybe I'll deal with it later but at the same time I'm like let's just do it now like I love surgery I love being put under just escapes reality and the pills those pills are nice yeah but then they would always run

out and um I would do um a lot of nighttime muex cuz I learned that they would give me extremely vivid dreams so I would do you Know one then I would have my dreams next night do one you know one teaspoon or one little capful and then when I wouldn't have my dreams I'd up it at two and I would do two and then when I wouldn't have my dreams I would up to three and then so on and so forth and then I was like okay I stop this but my dreams every single

night I was killing people in my dreams buddies would die um I was killing bad guys and I was Like my War my battle was like in my dreams just over and over again it was always in the back of a hel helicopter and there was just be bodies and just like see the guys coming at me and I was like like a video game taking them out sometimes my gun would stop working and they were like advancing then I'd wake up uh you enjoyed those dreams yeah I did that was back in the fight

yeah as Pathetic as it sounds to say right now I was in the fight in my head and um yeah how long did that go on for uh quite a while um the drinking mix with that stuff wasn't a great thing and I don't know exactly when I quit drinking uh I think it was after but when after the cutting of the face thing happened I pretty much had the ultimatum ultimatum by my uh girlfriend at the time now because she threw me the threw the ring back at me is she wanted me to Go

to this like Christian Camp uh which I didn't know was a Christian Camp really I mean I kind of knew but it just sound like the way it was sold to me or told to me was hey it's a bunch of dudes dudes you do a bunch of shooting uh bunch of food talk about some stuff like a it's like a men's Retreat and I had no friends so I was like I mean and it was kind of like hey you do this or else like this there's no hope for us I was like all

right I'll I'll do that and because I'm like I'm in the middle of Tulsa by myself I have her kind of and um I was like I'll go but I didn't know so this this whole thing was called it's based off of John eldrid I don't know he's got a book called Wild at Heart for the audience if if you have not read this book you and you're a man or or even have a man in your life highly recommend it um it's a great book for men uh and it kind of like kind of

tells us what we're supposed to be like We're supposed to be the hero in the story and it gives us great thing and you know I'm hearing all this crap for the first time like what what the heck is going on right here um but when I go to this Camp dude um like I'm looking for alcohol like surely there's like some wine or beer like looking for coolers open the coolers freaking sodas water like what so like already I'm like this sucks so I'm sitting down you get like your little lawn chairs like in

This open like conference area you put your little chairs down and you got a big screen and they kind of go into it so it's um it's like three days uh get there on a Thursday and you're done by like Sunday afternoon and the first thing it kind of like it goes into like uh father wounds how we're the hero you know you know we're built as men to rescue the princess like it's in our DNA and he kind of John Eldridge is like on this on the screen saying this it was it Was gone

through done through another satellite like church out of Oklahoma City but it was via you know Colorado where John outd was and I'm like this is this is so dumb I'm like what am I doing here like this is ridiculous and um he said something that really kind of like it really got me kind of hit home a little bit and he and and I'm a big movie buff you know like when we go to deployment we're watching nothing but movies movies series movies movies like We we've got to memorize like we're we're we're the

douchebags with the quotes right like what movie is this from like we that's just what we do I still talk in quotes it's ridiculous and my wife looks at me like I'm a [ __ ] and she's right but uh but he said if you he's like if you think about movies he's like it's built in our DNA movies have three things three elements that is in every movie There's a Hero there's a villain and There's a love story and right now people as they are Len are like trying to think of movies and I

can't you can't think of any Finding Nemo all the way to 300 there is those three components in there yeah there is the hero there is the villain and there is a love story and he takes that and he says that's exactly what the word of God the Bible is there's Jesus there's Satan and it's God's grace that we're going for it's That love it's that heart he wants to love us he wants to be loved back and he said that and I'm like and I was really more hung up on the movie thing I'm

like that is so true and he's like the Bible's all around you we just don't realize it like it's in every single movie it's the same thing different characters and I was and so they they use cuz they're trying to hit home to men to like stand up to be more manly And to like stand up for the right and lead your family which we have a a hard time in this freaking in this country probably across the globe and looking at me with my children he was right I wasn't a leader I was a

I was a failure I was not doing the right things I mean it was it right to stand up to take care of those kids yeah but I wasn't the one I was supposed to do I wasn't leading by example I was leading by talk which is BS and Um so he teaches that and he shows movies like Braveheart William Wallace he had a Villain Like the English right he was the hero save the Scots and it was a love story in that movie Love for the country love for the woman the Patriot Last of

the Mohicans all the Gladiator we can see it in everything and uh I was like okay I'm here this is actually kind of cool what's what's this I'm going to give it 100% so we kind of go into this stuff And um they they they have classes throughout the day and uh I just noticed as these classes go on there's probably like I'd say about 100 people from the age of like 16 to like 70 of like just men boys whatever you want to call them and I just start noticing every class like dudes are

getting picked off like they just start crying and I'm like I'm like get it together bro like there's other dudes around like suck it up right like you Were taught um how I was taught like suck it up what are you doing and uh uh I didn't get it I didn't understand it and um I didn't like shame on you it was more like what's it was more what what what's what's happening what I I don't have what that is what is that and so at the end of I remember our end of our first

course it was the F the first class or the second class they're like all right we they give you some Questions to like think about to you kind of ask yourself like hey please take your notebook and your pen and this uh this these questions and just go find a place outside and you know go pray and write down these answers and I heard the word pray and and remember if we go back to childhood like this stuff is kind of like coming out it gets me every time I talk about it Um and I

was like man like you you you you pose and I'm talking to myself here you pose and act like you're a man you can go overseas and face evil and take it to them you can take a blade and stick it in some flesh but you're going to have a hard time to go outside by yourself and pray and I had that conversation with myself and I was like self you're right So I went out there I found a little like uh outcropping of some rocks and like the sun just wasn't up it was like

early we got up like at 6 6:30 whatever and I sat down I said my first words to God ever I mean minus the please don't let me die on this op tonight as we fly in or I'm getting shot at as I'm trying to be as low as possible as bullets skip over my head yeah ever I wouldn't call That hey God that's without fear I need a hand out you're talking to him I was talking to him like he's my father this gets me man this gets me and I just started talking I

was like I don't know you I was like you know my past you know how you scare me and soon I'm saying whatever the heck I'm saying not even know what I'm saying and it didn't matter it didn't matter what I Was saying the sun breaks the top of the trees in this warm cuz it was chilly this warm Sunbeam Just Nails my face and just warms my whole body it just warm like right when I started talking to him like maybe a couple sentences in and I was like oh my God it's like that

guy got zapped through my whole body and um I chocked it up to as a Coincidence of course I mean it's at the right time at the right angle Sun you know comes up in the East that's in the west I mean just that's just happened to be here and that was it that's all that's all it was and I and I say all this in hindsight knowing now everything and uh I go back in I do my thing I write it down and but something was stirring inside me and uh I was curious I

I was I was curious to see what these guys are crying about I was Like think think about all my past I would always think about why I took my hand off Louie and and went around that corner um I wanted answers I needed answers and I wasn't going to find answers from any human on this Earth I know that and um I started going through more courses more classes more going outside praying trying to get better at it but you know I think I Know for me personally we always think that there's like oh

you got to do it this way this is the wrong way that's not it at all just like talk just talk God knows your heart man and uh once I learned that it's like it just came it just flowed and uh but I thought there was like oh step one okay step two nothing that you step three and that's a bunch of BS and uh I started just seeing guys throughout the the weekend get taken out And taken out and taken out and then guys like may I pray for you and I like I didn't

tell anybody this but in my head I was like I really want someone to put their hands on me and pray for me like I want someone to pray for me I don't this weekend changed my life um I don't know why I wanted someone to pray for me all that crap never thought I could be forgiven you know forgive of your sins I'm like Man I've killed more people I've done things that most people don't even dream of think of can't even think concoct in their brain I've done it uh from booze to women

to pills to killing gun knives grenades explosives nothing anything and everything all of it like there's no way there's no way you can forgive me and um I wanted someone to pray for me and The last night of this thing nothing's happening to me really I mean a little bit of something but nothing Monumental at the end of the um at the end of the um conf at the they have the bonfire and like they give you this like little Post-It note like hey the things that you want to get rid of write down what

you want to get rid of and I was like this Post-it ain't going to do it I need like a legal pad with like 100 pages so I Like give me some more those post titits so I'm putting down I wanted my drinking to go away I wanted my anger to go away I want a direction on how to be a good father I didn't want to be a slave to watching porn on the freaking internet I wanted to be there for my family I didn't want to be absent I wanted peace in my brain

from the stuff that we went through overseas I want a Clarity on my future I just want to be a better Man I'd be happy with that and uh you know you get around this you get a bunch of these dudes around the fire you got your little piece of paper and everyone goes around but I didn't know and you you say what you want to get rid of you don't have to but uh you know about halfway through I I got up and you know I said my thing and I I got choked up

