"I've seen every toxic trick"- 21 Comebacks to Put a Narcissist in His Place & Finally Shut Him Up!

They will provoke you into an emotional response because they Delight in your anger as much as they Delight in your praise when you react you are giving away your power let's say somebody is yelling at you instead of saying you can't talk to me like that you say I don't respond to that calm down you're too sensitive you're overreacting most of us women have felt completely invalidated and Dismissed by those words so how on Earth can we respond with confidence without losing our call if you want to feel confident then you have to do assertive

things you have to assert yourself uh confidence is more of a feeling like if I were to say hey I need you to feel scared right now you'd have a hard time doing it without me being scary uh same thing to say I need you to be confident you're going have a hard time feeling it without doing something that's going to Trigger that so it's the assertive statements that you can use right into your sentences so for example if it's that idea of you're being so sensitive it's the having the patience to know okay I

know I can say something assertive right here and that is no I'm sensing you're being a jerk you know if somebody says it's just a joke I'm just sensing you're not that funny it's that idea of you're flipping their words and having the wherewithal in that moment to Say something assertive that will then in a positive feedback loop give you the feeling of confidence and then with that confidence you want to say more assertive things but when someone's being dismissive of your feelings if you don't know how to be assertive you absolutely may say something

that they can then use to either weaponize against you yeah or they can just then use that same statement again to prove their point yes as in like see I told you You're too sensitive right in those situations with any kind of personality they often te something up for you to grab so they say something ugly what they're doing is offering you something and saying I want you go ahead and take it go ahead and once you take it once you have that response of that emotional uh I can't believe you I can't and you

have that big reaction now they got you you fell for the Trap and now all of a sudden they kind of they take the joy in That response that you gave that hit of dopamine that they received from that control and so now when you react you are giving away your power often it's the silence and the very small steps that say I'm control and you aren't it's a very it's a a weird mindset where you have to flip the idea of when you are sending that Zinger right back at them you're actually weakening your

position not increasing it okay so because that is exactly what we do we we go okay well I'm going to give as good as I'm going to get and that feels sometimes in the moment quite empowering as a woman it's like I've got my own back I can stand out for myself but to your point what you end up doing is weakening your position yes so you say we have one of the best great secret weapons of pausing yes so talk to me about in that moment if you start to feel the heat you start

to boil your blood's boiling CU someone's being disrespectful To you they're dismissing you take me through the exact steps of how do you pause how do you collect your mindset and then come up with a good response yeah so what I talk about is difference between short pauses and long pauses and when somebody says something disrespectful what you want is a long pause that's somewhere between about 5 to 8 seconds it's just a few of allowing the other person to hear what they said because let's say you said something Negative to me visually one it's

going to give me the feeling of confidence when I see that word come and just fall to the ground and understand I don't have to pick that up and it's kind of in that silence you're looking at it going is that is that what you wanted to say does that feel good that that right there are you looking at what I'm looking at and that right there automatically makes them feel more powerless and you feel more control in That pause you are being their Echo you're being their mirror so often if somebody were to say

something ugly and I say nothing at all often what they do is they they say it and hear it back in their mind and often people might apologize and go I'm sorry I shouldn't have said that or they rephrase it or you can ask the person a was that supposed to these are questions of what I call intent so was that supposed to hurt me see how a question doesn't Respond in the way of sending that Zinger back at them it's a way of answering without answering did you mean for that to hurt me was

that supposed to embarrass me and you see how the power is not sending the Zinger to say I'm going to make you hurt even worse the power is when they throw a punch you go that didn't hurt so that's that's the control that you have in that moment and I assume tone matters because even just the way you said it it was so calm I Assume that was supposed to hurt me why did you say that versus like I assume that was supposed to hurt me why did you say that exactly so take me through

how it can be perceived as you're losing control versus actually you have control of this the conversation yeah I mean you can use just what we did as an example so if I were to say you can't talk to me like that are you kidding me versus you cannot talk to me like that now which one sounds more of control oh Definitely the definitely the second one and nothing changes except that you're speaking a lot slower which shows I'm in control of my words and it also shows I'm in control of my actions because when