I got really choked up and I threw it in the Fire and it felt good it felt good and um I'm like you know still in my head I'm like this is stupid it's a piece of paper blah blah blah nothing's going to change questioning everything testing everything not believing anything uh but there was still just something tugging on my heart there was just something very small just tugging on me enough to keep me engaged and uh I was walking away from the fire when I like everyone went and I Was like all right I'm

going to get out of here like I just like want to be alone and just go do something go to bed whatever I had no Mucinex had no alcohol like how do I do this um and this guy comes up to me young guy I was Pro I think it was 32 when this all happened he was 26 uh Kyle Thompson he actually has a podcast undaunted um and he he came up to me he's like hey dude that was really cool what you said I was like thanks dude and he's like do you mind

if I pray for you this dude came up to me I was probably 230 tattoos that was a big boy um he was not he was younger and he had the balls to come up and do that and that right there is obedience I've seen many of men like you you can just see them Like they're intimidated just to have a conversation with one from one human to another I'm not just saying me but with many people just because of uh oh he was in this movie or he's a UFC fighter whatever it is you're

still human I don't care it doesn't matter but he did not he came up and he did that and soon as he put his hand on me and started PR I lost it I it was starting to make Sense it was all making sense to me and uh so I talked to him for about an hour two hours at the end of that night went to bed and the next day was Sunday and we had like a um they play worship music but not like like kind of like rock you know um and they played

it every day and it's been like okay can we please turn this crap off so we can like get on with this so I can get the heck out of here for some reason man I'll never forget the Song I had to look it up it was by Matt Matt Redmond 10,000 reasons I was playing and the beat of that song and the words of that song rocked my body it was different something changed something changed internally I would say I don't know how but I do know how it just changed and I felt different

and I started to Smile you know when you're a kid you do something you're not supposed to do and and you're down on yourself and your mom or dad or a family member or maybe even close friend comes up to you and Embraces you or just kind of Pat you on the head and say hey man it's okay it's all right we all make mistakes that's what God did to me right right then and there that's what He did to me I can feel it and still being in the the hard-headed so am like it's

probably another coincidence maybe just I really like this song it's like dude when do you get it uh so I'm just like jamming out to the music and like it's just like it feels good like I'm like dude I'm like I'm like this is I'm like put my arm up I'm like man this is just Insane and um I was moved like I was moved internally like I was I felt different and so at the end they kind of like thank some of the presenters some of the guys that give some of their speakers some

of the guys that share their testimony cuz some of the testimonies man they're like hey dude I cheated on my wife I did this and they're they open up they're very real and I like I I really I appreciate that and I think that like that conference Kind of made me who I am now where I'm not afraid to be real and I will be transparent because all of us go through some something some degree it might it might not look the same it's a different flavor for all of us but we're going through some

stuff we're all going through some stuff some way shape or form relationship work healthwise we're all we're all going through some stuff but they did That but they were saying thank you and then one of the things is like they they said um we wanted to recognize the guy that we think did the most change and I was like well that's not going to be me cuz I haven't really talked to anybody and all that stuff so I'm like just waiting to listen and they're like Eddie Penny they call my name and I'm was like

wondering if I'm that guy so I go up on stage and they're like hey we can tell a change in You wow I always I always explain stuff like this man we don't really know what's going on like if you can imagine two boxers in the ring fighting each other they're looking head-on you know chest to chest I I have this is my vantage point right mhm the coach and the fans they can see looking in right they can see they have a bigger picture I just have this and that's kind of what happened That

that conference is um I guess they saw something that I didn't think I was doing or feeling or acting and they gave me this pin it was made out of uh an olive tree from from Israel and it had like a cross on it and I still I carry that pen with me everywhere uh and it and I started crying right there on stage in front of all these men and I didn't care I didn't care I was about 80% sure that I found God I'm like okay wow like so this is real this isn't

this is real and I think back to things like Adam said and other guys that I deployed with and I'm like starting to like I start to to see it I start to see these deployments I start to see certain things why this happened versus this I start to see my life experiences why I'm getting the why answered um get in the car drive back to uh got was getting a ride Um from my girlfriend's brother same one that took me uh he took me back to okahoma City to get my truck and I drove

from Oklahoma City back to Tulsa and I called my girlfriend at the time slash fiance maybe depending on the day and uh I called her and I tried to explain the weekend and I couldn't talk I just start crying i' cry 15 20 minutes I haven't Cried like this I mean I stuffed it for decades I thought I was good I'd call back I say a couple words i' start crying again like I have to call you back couldn't even could get could even muster the words and I tried this throughout and then finally I'm

like hey I'll just talk to him when I get home like I just got that out real quick and I hung out the phone because I was going and I started Crying again I cried pretty much the whole drive home I I like I just didn't understand but in that moment I felt so loved like I just felt so loved and I'm like all those things that I'd hear or I call you a crazy Christian or you bible thumper or all these things it was making sense it was just making sense to me it was

just I could feel it inside and um and so I get back I tell Her about the whole weekend and supposedly she went up to St Louis with her friend and she had no intention of coming back I guess when she was out there she went out to a bar and she was sitting on some couches and um a fight broke out and some dude got pushed into her knocked her off her like off of her couch like knocked over the couch and I guess she got some kind of something and it's like I I

shouldn't be here and her and her friend like drove back that Night and uh she's like she told me that she's like I had no intentions of continuing this relationship after this weekend she's like I wanted you to go just to help you and so we worked and I think that's when I decided to quit drinking um I quit for a while but it wasn't I think it was maybe 2 or 3 days later I'm in my car driving from a workout or something and uh I pull up to this red Light just turns red

there's like this car wash over to the side and they have one of those like blinking sign like the red where like it flashes like save 10% or you know buy a car wash and come back in a week for a free one and I'm I'm sitting in my car and I'm like show me I I'm like I just I just straight up saying hey show me show me I'm saved show me I'm saved and I was getting I was getting aggressive I was like show me I'm saved like I don't Believe this crap I'm

like was testing him and um even though this happened this happened like that's that can be explained this can be explained this can be explained like show me show me I'm saved cuz I'm like I've done this and I'm I'm crying at this red light and I'm talking if anybody's you know parked next to me this red light they're going to be like this guy's Looney probably should call the cops before he kills kills us or himself and I look over to The sign and all I see is one word saved sa a ve d

That's it one word it wasn't save 10% it wasn't pulling now to save $2 it just said saved that's incredible I saw that and I'm like I'm yours I'm like sold I'm like sold so um at the end of that conference they tell you um I like to go all in on everything like I want to be a seal I would read everything listen to Everything watch everything to try to be the best and they would give some books out they'd be like hey you should probably start off with this book you know it teaches

you about prayer and I was like okay if you say that's what I should start out with I'll go buy that book and they like oh this is another one but it's it's a little more it talks about spiritual warfare and so I heard I heard the word War Warfare I'm like what like what' you say I'm like that sounds Like something I would like and not knowing or not believing or just not even taking the time to have thoughts about that about the evil and um all that stuff but um I started with this

prayer prayer Life Book and I was like okay this is like boring this is like trash like no wonder why people don't want to be Christians this is weak um and I was like what's this spiritual book I looked at my notes I found it and I I ordered it uh and I started reading It and I was like there's there's a whole another world there there the evil isn't the evil over there I mean it is but there's evil all around us and like just like those like if you have you got to question

yourself like why do why am I having this not good thought right now was it provoked by something a lot of the times it's not like why all of the sudden do I want to cheat on my wife why all the sudden do I want to leave my wife why are my kids do I do I want to Give them up for adoption like If we're honest with oursel we have maybe not those exact thoughts but thoughts like that like that guy that just cut me off I want to get out and rip off his

freaking head yeah why do we have those thoughts and if you a Believer and you believe in that spiritual warfare that you got the good and evil then there is this Unseen World that you know you got certain forces that will put these evil thoughts in your mind um and you really Sit down and think about it in my opinion it's very real and I look back um I I'll I'll I'll go this way I did not it was not easy I still went back to drinking I separated from my when we we ended up

getting married I separated from My Wife and started sleeping with everybody I could and I would call I would call myself a Christian because I believe in Christ and all that stuff but I was still doing not the right things which is where To be honest with you most Christians live in that world and I was that guy I was that guy uh thinking I'll be saved um you know I was I was more of the the talker not the Walker you know I wasn't walking in obedience the way I should be and um it's

kind of funny like talking about this if I was like me 15 20 years ago I'd be like okay so my that future is a freaking Nut Job i' be like yeah you're you're you're crazy um but Um I wasn't walking in it at all and I was drinking and my relationship was falling apart and I was doing the wrong stuff and then one day my kids were at school after I like moved like we moved in we ended up getting married we moved into a house like 8 months later I moved out of the

house oh man got my own freaking house I was just I was a freaking wreck dude I I shouldn't have been a relationship I couldn't even I couldn't control this Even after come you know people think like oh you should be fine you're a Christian dude there's a war going on you still got to fight daily it's not easy it's not easy it talks about it in the Bible all the time like you got to fight like you're there's a fight and that's where a lot of men are failing they just they're a pushover I

was being a pushover I was getting trampled on by evil I mean that's all you I mean that's a great word for And I found myself in my bedroom when the kids are at school and I'm just sitting on my bed and there's a nightst my nightstand is right here and my my good old Sig 228 is sitting right there and I just look over and I hear a voice yeah this is a way I've never thought about suicide in my life that's why I'm saying why do those evil things pop in your brain because

there's a different side there is stuff going on around us that You just got of and people call me crazy I don't I don't care uh um based off of my experiences uh I picked up that gun and I remember holding it right here I just like was thumbing it touching it feeling the cold steel and I was like yeah it's at time enough is enough I'm done hurting and um I had like this view of like a bird's eyee View looking Down at my room and seeing my lifeless body with my brain splattered big

old pull of blood very detailed very detailed being seeing all the body parts and mutilations and disaster I saw it was easy to to visualize right and I pictured my kids coming into my room after school with their backpacks on see my lifeless body and what that would have done to him and I I Put the gun down and I stood up in a freaking Rage and I was like what the [ __ ] am I doing and I'm like my God my God and I and I start cursing him I'm like you say you're

the Savior and all this stuff and I was mad man I was like how could you let me how could you let me do this you're supposed to be healing me and I blamed him which was wrong and I got out of my house and I went to the gym my my therapy and uh that was my that was the one time where it was about that time to clock Out and um something was wrong man I couldn't figure it out I was going back to sleep issues I'd be up for two days straight sleep

for a couple days be able to sleep for a couple nights up for a couple more nights I couldn't figure it out I I'm like what is wrong with me and then a buddy reached out um Ken and he's like hey there's this brain Center down in Dallas Uh called cerebrum and he told me about it like a year ago and I was like yeah I'm good dude and um and I'm like maybe that's what I need to do because what I what I failed to mention earlier when I was doing the RSO uh when

I was a breacher cell I would you know watch other like we'd have SWAT teams come in and or other units do the breaching stuff and I would just make sure they're doing it you know safely And they would use uh just like deck cord like not a big explosive right not like a c like uh C6 strip or something like that just like a basic like let's get the effect of like this of get of the explosive and these and the and the over pressure from these weak charges would go off and my head

would be pounding pounding compared to the charges I was do everse I mean you I had Part I mean times where I thought my my my pants were ripped off by being so close to a freaking charge and I'm like just having your bell wrong you just like but I fed off of it like I told you like the pain the the the pain for some reason feeling that amp me up before I it was like the a fighter walking out to the ring and they got their music playing that explosion and that blast feeling

that over pressure on my body was my song as I walked into the arena Which is some bad guy's house that was it and uh but towards the end it started hurting I like I had to I was like I can't do this anymore I can do it from way back here but it was so bad every explosion I was like it was like almost took me to the ground a couple times it was so bad damn so I I thought about that um when he when he recommended it a second time to go down

there cuz he asked how I was doing I was like dude I'm struggling man uh my workouts were Struggling I wasn't eating as much as I should and if I was I was eating crap I was angry with my kids I couldn't take I would start yelling at people at the gym for not putting their weights back I mean it was that was a jerk that was a punk that was a that was a 100% tier one douchebag so I went down there and they did all their stuff on me did all their crap and

definitely had some some spots in the brain and uh they did a bunch of like to Therapy to kind of get it back and I got back uh after a two we trip down there and uh I sat down to work the first day I was back and for the first time I sat at my computer for like 6 hours and like was just knocking out work I was starting to get my 7even to n hours of sleep at night it it was like someone pushed the reset button on my body damn and it it

just uh it it helped a lot it helped a Lot dude uh so the brain the brain definitely had some stuff going on that I was oblivious to I didn't realize how angry I was I didn't realize the effect that all the drinking did you know I was I was so busy trying to stuff my pain and think about my pain I didn't realize the pain that I was causing my family extremely selfish let's go back to that weekend The Retreat yeah Christian retreat at the beginning you talked about when you saw Jesus as a

child it scared the hell out of you did you think about that mhm what were you thinking I saw the reality of it if you if if you remember in the way it was was when I saw Jesus I wasn't scared mhm when he left I was very scared my opinion and my I believe like know I was deceived by the devil until I Was 32 years old from that one day he used the darkness and made him look to be the boogeyman he wasn't the boogeyman I believe that I believe that with all my

heart 100% how long did it take you to replay that in your head just now no at The Retreat were you thinking about that day when I I I was scared to go there but I'm like man like I just got to go Um and do this I think it happened probably there might have been little clips it happening when I was there but it happened more after the fact when I started to read that I try to read the Bible and started to seek Him and listen to to to people that talked about him

but the thing is man is like that that was was weird about I wouldn't say weird about me but is where I feel like my Calling is now is that there's not a I I I feel like Christianity the church is very watered down and it it it it's um it's like it's designed for women like I'm not I'm not I'm not hearing I hear a lot I go to church or or you hear something and it's like ah let's love each other we have Grace we're going to you know turn the cheek all that

stuff we're g to we're going to be kind to each other no matter what happens and that's great that's good That's good to have love and it's good to give Grace and it's because we all mess up and it's good to give people Second Chances and it's good to forgive that is good but there is a warrior piece that we are called to do and it is the men are failing they are failing they are failing they are failing and it starts with that mindset and I believe that men just need to be called out

in a positive way so they can realize their potential Like you have got to realize your potential and what you were created to be and I believe you're created to be to lead your family and stand up for evil you've got to expose the evil and you've got to stand up for it look at our world look at our country yeah what do you hear the most evil because the good people that really have good in intentions and goodness in their heart they're keeping their mouth shut and the big reason is that because they're Afraid

they're afraid for someone to come out and they're afraid of any tension they're afraid to be confronted cuz they want go there oh I don't want to you know wrestl feathers like that's not you're called to be and they're like oh well Jesus like he was okay cool read the Bible Jesus was starting crap all the time against all the people that were freaking like that were more legalistic and um yeah I think that's my I think that's like where my heart is taken me is like to bring in that Warrior mindset is like from

the battlefield to this battlefield uh there's a lot of dudes that are good men and they just don't have the leadership or the knowhow I mean if you don't know you don't know and with what we're surrounded by we are the product of what we are surrounded by that's like it says don't hang out with the wrong people if you listen to a Bunch of Death Metal satanic music guess what you're going to start believing you start eating a bunch of donuts guess what you don't go to the gym guess what you hang out with

a bunch of smokers you're probably going to start smoking it's the same thing we are surrounded by and I don't mean this in a bad way but at the same time I mean in a bad way we're around some weak people and it's not okay it's it's they need to stand up they need to rise up and they Need to speak out and they need to lead by example and I was so guilty of this and until recently I'd say probably the last year or two it's like I mean since I found Christ it's been

getting stronger and stronger it's kind of like when we were in buds right we are this um oh we're we're we're cool guys we we you know we we did buds yeah but we are way better after we did our next school at Jump school right we were way better after sqt we were way Better after our first deployment we were better than that after our second deployment and we just get better and we get better and we get better and we train and we train it's the same thing here in life and the same

thing in Christianity world is you learn to get better like crap I need to stop drinking like right now I'm like I got to stop cussing like I don't I want to better myself and I don't know what's next hopefully it's not Sweets but yeah I got like it's just like dude it's just bettering ourselves like why would we not want to better oursel and there's that evil in the world that pushes everything but and here and here's an example of that around around my house it's a newer development kind of like our area we're