that fight ORF flight kicks in which you know all about you get that emotion your heart starts to beat you get nervous you start to shake your voice might tremble a little bit you get tears in your eyes it's just emotional flooding you're telling your body in That moment when you're not taking a big pause and a big breath you're telling your body I have a lot to fear right now I have a lot to be afraid of so I have to be extreme I have to say that extreme thing I have to go all

out versus when you slow down and you speak slowly and even in a lower tone you're not only conveying control you're also telling your body this there's nothing to fear here there's no nothing to threaten me I'm Safe and that right there is an incredibly powerful move uh that you can flip that script on them to show that there's nothing here that's that's threatening me in some way so that's what a lot of the pausing does is gives a lot of space for them to realize that what they wanted is not what they're going to

how I see it is when you say that ugly thing you put it out on a Ledge like you exposed it and you're hoping you're praying that somebody will Take it have you ever thrown an insult and then they didn't give it back probably yeah and then you go oh kind of feel like a jerk later you realize oh that didn't hit and then you feel kind of stupid because what you sent out it didn't get the response you didn't get the control now you feel kind of silly about it so that's that's how you

do that so if I had to break that down it' be one you want to add about a five to seven 7c pause long pause two you want To do it long enough to make them hear their words back and often you can just repeat what they said back to them so if you said something ugly like jeffon you're an idiot and I waited five seconds i' said I'm an idiot perfect three is you're you're allowing them to show you can ask questions of intent did you mean for that to embarrass me did you say

that to hurt me or offend me and often times that's all you really Need to do to realize it's not going to be that fun for them the second time around oh my God that's so good and then in talking about the pause in the power of it you also talk about in your book The Power of people forcing you to not pause and it's their way almost of asking your question like rushing you to answer as a way of them controlling you yeah so in legal depositions attorneys do it all the time we want

to get you responding very quickly and when you Feel pressured you often do a lot of the clients that I have I to train them on let them get all their question out give it a pause then you say something because otherwise you want to hey did you go the other day yes I did they they they like to cut in because they just want it over same thing in any argument that you have you also want that over because you want the threat to go away but where you find the the moment of control

and power for them is when you Can add distance between what they said and your response in that distance where you're able to show them that there's nothing here that's really going to defeat me in some way and so what i' like to focus on is when you are trying to rush your words what you're saying them is you're afraid because when you get afraid you like to rush your words and when you get to slow down you're in a much better position almost every single time confident people know they Don't have to say anything

insecure people always have something to say always have something to add insecurities are loud confidence is very quiet there's a very big difference in that people in your community would want to grasp that idea of I don't have to say anything that I don't want to say should I not want to answer that text for 10 minutes maybe I don't want to respond to that text for the whole day then don't it's there's no pressure Obligation that you have to send it immedi medely you don't have to send that full paragraph you wait wait a

day it's going to be a whole lot better and you're the one that's going to feel more controlled and send the message that you're in more control of yourself all right guys we'll be right back with Jefferson Fisher but just for a moment I want to ask you if this episode or any other women of impact episodes is bringing you value then Please please do smash that subscribe button down there because you have no idea how much that becomes the calling card to all of us women out there that this is a place and this

is the community to be a part of because we've got each other's backs so smash that subscribe button thanks for listening now back to the episode I love that I am I often write textes and I don't send them yeah and I'm like all right if you still feel Like this 24 hour send it that's smart I never end up sending them ever yeah um what I've done is I went deep into my community and I was looking at all the things that we women struggle with um here at women of impact and I've pulled

some scenarios for you if you're okay with helping us through navigating how we would replace you're like sure I don't know what I'm getting myself into okay so um there somewhat scripts if you will and I realized that in my community Maybe you found this there are two almost different types of ways of saying things number one is a question number one is a statement and so they sometimes land differently so I would love to hear how you think through them so one is um when someone is just utterly inappropriate to your face sometimes one

of the questions I get all the time and a lot of women do is why don't you have kids yet yeah sometimes that's very inappropriate if you can't have children That's heartbreaking of a question if you've decided not to it feels like sometimes it's a challenge to your femininity and your Womanhood um and so when someone asked that how would you suggest someone could reply with confidence do you feel like they have to explain no no I mean part of confidence is the understanding that you need to stop justifying everything you can say no without