in right now and they've been putting up new stores new restaurants in the last Year Marble Slab Cold Stone great American cookie all these are phenomenal places by the way um Nestle Toll housee cookie Nothing Bunt Cakes a pie place a cupcake place Tiff's Treats which is a cookie place a cinn not a c a bun bun place but a sort of like c a bun but you get to like put a bunch of other toppings on it all opened up with an square mile of each other wow you eat and I'm just going to

use this as one example because there's Many you eat a bunch of crap you eat a bunch of crap and you you know this from personal experience I know this from personal experiences our listeners know this from personal experiences you you don't function good your energy goes down you get that freaking food coma you get that Sugar Rush then it drops and you just like turn into a miserable piece of crap you don't have no energy and that filters over to your kids or to your Colleagues our society is not helping our case we preach

all this stuff oh we need to be healthy oh we need to exercise but you weren't you weren't hearing that during all this Co stuff were you no is is e because they want you to push whatever they want to push we know what they want to push they want the the dollars but we are surrounded by people with Cruel Intentions and if you don't stand up and if we don't rise up you will succumb and you will be a Victim period I mean we talked about this a little bit last night yeah it's um

it's sad it's very sad yeah let's take a quick break promise to uh solemnly swear that the Tes amid fresh reports of Reckless Behavior by Blackwater in Iraq Blackwater CEO Eric Prince made no apologies to a congressional investigating committee I I disagree with the assertion that they acted like cowboys and it says three Senators Joe Biden Chuck Hegel and John KY the future vice president secretary of defense and Secretary of State respectively POS while waiting for Blackwater rescue their US Army helicopter got lost in a blinding snowstorm and set down in Taliban territory on the

side of a mountain do not ever discount the Iranian influence on the Biden Obama administration then as there is now he said Mr President give us the authorities and a billion dollars and in 3 weeks the Flies will be walking on the eyeballs of their enemies Prince said his employees act with restraint and professionalism he boasted that none of the US diplomats he has paid to protect have been killed or wounded it was a great honor that they turned to us cuz it was a very important mission right cuz the CIA is the ones who

made that Victory possible for the United States we've had a better response from Blackwater than we have From the state department we fought back on all fronts the one place that they had us over a barrel was the state department Witnesses say the two SUVs were ambushed as they drove through town another Convoy of guys that got ambushed and shot up on the Baghdad Highway the contractors worked for Blackwater security a company that protects Coalition Personnel knowing that the clowns at the state department and the Obama Administration did everything they Could to block a program

like that CU it's not something they directly controlled it is such a mess it is such a FedEd swamp Trump is right to call it a swamp it is [Music] [Music] [Music] [Laughter] [Music] all right Eddie we covered a lot we covered your your career in the Military we're covering your transition out and how bad it got at home how you took your kids where we going from here so after Oklahoma we were getting a divorce with my we we did we got married and that was a very I mean I think the total marriage

was a year and uh Anna she I I take full responsibility for that man I was I was drinking a lot I was angry I was mad at the world I didn't realize what I was doing And I don't use as a as an excuse at all I just I messed up man I messed up hard and um so I had no one to help me with my kids I started a contingent group uh risk mitigation Don in security before we get into contingent group we talked about why you left Lou shoulder why you went

yeah so that kind of goes back to the I always wanted to know why [Music] why why did I hear feel or sense or Whatever I don't I I can't even I can't even put a label on it what I felt or heard um why did I leave that position and he didn't and that was a question I asked myself forever and and it was the only thing I it's it was God it was God his was something pulling me away from there and now I question why me and not him why didn't he hear

it or feel it Why have you come up with that answer I have I got to be honest with you man my life has done some twists some twists and turns and the seal thing was always a passion I just knew it I I just knew it I knew the military I I just knew it probably the last year My mindset has gone from that to more of like like my faith like I just want to share the word I want to share my story and show that God is real that that our society will

do anything and everything to push it aside from the pledge of allegiance to not discuss certain things in school and in my opinion taking Faith away is the number one thing that is destroying this country it ain't the people people suck because there's evil You take away the good but still leave the bad what's going to happen evil will reain and I believe that's what's happening and I just I have a passion I have a passion for God my heart is for God and I mess up and I and I don't like some of the

things that I should do I want to do some things that I want to do not him um I still fall into that trap at times and need to pull myself out but he Always pulls me out uh but that's just where my passion is going I want to I want to I want to tell my story and encourage others that's that's where we're going well you're definitely doing that there's no doubt about it and it's not it's not even me doing it it's not even me doing it but it's it's awesome man it just

makes me feel good it makes me feel alive it's been my Cure this is as Twisted as this thing still is it's good from where I was to where I am now I look back I'm like oh my gosh I I almost took my life I almost took my life and that was not in the cards it was not it's not time and I question sometimes like what what what what what do you have for me what do you want me to do and I feel by the certain circumstances and the people that are Coming

into my life and doing certain things I know what I'm supposed to be doing and that's I'm I'm his freaking Warrior I am a warrior for him and I'm going to lead other people to fight good for you yeah when did contingent group start so contingent group start Ed uh when I was in Tulsa I did a Contracting job with a friend uh that I was uh that we were team2 with um Good Old Joe JLo and uh so I started on some contract with him I was like dude we could bring some more people

into this uh so I developed a company got the insurance so like guys could fall under the the um the insurance umbrella and just started it from there and just kind of morphed and uh finally got a I got a really good client that does a lot of work down in Central America and then we're starting to do a lot of trips and then other clients are Reaching out and then we're kind of adding in driving Services armored cars up armored intelligence reporting assessments it just started kind of like we're tracking money and then we're

doing this and all this stuff just started happening all right now we need to put this freaking huge security system into this freaking huge building uh and not just your cameras but like we need drones flying around we need this we That I'm like okay and we figure it out and we get it done just got to with our Network I mean we got all the guys pretty much on our phone ready to call yeah you know when we were talking about contingent group yesterday I had no idea how indepth and technically Advanced yeah these

security systems that you are putting together for these clients are I I thought it was uh all right he's probably going in and wiring up Some some camera systems on the house and and maybe putting some reinforced doors and hardened windows in and when you were describing me describing to me that the the technology I I didn't even know that [ __ ] existed yeah I mean it is incredible and that's not me that's the guys that that's their specialty doe I'm kind of like the bigger overall like manager like we need to I I

kind of go into the assessment I look for the weak Points I'm very good of thinking like a bad guy like are we need to fix this we need to fix this you probably should think about this like do you travel okay let's put these you know protocols in place so we just develop this whole it's not just the cameras it's not just like hey making sure you got you know um a license plate reader out by the street it's all of it together because not just one thing is going to protect you it's multiple

things right like we carry a Gun carry backup magazine now we have a blade maybe I need to use my car so it's just like you know putting those layers of protection around the individual family organization whatever it is and it's it's cool it's um everyone's different what they need I mean how many how many you probably don't even know but how many different aspects of this business are there I mean you're wiping people from the internet you know what Cleaning it up cleaning their names up from the internet I mean home security business security

travel security all of it personal protection everything I don't have an answer for that question I don't know how many things we do it's a lot I mean I mean from a simple of a background check to um you know putting in the most advanced technology to keep you safe based on an asset to someone traveling overseas and Knowing what what it's like over there to going with him uh to pose as a camera crew because we're going low-key whatever it may be uh we do it all what is uh what's your typical client base

what whatp type of client are you looking for with contingent group uh more it's more higher end it's definitely on the upscale or or like an organization um but there's some smaller things that I mean individuals need protection or just Like hey let's monitor this and we need to do the right things to just protect them it just it really just depends but it's more on the upper end the majority not all but the majority okay it sounds like you're kind of stepping not a contingent group it sounds like unafraid motivational speaking becoming an author

spreading the word of Christ yeah is your New Passion that's the passion man and contingent group is sounds like it's a Well greased machine now you don't That doesn't need all of your attention right so let's which is hard to walk from when it's your baby yeah it's like ah I'll come back I understand but I'm still fully engaged in there I'm still don't think I cuz I do enjoy it still it's just I'm being led I'm being led and I got to listen yeah well I mean it's when you were telling me about that

yesterday it really blew me away I was like holy [ __ ] this is uh way bigger and and way more Advanced than I yeah imagined but let's talk about unafraid now so how did how did that start did this start with your wife no so my wife comes in at the very end cuz the book was not done so this book the first thing that I come up with came up with for name assess was facade and it was I was the facade I was the poser I was the fake I was this Navy