justifying it you can say anything you want without having to Justify a reason for it no is as they say a complete sentence so in that scenario somebody gets asked about you why aren't you having kid why have you had any kids or why you have more kids um one that is an extremely offensive appropriate question in that kind of situation reading the room you could do one of two things one you could ask the question and I would I would begin with is it I like asking things with is it because it props it

up in in their side Of the fence for example is that something you need to know is that something important to you is that something you care about or is that something you should care about so beginning your question with is it poses a a question for them that they now have to respond and most of the time the answer is going to be no or if you need to turn that into a statement and it could be something that's that's not something you should know Simple as that I feel like when it comes to

an inappropriate question the more inappropriate the more room you have to turn that question into a a statement I'm saying that's that's an inappropriate question I love that that's an inappropriate question I just that's such a like straightforward way of responding um but then sometimes it can be a statement that is offensive but doesn't leave you really any room so I'd love to know how again we will get this A lot why haven't you put on weight yeah anytime they get questions about their exterior um what I like to recommend is that they own It

Whatever It Is they need to love on themselves so whenever somebody gets a question about weight their appearance my recommendation is for them to own it to so hey it looks like you've been put on some weight yeah I I've been hoping so I think I look awesome I love how I look it's just Owning it yeah oh I love that it's so hard though I was 19 years old and I was known to be very skinny like as a kid and then I had blossomed and my body started to change and I put on

weight and my roommate's mother walked past me and was like wow you got so fat I remember this to that day to this day um I've had an unhealthy relationship with food a lot of those comments can not just be a jab it can be something that you remember for the rest of your life And your identity gets built on it but sometimes it can be so damn hurtful that you take it person and you really take it to heart and do you see how even in a little instance like that maybe she didn't mean

it but you took it a lot differently and so in that just that scenario can prove that it hurts and you carry it as much as you decide that it hurts and how much you want to carry and so even when you say well I've remembered it forever well that wasn't Her choice it was yours and so every time it's that ability to say okay well if I have the choice to remember this I also have the choice to let it go I'm going to pause for a second because thank you you metaphorically just slapped

me around the face and I love it and I I really mean that like I I I think sometimes wake up calls are great um I'm such a person of growth and evolution and it's clearly something that has stuck with me because I just Said it on this show right I mean this was when I was 18 and so thank you for being that honest I always want that hard truth even if it's hard to hear so putting the onus on me is a beautiful gift you've just given Meely yeah of course still got a

few more though ready let's keep going what about deflecting blame with sarcasm as a example sorry I guess I just can't do anything right yeah when you want to handle a passive aggressive comment often what I like to Say is you need to start your response with sounds like or seems like sounds like there's more to that Chris Voss has an awesome line that I love and it says seems like you had a reason for saying that sounds like you have a reason for saying that it just kind of calls them out of hey you're

not you're not coming out of the gate you're not being uh open with this and uh I like sounds like there's more to that that's probably one my favorite goto is Sounds like there's more to that because they'll they'll share almost always another one that I like to um use with passive aggressive people is should I read into that I do that a lot with texts oh should I read into that and almost every time you'll get a very clear answer of oh no no no no I just I I was just texting and I

know I was reading the context in it but all should I read into that that shortness that uh it's a Weird word that you threw in there but going to what you just said that most people oh no no no no no that's all I most of the time I assume that's BS they actually do mean something sometimes yes but but that the point is you called it out right okay so so the fact that they're backing off you don't then proceed you just back off as well do you I go actually a little harder

recently so passive aggressiveness for me was such a trigger cuz I was like I don't Know how like it feels like they're insinuating something but not quite saying it and then if I bring it up I used to be there saying oh you're being paranoid like it's all you and so the blame keeps coming back to you so then that makes you not speak up when someone's being passive aggressive I realize that doesn't help I feel like that is a bit of a bullying te technique um and so I started to call people on it

by say like what do you mean by that Statement yes and then they would back off and I'm like but what did you mean like but what did you actually mean yeah you like to take it further only because I have noticed and I would love you're the professional so I want to know your opinion but only because I noticed it doesn't eliminate the problem they're just going to be snide and passive aggressive in a different way next time so do you advise to not then keep going yeah depends I mean I think that um