SEAL right but below I was a bag of crap I was I was weak Physically strong but weak mentally and emotionally very weak I wouldn't say mentally uh but one night before the suicide piece like right before wow it was like right before that's interesting I never thought about this wow I woke up about 2:00 a.m. and I just like thought heard that should write a book and I was like that's stupid like do you not any Navy Seals write books I will not be a part of that category that's exactly what I was telling

myself and I couldn't go back to sleep and I literally was like fine like a little kid went to my office got my legal pad got a pen came back to my bed propped up my pillows started writing and that night I wrote out pretty much the outline of this book uh so I went [Music] Into in depth to give it some to give it the meat and potatoes of it and I didn't know where to start so the one thing that I knew very well was the chapter about Louise that night um I knew

everything I knew the details I knew the way things touched I know the way things looked I know the way things smelt I know how I felt I remember everything so I started that chapter and I did that chapter and as I'm writing that chapter I'm balling I'm Losing it and uh I'm like I I had to like take a break and I went back to like my childhood wrote about my childhood then I went to the Marines and I had a specific incident in the Marines where I like turned the corner and like I'm

now a man when I learned really what mental toughness was and um I wrote about 150 pages over the next couple months and I just I don't know what was The turning point in the Marine Corps uh we were I'm sure you've heard of like the sand fleas down in Paris Island like these little bugs they just bite you they suck they are so annoying it's just like a tick or a a bee that doesn't hurt too much it's just like it kind of stings you but they have tons of them down there and we

were we were Drilling and I just like had my rifle at right shoulder arm so it's like laying like this and we're just standing there And this one of that little sand flea kind of comes up and lands on my forearm and I'm kind of like looking on my peripheral vision like looking for the instructors and I think I'm clear and I kind of just do this kind of wipe it away and all I hear in this deep voice was recruit Penny I was like my gosh here we go and it's like fall out so

I fell out and I just followed him and I knew where we were going and we were going to the what they call the sand pit There's these pits they look like a big sandbox all over the it's like the beach right for buds but they got these sand pits everywhere and they just beat the crap out of you and there like side sttle hops jumpy Jacks what you call Push up situps Sprints a account bodybuilders I don't think bures were invented back then uh but all these different calisthenics and things just just annoying make

you sweat it's middle of the summer um and I was alone with Him this the first time I was alone with a drone structor and uh and I was like I'll I'll take your punishment I I don't care it's not a big deal dude like so we're going and we were there for so long like the Shadows moved to the other side of objects like we were there so long I was like I was I was like uh I want to file a grievance I feel like you're abusing me like it was like I was

like dude is he Allowed to do this like it was got it was getting me to that point and I and I wasn't looking for a safe place I'm like this just seems awkward to me like it seems like I'm I'm getting uncomfortable right now and um he just starts beating me and then he starts having me do these Sprints like to this there's like this shed where it like hows like um like lawnmowers and you know know lawn equipment for that area so he's like hey Sprint back here and or Sprint there and Come

back and you've got you know 45 seconds whatever the time was never enough to go do what he asked and come back it was by Design right and I was getting frustrated and I got this I was Dripping sweat it was going to my eyes you know the feeling that just burning like acid in your eyes and I was starting to get irritated and I was starting to feel sorry for myself and I was like give myself the victim mentality like oh poor me what' I do Like well you're the one that did that you

actually started this and he kept doing it and he kept doing it and uh I started crying 17-year-old away from mommy getting destroyed by this Dr instructor Martinez never forget him wearing glasses his Marine Corp glasses that I just want to rip off punch him in the face I wouldn't have been done anything CU I couldn't even lift my freaking arms or move I was Smoked and he just kept doing it and doing it and I I I was like dude when is and and and he can see me breaking he can see me breaking

and he comes up to me he stops barking orders and he comes up to me and he looks at me and I was hoping that he didn't see the tears but they they don't you know they see it right and he goes discipline he go he goes it might seem like a small thing to itch a bug off Your arm but in combat sitting in an ambush it could mean your life and then he goes more importantly the guy next to your his life and he just stared at me and it was like he was

looking through me and something switched to my brain I was like let's go let's go give me More that's what I was thinking in my head yeah so he steps out of the sand pit and I'm like okay are we done now like I think you made your point and he starts do it again and we keep going and we keep going but this time I'm like angry I'm mad I was like you will not break me I was like I was like Huff I'm like let's go like I was like saying stuff I was

like let's go let's like I was amped it was like someone just hit me with a shot of Adrenaline and I was going and that has changed my mindset ever since probably important to throw that back in there but that was a big deal that was a big day for me that is when I became a man that is when my mindset and the kind of bir that unafraid how I think that was it that was it I was different from that day very different wasn't timid or shy I was like Let's go so that

was um yeah that was turning point that was a turning point so un afraid let's get back to that started as a book yeah so now it is a brand I had the and I put I put the 150 pages that I wrote by myself in Tulsa Oklahoma up on the Shelf so started working with the NRA it was a carry guard course it was a bunch of spec ops guys uh they they put on a bunch of tier one guys to run these Shooting courses for the NRA to give some life cuz the NRA

is made up of like a bunch of older people and it's just well it's old it's outdated so they were trying to give it life so we were trying to breathe it into it so we did these shooting courses phenomenal shooting courses uh so I met Keith on one of these courses he was actually riding for the NRA and he was riding for guns and ammo Field and Stream like he's he's he's you know does a lot of he's a big Hunter big gun guy um he actually knows like the nomenclature of things like I

don't know anything like I'm like dude just give me a gun that works like I'll like I'll tell you what it does but uh he knows all that stuff but uh I put him through that course I was his instructor and he didn't need any instructor he just did it so he could write about it and he was going to do interviews with instructors to kind of talk about it to give it like to boost it up to try to Get some traction and um that course went away and I knew Keith was writing for

did a book um that we discussed last night for New York bestseller it's turned into a motion picture now on Prime on Amazon Prime uh he did a couple of those books he was a big part of that um but due to legal issues you won't see that yeah uh but I I hit him up I was like hey man or I did I did the ritland podcast episode 23 I Think that's the one you listen to The First One MH and uh a lot of people are like dude you should write a book you

should write a book and I talked about a lot of the things that I initially wrote about so I was like ah maybe I should maybe I should do that it was kind of Weighing on me for like a couple weeks I was like I I wouldn't know where to I don't know how to write like I I'm like like a fifth grader so I remembered Keith and I I I texted him I was like Hey man can we can we talk and he called me like right away and I was like hey man can

you do me a favor can you listen to this podcast i s him the podcast he's like yeah man I'll do it uh sometime this week I was like cool he calls me the next morning it's like I listen to the podcast and he goes that's awesome man and I go um think it's good enough to be a book he's like Yeah and U I'm like would you help me write it and he goes I thought you would never ask I did not know this at the time Keith was having a falling out with the

person that he was working with at the time and he was looking for another project and he actually like I thought about you cuz I knew some of your story cuz we talked about it you know over drinks or whatever uh and then when he's like when you sent that to me he's like I already knew what it was and I already knew my answer and it was just like wow and and we started working on that uh took a couple years he would fly down we would do the interview he would interview me I

gave him what I had and then he he um he put the words to it and and I and I have got to give him credit for the words in this book I told the story but this that that man made art like it is it is so good how he he's a a Phenomenal he's a phenomenal writer and he's a a very dear friend very very upstanding guy uh very trustworthy guy and uh at that before like kind of at the beginning of this it was like preco I was kind of getting a little

piece of like the motivational stuff and I was like man why is everyone afraid of everything like I I saw like the Trump the Trump versus Biden was going on and I heard a stat on the radio I don't know if it's true and it doesn't matter but It probably is it said that 63% of Voters are afraid to tell you who they're going to vote for 63% 63% I was like that is the dumbest thing in the world and it's because they don't want to they're afraid of any conflict it goes back to what

we were talking about with the Christian men same thing so I was like unafraid like I fell in love with the word afraid enough where I got a tattooed like it was everything um and I'm like and I just Brainstorming thing and I found I was going through Shutterstock uh to get a photo for a post for contigent group or something like that and I saw this logo and I was I was looking for a picture of a heart I think it was for I don't know what it was it was something based around security

or whatever it is and I saw this logo it was a half a heart half a brain and it had some like paint spouted around it or something I was like that is awesome so I downloaded It kept on the computer didn't really use it for anything um and then when the unafraid thing it's like dude I need to make a logo for this so I did a t-shirt t-shirt started to sell people would love it like I love that I love the way I love the way it is and then we started putting the

logo together um which actually a little bit before sorry little confused on that so we did the logo and then started doing just a T-shirt I was like man like people are like hey thanks for just that shirt like it it it it helped me I was like how does a shirt help you but then I think about the stuff that I wear I love motivational stuff I love motivational quotes I was like okay cool I'll just I'll do another t-shirt so we started doing more and then what I realized without realizing it is all

my branding was kind of Moving to Christ I didn't realize this I wanted to be a fighter I like to be a fight not so much like a a fighter but like to fight for what you believe to be right and uh so I did like Biblical verses that show tell you that you need to be freaking a fighter like shirts that say not passive like I'm not going to be pushed around um and just like I'm going all in like and I just tried to like turn it into that it just kind of morphed

into This um this thing and and one day I'm up and oh in the shipping room turn our movie room into a shipping room um and I'm just looking around like all the stickers and and the bands and the shirts and the pin and just all of it and I'm like I was kind to look up the sky and I'm like you are so sneaky I'm like I've got Fai stuff everywhere without even realize I've got Fai stuffff Faith stuff I'm like I it was like I was blinded to it all like I'm I'm All