I Like to view it as if there like two negatives of a magnet like I'm I'm just showing you right now when I say something like um sounds like there's more to that and you kind of go away and let me said no no really you go ahead and tell me what did you mean by that what did you mean by that when I I mean now I'm starting now I'm starting to come on uh when they said something passive aggressive for a reason it just wasn't didn't feel comfortable to them And you pressing more

more is not going to make them feel more comfortable and what you want is them to open up not clam up and so often you could even use it as sounds sounds like there's something for us to talk about um for example we talked about in text somebody sends a text and didn't make sense to you and you you decided it was a rude text if you even responded did you mean for that to sound rude did you mean for that to sound short I use that a lot did You mean for that to sound

short they go no no no I didn't mean that let's say they did like you said they really did want that to sound short and then you start to press no no I want to know like so what did you really mean by if you didn't say that what' you mean it's it's going to make them feel like they're backed into a corner and no body back into to a corner wants to open up more it's it's going to fight or flight often it's much better to say okay mental note Let me bring this up

at a time that we can talk and have real space and Dialogue on it that's so good it didn't really feel right in my body when I was doing it but it definitely felt like I was um having my own back I'm such a goal oriented person it's like what am I trying to get to what's the goal and then how do I get there and you talk about that a lot in your book it's like know the goal of the conversation do what we want exactly I I'll even give You a sentence that I've

used many many times and you're going to love the next time this happens as you're going to respond I love to talk about it and what you're saying is no this topic right here let's keep let's keep going on it and that's passive aggressive people don't like that because they're getting called out but if you were to even respond I'd like to talk more about it happy to talk more about it what you're sending is two things one I'm addressing What you're saying without responding to the passive aggressiveness and the other side is I'm showing

you here that we have an open window to actually have some dialogue that it's going to be their decision to walk through that door or not coming up bad things happen when you force somebody to have a conversation when they're not ready we'll be right back but first I want to talk about the fact that we women need to be getting a lot of protein Throughout the day to help us stay healthy and freaking Str WR especially as we get older which is why I have to tell you guys about this high protein snack that

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at work being a badass at home with my family at the gym when I'm working out and with my homies and I don't actually have to worry about what I'm going to eat next click the link in my show notes and take advantage of this Very special offer of 30 B6 for $30 but it's only through my link so head to the show notes and click that link my homie now back to the episode got a couple more for you um when someone's just trying to avoid the communication nothing's wrong I'm fine when clearly nothing's

fine yeah it's it's that idea of they're not ready to have it right now and bad things happen when you force somebody to have a conversation when they're not ready you've had a long day You've had full day of Studio recordings running all your businesses everything you got going on with your game and wonderful things that you're impacting all these women all over the world and then you get home and you're just tired but right then and there your husband wants to have a very important conversation comes out of the blue they say hey we

need to talk you go okay and right then and there somebody's going to force you to have a conversation about Something deep they're wanting a 80% conversation when you have 10% to give and when that happens you will do anything to just fight it shift it off you're not you're not a good mental space with it instead of being upfront that this is not a good conversation so it's okay to say I can tell I'm not ready for this conversation on the flip side you do the same thing uh when somebody is saying hey look

I'm I'm not ready to have this conversation I'm fine I'm good I'm I'm all right it's okay to say it doesn't sound like you're good it doesn't sound like you're fine so you're just trying to continue to open up that that dialogue I love to talk to you about how fine you are when you have the time you know so what if that person though they then they're an avoidant and then so they're always just trying to avoid having that time for conversation so they're always just like no no I'm fine I'm okay what are

the types of Things that you can maybe say in that conversation that gives them somewhat the Comfort to know they're in a safe space that they you know you're not going anywhere because when I think about relationships and women sometimes your vulnerability can be used as a weapon tell me more about that I saw that um so you share with somebody you say your partner and you say really struggling with something and then they go off and Let's say they just dismiss it they hear you but they don't do anything about it and so now

you're just not feeling seen yeah so now imagine that in a relationship you've expressed your vulnerability you've told them their problem and they haven't done anything about it they haven't asked you and so what ends up happening unfortunately as a woman you end up backing off because you're like well I'm not seen I've shared my vulnerability and now they are Not helping and now I feel like i' I'm worse off so your response next time is when someone says how are you I'm fine yeah so now that vulnerability that you keep sharing where you've got

maybe a core wound someone's just using it now as a weapon to shut you down that is so true what I teach frames how you frame a conversation often when we want have something that's been on our mind let's say um somebody in your community has had a full day but in the back of their Mind they've been some thinking about something that's bothering them they want to talk about it with their their partner when they get home the partner has no idea of what's coming they they've they've lived with the thought for zero seconds

versus the other person has lived with that thought for eight hours and so when you come to meet it's not even a fair playing field because somebody's had a whole lot of depth and time to prepare for the conversation and The other person has had none they're totally cold on it and that leads to just it's like oil and water I mean it's just going to go terribly because they're not they're not ready for that especially not to the depth that you're wanting if you're being emotionally vulnerable with something there's a lot of miscommunication when

they say no no I'm look I'm trying to pour my feelings out to you and the other person's going you just asked me that you want to talk What are you talking about I've had a full day of work right now that's when you want to pour all your heart out I'm not ready for this and that that's a fair thing to have that position using frames allows you to position difficult conversations that's going to give a expectation and a goal and how your goal oriented so you start a frame by number one telling them

what you want to talk about number two you tell them how you want the conversation to end Number three you get there buy into it so let's say yeah give yeah so let's say for example we've had a a difficult day and you and I are working together I might say I like to talk with you about something that's been weighing on my mind for the last two weeks and it's important to me and that's step number one step number two is and I don't want you to solve anything I just I just need you

to hear it just for me that's it I'm not you to do anything on it is that Okay so that was number three is that okay does that sound good or can we do that perfect you have a wonderful chapter you have a frame of exactly what the conversation's going to be now the other person goes okay now I know we're talking about something important two now I don't have to fix it I have to keep looking for ways to solve the problem every single time and three I get they're buying and so now they're

kind of committed to having that Conversation when you get that little does that sound good or can we do that they go okay and now they've made a deal they've made kind of this hidden contract to discuss this with you and people don't like to typically break their words so using a frame for the most important conversations or difficult conversations much better way to set yourself up than just catching them cold that's so good how do you then Emotionally regulate enough to be able to do that I actually call emotional sobriety because I feel like

you can get you can get drunk on anger you can get drunk on frustration and what ends up happening is you act out of character just like when you drink alcohol so when I go into a conversation with emotional sobriety I can hear what I'm saying I can hear the response but when you go in and you're just completely emotional it sometimes can be detrimental to the Conversation and to yourself oh yeah most times yeah absolutely anger is intoxicating it can be an intoxicating feeling a way to emotionally regulate yourself and what I uh one

of the first things steps I have in the book is let your breath be the first word that you say and it is really a rule that I use all the time because it's going to keep yourself it's like being able to swim underw without having to take a breath like you're you're you don't get to that Level of intoxication because you're letting that pause tell your body I'm safe I'm good there's nothing to be threatened about so what I say is wherever you would say that first word of you can't you can't do that

you don't say that and whatever that attack is you just put a breath in its place and often what you're doing is telling the other person I'm preparing myself like if you were to ask me hey Jefferson how was your day And I was like good I'm good at Le I'm great versus uh Jefferson how was your day and I said I'm good it was good I mean just that right there I automatically queued you in that I thought about your question I felt controlled when I said that so just letting your breath be the

first word is such a power move when it comes to regulating your emotions because it's breath as you know that continues to calm yourself down Especially when things get most heated okay so let's say you take that breath which I love that I love the analogy of taking the breath before you go into water I'm going to that's really going to stick in my mind now so thank you for that um so with that analogy of taking the breath and pausing imagine you do that and now you're in a conversation and then as the conversation

starts to progress someone says something that ends up triggering you and part of the Thing that you really talk about in the book is about your psychological triggers and how when someone triggers you it can have the impact of a response that you then have and so I've got a couple of examples again if you don't mind okay um so the competence trigger so I've got an example the wife has been the Homemaker the whole relationship and husband makes a passive aggressive comment about her cooking he says that's one way of cooking meatloaf I suppose