About The Warrior piece all about the warrior piece like our shirt say you know Warrior but I'm like well we'll put that on a cross cuz I believe that we go back to Gold got the cross y it all meshes now it makes sense to me becomes full circle it's full circle it's a great way to put it and then I'm like okay so people were starting to reach out on Instagram and Like saying hey thanks for po posting this and I started put some just Bible verses that meant something to me I'm like hey

maybe ible help somebody else and there was one time one time this individual reached out and I I and it was I think it was a dude and he goes you posted this and it just saved my life he how' that feel I was like wow one quote a few words on a little Screen or wherever you watched it saved his life and I knew it wasn't like a you saved my life man it was you saved my life I could feel it by reading the words and it that started happening more and more and

I'm like that feeling I described about killing someone got trumped by the feeling of helping someone by encouraging Someone I was like that is awesome if it just helps one person that would have taken their life or would have gone home and beaten their kids I was like okay okay all right all right I'll do that and it's like non-stop especially when this book came out the the messages you really helped me out I was a single father Struggling this helped me out I've been addicted this helped me out showed me light and that's what

it's about enough of me enough of me it's about them it's about him that that is a better feeling than putting a bullet in somebody's eyeball and don't don't let me fool you that is a great Feeling but it won it won I'm won I'm sold I'm all in I want to keep doing it and I'm going to good for you yeah what else did that lead into uh leted into some speak stuff and I was actually talking to Keith about this I was like I need to do more speaking I want to do more

speaking I want to I want to feed guys I want to feed more may let into more products and And stuff like that it's leading into books two and three coming up uh but as I was talking to Keith I was like dude I need to somehow give these talks but kind of I want to interject God more I want to talk about God more and I don't want to talk about God where someone's like inverse yada y yada where it just like cuz I remember me I'd be like all right I'm checked out I

don't know what that is you you lost me and Um I was like I need to do that in a tactful way and I'm thinking of myself because man if you said anything wrong I'm like I'm I'm step arming you like I don't want anything to do with you like you can't force that stuff um but I was like I I want to somehow do that I want I want to talk about him more and uh cuz he's a part of he's he's that story he's me and um a day later two days later I

got a call from a guy did a podcast with a Year before he was a pastor at a church and he calls me and he goes hey Eddie what's going on he goes this is you know so and so I don't know if you're remember doing a I was like yeah yeah like how you doing bud what's going on he's like he's like I have to talk to you I was like all right he's like I have two questions or two things I need to talk to you about I was like okay cool he's like

one do you think you know Next year around Memorial Day or fourth of July you come up and talk to my church I was like yeah I was like sure like I'd love to do that and it kind of goes back to like I need to interject more faith into my my speaking and my testimony right because I if I leave that out I'm not doing it justice um and I'm lying and he goes one more thing and he goes this is he's like I've been thinking about this for weeks he's like I've been thinking

about this for two weeks he said two weeks exactly and uh he goes I don't know why why I'm even asking this he goes I do know why but it's just kind of crazy and he's like I really have no and he was really worried about my reaction to what he was about to say and he goes you've been on my mind and I was like I want to be like that's not really how you start a conversation with another dude Bro but he's like I can't stop thinking about you I've been praying for you

he's like youve just been weighing heavy on my mind and uh he goes I have a gift of I can write really good testimonies in a good way that you can tell your testimony and how God interjected and how it does you know it did certain things for you and he said that and I was just talking to Keith about This a couple days before it's crazy I I was blown away I was like what the heck and so I said sure I'm like sure okay like that that's good he's like well just you know

think about it and pray about it and like when he said pray about it I wasn't like okay what does that mean we I was like okay I will and I will and I did and I was like okay I feel I feel good you you know I feel good about it and he's like let's talk you know next Week he texted me like let's let's let's talk in a couple days after you have time to you know digest and process so we talked and um one thing I didn't mention so I told you this

book was called facad and then it was like once Keith and I started it was within War just because like what I'm feeling within like the war with inside of me there like a freaking combat zone in here bro and my heart and my head every everywhere every little Piece of my body and then the war being in Afghanistan Iraq you know Africa all that stuff and um so it was within war and then it just changed when we got to the publisher to be unafraid so I have this call with his pastor and he

goes he goes hey Eddie I I really don't know a lot about you he's like I listen to a couple podcasts I know you got the book out he's like I need to read that so I really get to know you just so I Can deliver a better testimony speech whatever you want or and I was like let me cite right there we're not going to call it a sermon we're going to call a battlecry I'm like we're doing Warrior like I've been convicted it's Warrior it's Warrior to teach people Warrior we've got enough soft

crap going on that we don't need that anymore we don't need we don't need more and I'm not ripping on the soft crap we need that compassion we need That love we do need that but just think about it when you talk to your kid but at the same time when evil brings its head up in into your face you need to be ready to fight and we're not we're not equipped we are not equipped it's like us going overseas and we don't have any body armor and we have a gun with no ammunition that's

how we are right now yeah I'm carrying stuff but I I can't do anything with it because I don't know how I don't have It um and so he goes okay battlecry it is and so he goes into he's like here's what I'm thinking I'm like I was like I've been thinking about the same thing for probably like the last year he was like he's like verifying every thought that I've been having uh that I thought I was just okay Edie you're thinking you know you're thinking about yourself here you're going off on your own

this is something you want to do which I'm trying not to Do and uh he goes I also want to send you my book to read just so you know who I am kind of what I believe just so we you know before we work together and I was like sure and he goes so my my book is called um the war within and I go what' you just say and he goes the war within I was like I was like dude we the book unafraid was going to be called within War forever for like

years and it changed at the last minute and he's Sending me a book now called the war within like you can't make this up no you can't you can't make it up another coincidence another coincidence and I'm like dude okay like all right so like my passion and what I think you know where it's taking me and being verified by individuals not even that I know um you know it's coming to life and I read his book and it was like eye openening just really eye openening Stuff and it was a great book and uh

and so he just just the day before we came here before I came here he sent me the first draft of the testimony it was like six pages and it was like good stuff it was like my story because he he knows my story he's like you plug in this story here he's like we're going to work through this we'll change some stuff up and and it was like you can't make the stuff up the Timing yeah I mean how many coincidences do we want to call out here we've called out a lot yeah it's

not and I mean I'm convicted I'm convicted on what it is and I really just think like my next my next chapter as I'm as I'm fighting for God man I'm I'm like going to be that Warrior and I'm going to tell people people my experience cuz that's all I have to go off of based off of his word and what I've experienced And how you process and what you take in is up to you and up to him I have nothing but to tell the story and uh and I'm I'm fine with that and

to encourage people and to motivate people and to give because I've taken too long how's it feel to get up there and speak I like it you like it I do do you get a rush out of it I wouldn't say a rush but I feel I feel very comfortable and I I feel it's Where I'm supposed to be it's like okay this is my domain this where I'm supposed to be and uh it's just good to fill people I can see just seeing their faces like it clicks like oh like I'm like oh yes

cool rock on how do you get your speeches do you give it's more based off like a mindset your mindset and I mean I use past experiences why I mean does that's all I have to go off of yeah of what worked for me what helped for me um And I just kind of go off of that and talk about the mindset piece and now I I I feel I have a I'm talking to my first church in December uh possibly same time maybe before this thing comes out uh and I'm excited I'm really excited

just to be in God's present and I have a I feel when I get up there and it's my floor being in that Arena no matter what The structure looks like or what it is knowing what it is I'm going to lose it and I'm okay with that good for you I'm okay with that do you want this out before that speech you do your thing man you do your thing um but yeah I think that's what I'm supposed to be I think I'm supposed to be encouraging talking about faith that's what I think I'm

supposed to do I think I'm supposed to be producing the gear that helps people like I I my Daughters wear this my son wears this my sons wear this um Amanda will wear it my wife and they'll just walk down the stairs and I'll just say unafraid and that just seeing that I'm like that's right I'm going to tackle everything I'm not going to I'm not going to be afraid of it I'm going to go do it and uh yeah just accountability I love it good for you I love it how'd you meet your wife

and so that's like the biggest that's a big piece so God is Awesome God is awesome he was the savior of my life Christ was the savior of my life 100% meeting my wife is like a whole another type of awesome I mean you know what it is right like you I really believe we've seen the the the pictures on uh media you're only the man is only as good as the woman next to him and I really believe that and um I I I see see that now um when I moved down to Texas

after I was at Cincinnati for a Brief time I moved down and I went into the gym and I walked it was the first day I'll never forget it and I was in a relationship at the time and I looked over and I saw my wife Amanda she was just a nobody at the time and she was on the stair stepper on her little perch looking over the gym doing her on her stairs black yoga pants hair up in a bun with a red tank top on and I was like stay away from that woman

that is bad news I'm like that is Going to make me do some things that I've done in the past and I don't want to go there again and uh so I would see her there quite often at the gym just her schedule would work out I would be lying if I say I didn't tweak some scheduling pieces to coincide with hers um but I didn't talk to her I I kept my distance um I knew what would happen if I ever Talked to her and I was right she was going through a divorce she

had two kids I had my kids uh only two of them at that time one was out of the house uh two were two were with me and I was with and with another woman and we were going through some stuff we were on the verge of breaking up she was going through a divorce and we just became friends there was it's the first woman I've been with that there was nothing physical I didn't hold Her hand I didn't kiss her for like two years for two years nothing what was the initial conversation I guess

one of her friends that show what's that what' you say you need a spot you can get a spot uh she said one I guess one of her friends came over I don't know if she asked her friend to come over or she just did but I'm sure they were I could tell they were talking about me which Secretly I loved um the validation right so she comes over she goes her friend she's like so you in a relationship I'm like I am and she goes oh okay and we just started like going back and

forth and then she goes so you're not in a relationship and she like changed her wording so she asked me first are you in a relationship and I go yes and then we do this conversation and I'm like looking over at Amanda knowing why she's asking me this I know it's because of Her I know it you just know and uh she goes so you're not in a relationship and I go that's right I'm not I go uh no I just say no or I say or I go I go yeah I go yeah it's

just confusing like and then when she left I'm like oh my God I just said I wasn't in a relationship like I was like crap I was so flustered knowing it was her cuz I I like is gorgeous like she just she takes it like I understand the song taking my breath away from Top Gun I get it Top Gun the Original and um and so she probably goes tells her yeah he doesn't have a girlfriend or is not with anyone and so Amanda goes down she knows a friend that works in the office at

the gym and she goes look this guy up she like saw me come in one day she's like somebody that let me see the all the people that just swiped their card the last 15 minutes so they get it up she pulls it up sees who it is goes to Media figures it out and she's like and there Was my girlfriend was attached to the account she's like okay this guy has a girlfriend and so we eventually start talking her dad she like I can't remember how that first like we just started making little comments

to each other like little little things nothing crazy then we just started like talking just like a friendship kind of developed like there was no dude there was nothing like like a little harmless Flirting is that where we're going I I wouldn't even say that I mean it got there but at first it was like I like I asked her she like hey do you need a job like I needed someone to do background checks because I didn't want to do it anymore and like it's something that she could do remotely as long as she

knew how to do it and uh so she started working for contig group and she was just like a friend like God truth a friend we didn't do anything but we Started working out at the same time started like talking to each other and then my relationship ended and then her divorce was getting bad and she was kind of like me talking to her then she would talk to me and there was like some ups and downs with relationships and then we finally just said hey let's um let's you know let's see each other after

her you know she was done with her situation and all that stuff and we just that was it Became exclusive and like that woman's got my heart man I Can Tell She's got my heart she I love seeing her man she is my best friend she I know I get no judgment judgments for her and she holds me accountable which I can't stand sometimes but that girl holds me accountable she would be like you are being a loser like stop I was like okay uh I mean just just doing life with her it's it's Heaven

man thank you it's Uh it's the greatest thing so we were doing the book we got to finish it up with me proposing to her I went and talked to her uh mother cuz her dad passed uh who was a uh green uh spec ops dude in Vietnam with the Army and uh had a security company like the same stuff that's weird so I guess like that's weird I would say a lot of the same things that he would say I would be messing around be like okay pumpkin and She would be like what' you

just say and I'd be like pumpkin I'm just joking around with you and she goes my dad used to call me that all the time like that was happening all the time one more coincidence for you to show you or to show everyone pretty much and myself we we got we we did a Montana trip we did that road trip I I discussed with you and uh I proposed her at the Grand Tetons up in Jackson Hole and it Was awesome we we did you know 13-day like hitting Montana shooting over to South Dakota coming

back Colorado all that stuff and uh we got engaged on that trip and then so we the venue we wanted we couldn't get until we just had it like two weeks ago our ceremony but we got married went to the courthouse got married and uh I was like hey why don't we go get some dinner like celebrate somehow and She goes okay cool so we go to like our favorite Little Italian place and uh I I text my son I was like he was the only one I think the her kids were somewhere else and

mine was gone somewhere and I was like hey dude send me look at the menu here's the website tell me what you want and we'll bring it home for you we're going to grab a by te he goes okay so he sends what he wants it's like the most expensive thing and I'm like and so Amanda's like he's not getting that like Dude my my son's palet it's like ridiculous he's like wanting red snapper while all the other kids want chicken nuggets it's like like it's good to have kids test or taste everything but dude

when they start liking it's like your Bill's like now $900 when it's supposed to be $9 but he's like he he eats it he eats it all he loves Sushi loves it all but I was like what did that so we got him something else and I was like what did That what did he want so I like look at the menu I was like dude that does look good so I got that and it was like clams muscles calamari and like some pasta with some marinara so we get it and you know we say

grace and um right that earlier that day um I did a podcast and I have to rehash past relationships my past and it and it it's hard for her to hear sometimes yeah I mean rightfully so I understand I I really do but I try to Explain like hey I have to talk about my past I've got to talk about all the bad things otherwise the Redemption and pulling myself out a very dark place means nothing I've got to set the stage and weal we were talking about that and I'm like it's all good like

we are it's it's good everything's fine and um and I felt bad for her I I was like I don't want her to relive this I want her to re I want us to live us right now and so I take a bite I I I dig into A clam and I get the meat out with my fork and you know pop in the meat enjoying all a sudden I get this crunch I was like what the heck and I thought like Moler or some kind of weird cap that the Navy put in was falling

out and um so I I like a fat kid eat all the food around whatever is in my mouth this this forward object I pull it out and I'm like you got to be kidding me it was a freaking white pearl what it was a white Pearl not a black pearl not a piece of rock it was a white Pearl that you would see if I'm going to go pick out a piece of jewelry and get it get it from my girlfriend fiance or wife that's what you would pick that's what you would it would

be one of those are you serious swear to God I could not believe it I could not believe it and um she thought I staged it which I was like man I really should Have that's a great idea but I'm like I'm like what the heck like we're like we're looking at this thing we're just like we're like a napkin and our waitress comes by and we're like we just found a pearl and this waitress we use all the time she's been there for 20 something years at this restaurant she's like never has anyone found

anything like that and she's like let me see it and we show her she's like oh my God she's like you just Found that we're like yeah like yeah and we like so we're start googling right because Google tells all and it's like the chances of finding a pearl and a clam or oyster is like every 10,000 clam is more is more rare uh but usually when you find a pearl or what we would consider Pearl there there's like multi like five different colors there's black ones there's all these different colors the chances of find

like a white pearl is like it's just it's not going to Happen Doesn't Really Happen another coincidence so I'm like and and it and it's and we looking up okay what is the meaning of this one of the meaning like says you know like it says like new beginnings wisdom and it's just like all these things it's like oh my God like what's happening like what the heck and and I go and and like after I process once again I start crying and I'm like do you understand This and she goes what do you mean

I go we just got married today this is a gift from God I truly believe that that was a gift from God it still is a gift from God I believe it the coincidences it doesn't add up it doesn't work that way it does not work that way so we call our moms she's talking to her mom on her phone I'm talking to my mom explaining this they're crying we're Crying I had to like she called her good friend she's crying I had to call Dom he's starting to choke up I'm like explaining all this

like trying to like calm down I'm like dude can you freaking believe that this isn't Saye and it's just like finally out of trying to like get my life that was like a tangible sign like hey you're on the right track to me that's what it felt like it's like hey you're doing good keep going good job here's your water here's a cliff bar Keep going and it was just it felt really good so we took that Pearl and we turn turn into a bracelet and we keep it um where we we always have these

two seats where we have coffee and we got a little I call it the battle box and it's the clam the clam that it came out of and this pearl bracelet sits in it with a bunch of pictures oh man that's so anytime we're arguing with each other we pull out that battle box and we put this on top and It's like do you remember this and we hash it out and it's really cool the for real man and minus her rings that was the only piece of Jew jewelry she wore was that Pearl uh

this past weekend it was I'll make sure I give you the picture I'm really happy for you I I and only if only when I finally started to listen I stopped listening to myself and started listening to him and uh since I Did like I said when I quit drinking things started changing a lot and I I'm mentioned that Pastor that reached out he's like I've been thinking about you two weeks ago exactly two weeks of the day is when I stopped drinking to the day I'm not making this up wow damn man it's beautiful

it really is it's beautiful and it's not like it's all Like I said before peaches and cream or a walking through the field of daisies it's still daily a freaking grind man and to try to do the right thing dealing with kid issues wife issues work issues friend issues the news current events it's still it's still a battle Yeah but we can choose how we handle those and there's certain things that we can do to make this and this better you know yeah there Is happiness is a choice oh 100% 100% it is yeah it

really is and um yeah you got it I do I see it all over you I do and I appreciate that man that means a lot it really does um yeah I'm very happy man I'm I'm very happy with my wife my wife is I love her so much I can tell I do what's this podcast you guys are doing together so we have the penny so we have two podcasts we got the unafraid podcast Where we kind of like talk about the chapters and we're starting to do other things now but we got the

pennies podcast which we just started having these conversations and we're like I was like man why don't we we should do a podcast over this or she said it I was like okay so being true to my word I just started ordering a bunch of stuff off Amazon got it sent up and just took a room that we were really like it was a sitting room like all right this is the New podcast actually I had Jiu-Jitsu mats everywhere that the boys and I would just mess mess around with and do fighting stuff on so

I ripped those out and made a podcast room and um we just wanted to be real like we just said we want to be real talk about relationship things she talks a lot about having to deal with deal with me my anger certain issues the drinking uh we lay it out there we talk about it all we we talk about a lot of stuff Faith Stuff the struggles we talk about it and we just we're just real man we're just we're just real and uh it's I love doing that podcast with her we just get

so close and I can just see see her working and I just I think that's probably one of the the best times that I truly understand what she's talking about and what she's getting and uh it's good it's really good yeah it's it's it's fun I like Watching it I mean you guys interact with each other yeah really I mean it's a it's a good example you know for for there's not a lot of I don't think there's a lot of happy married couples I don't think there is either you know and and um I've

had two of them that were unhappy yeah and you see that at least me and my wife see it when we hang around couples who aren't happy they get they it's just not a Good atmosphere to be in I sense you can sense jealousy you can sense they want your relationship to crash they want to drag you down on your level and and uh so putting things out like that like what you and Amanda are doing it's it's just a good example MH for for for married couples I appreciate that man that's good to hear

yeah it's good to hear it's it's hard to do them sometimes because the mindsets got to be in a certain place especially for her She's like I really just don't feel like I just don't feel like it and I and I and and we had a discussion about this actually like two weeks ago I was like we we'll be amped to do a podcast and she will like it's time to do the podcast and she'll get a real bad headache or she'll get really tired or she'll be like I just don't want to do it

and it happened like two or three timesh and like on the third or fourth Time I was like I was like do you realize that we will have it ready to go we know we're going to talk about we don't like plan we just we just want a free flow right shoot from the hip yeah but we have a topic right because of based off of something I was like do you realize that this has been happening right before we're about to do a podcast I was like is it possible that you're getting these feelings

because this message shouldn't go out to help all These different people like it's not a coincidence that you're feeling that and it goes back to that spiritual warfare piece and calling it out like dude we got to fight this like let's go we're pushing through this we've got to do it yeah it's helping others man it's helping it's helping others much like this show is going to help others just like I watch your shows that I'm not on and it helps me I mean listen to Chipley I was like dude Man wow like it was

good I mean I hate hearing that and hate to hear other Buddies go through that but at the same time it's like okay I'm not alone it's normal yeah it's not normal but it's you know what I mean yeah you know I mean is that is the podcast still on so unafraid or Eddie Penney uh the podcast is on everything like YouTube Spotify it's on everything but you can if you go to Eddie penny.com I put some of them up there but I have Links to all the podcast on all my profiles okay I got

like the link tree or whatever yeah that goes to anything and everything okay we'll link it below how do you guys pick your topics me and my wife do a podcast to a very similar but not so similar uh where we just we call ours it's not just us and it's it's it's bringing up struggles and the whole point is be like look you know this is what so media looks like but that's not that's not what we're dealing with you Know there there's real there's a real we're a real couple behind the scenes real

struggles and not this facade yeah right and so we put it out there you know in hopes that people like oh you know we deal with that [ __ ] right we get advice from it we learn 100% oh absolutely it's it it goes both ways it goes both way you're just kind of starting the conversation yeah and uh yeah we just kind of go over what we're honestly dealing with or struggling with We'll go over some of that at the time yeah like and some of it like oh man we should have talk about

this or we or another couple or something we might hear about something and we're like let's talk about this but usually it's stuff that we go through like I talked about my anger like getting the gangling block shots did really nothing for me uh we talked about that stuff talked about that Vision I had about the craziness that's been going on The coincidences just like crazy stuff just we just talk about it yeah but a lot of the struggles I mean we we we call it like the PTSD piece a lot cuz she lives with

it she had to deal with her father yeah and now she's dealing with with me so she's she understands it very well that's how she would probably deal with me and I'm much better now but I still have my issues man it's gotten way better since I quit drinking but uh what's something you would like to work On the cussing still the cussing yeah but I mean I don't want to get I have a tendency if I'm upset with someone that I can kind of pretty much treat you like you're dead I don't want to

do that I can do it with my kids I do that I don't like doing that you're almost like you're dead to me until I'm over pouting and then I can come back and we can engage like nothing ever Happened I want to get better at that I want to look at it for what it is and be like okay you're a child I'm a 44y old man that claims to be mentally tough right like I and like I said man I I I still struggle like just like the next guy I just fix one

thing and move on to the next uh but that would probably be my number one thing is like the patience and the understanding and the grace uh a little bit more God that's that's the B that's my Battle right now that's my Battlefield well Eddie I just man I'm happy you came I'm glad I got the invite buddy I appreciate it it was awesome to see you dude you too and well done on this podcast like you've got a very good podcast here dude I'm very proud of you thank you and like I'm just glad

things are working out for you got the family you're getting over ruined by Californians like I'm I'm super it's it's good to see your brothers like doing well man I I love it I love it so just keep going keep going I know you will I will you too I got one last question yes sir you have a son I do your wife has two sons so I have a right now I have a 13-year-old son I have an 18-year-old daughter and a 23-year-old daughter she has a seven-year-old son and a 10-year-old daughter so we

all we both have all these okay that's what That's what she brought in she brought in two I had three the only one's in the house on my side right now so we have three total in the house after everything you've been through would you want your sons to join the military and go to war am I allowed to pick a good government that's would you want your children to experience what you experienced no And yes no because I don't want them to have to deal with the aftermath yes because I want them to understand

evil and I want them to live and that sounds kind of weird going to war living but it makes sense that's living and uh fighting for a great country this is no matter what the Tabloid say this is a Great country the people of this country are great people um what we stand for is a great country that flag is great yes I would want them to stand up but only only if their heart and soul is in it that's it if their heart and soul is not in it then I wouldn't want them to

do it if they felt forced to do it I wouldn't wanted to do it but they wanted to it if they feied it if they craved it Absolutely and I know the baggage that comes with it and I would be there to support him the best I possibly could well thanks for answering that yeah but once again Eddie it was a a real honor to have you here sitting in the cross for me and and uh I just wish you the best of luck with contingent group with unafraid with your book with your next book

coming out your podcast your personal life and your family life likewise my friend likewise Thank you it's good to see you where you are that's good I'm thank you appreciate [Music] [Music] it hey everybody I'm Shawn Ryan click here to subscribe to the Shawn Ryan Show YouTu YouTube channel for the hottest and most compelling interviews that you will not see anywhere else I've also made a playlist of all the previous SRS episodes so they're easy to find you can Find that right here