The impact of that competence trigger is that it pushes you into overcompensating and seeking validation and doubting yourself so in that moment let's say you've been triggered let's say you've been told your whole life a you're know you're not very useful and so now you pride yourself on being that that stay-at home wife that Supply you really serves the family and then you get one of those passive aggressive things that isn't just a moment of well that was Kind of rude it now starts to pull the thread of your entire identity so when you get

moments of triggers like that how do you then regulate yourself enough to be able to then finish the conversation instead of storming off slamming down the phone or telling someone a rude text message yeah often what I like to teach is that when you when you claim it you control it meaning when you say how you're feeling you are controlling that emotion rather Than internalizing it that's that power of Detachment I could just say I'm mad you're not mad you're Lisa you feel mad and so it's just that little ability to separate out who you

are from the emotion that you're feeling gives you control over it so even if you were to say something or let's say a husband makes a dumb comment about meatloaf is just saying I can tell begin your sentence with I can tell I can tell I'm getting defensive with that I can tell That upset me I can tell I'm very sensitive to that comment I can tell I'm not ready for this conversation anytime you say I can tell it is not only a hey I'm letting you know how I'm feeling but it's also an acknowledgement

of I'm being very aware of my my emotions right now and that emotional awareness that's what's going to give you that extra edge of regulating yourself saying I recognize these feelings I'm not having a wonder where they're coming from so What's the difference between then I can tell versus I feel so I feel is you're wearing it I can tell sounds more like you're seeing it from a distance I like I can tell because it's like saying you're looking under a microscope or you're looking at something on a table I'm very Visual and so a

lot of the metaphors I use are visual so if I say I can tell it's me seeing it on a board I know I can tell right here on this graph this is where he got sensitive this is Where he got defensive versus I feel says no this is what I'm wearing right now and I'm I'm wearing anger do you think that you can trust your emotions oh that's a good question no in terms of can you trust your emotions to be accurate or do you do can you trust your emotions to be real yes

I I believe your emotions are real that doesn't mean the facts that caus them or what brought them on are are accurate and so if for example I somebody made a comment about Me of that was my own personal insecurity they had no idea didn't mean anything by it are my feelings real real about it yes is what they sent is that what they meant most likely no and so it's still that struggle when you have that internal emotion that is very real very just as pure as ever that the other person had no clue

that they ever sent it that way inter yeah because when I think about triggers I used to use my Feelings as facts and it's like well it's a fact that you hurt my feelings and so therefore I must be right in an argument where you had said something let's say me versus what I understand now is that it's true I felt it but was it an accurate reflection of the situation or was I responding to a trigger of mine that I've had in the past so how you feel about it that's doesn't make it a

Fact it could be a fact that it hurt your feelings that doesn't mean that the truth of those feelings are innate to the truth of the fact so is it wise to not necessarily talk about your feelings in an argument with your partner in that moment moment oh no I I highly advise saying it Ian because it's it's letting them know where to navigate so if something were to upset you and it triggered you let's say they brought something up about I don't know Something that's a sensitive area that they should know better or maybe

they didn't really know and you say I I can tell this is going to upset me you are telling them hey this is a no-o area and that's where you go all right if I need to I can start asserting a boundary of this is not where I'm going to go not going to go there with you so it's very beneficial to to talk about your feelings in the moment why you're feeling them thank you for that Breakdown that was very clear what about then I feel versus you've made me feel I of the opinion

that someone cannot make you feel anything it is solely personal to how you perceive things so if somebody if if I if you said hey Jefferson I hate your purple shirt like right now I okay I don't have a purple shirt on I know I don't so it doesn't bother me I know what I have and what I don't have so it's going to be my entire Choice Internally of knowing I'm going to choose to let this hurt me or not that's hard when things are you have insecurities about things maybe it's something about how

you look or what you do or your profession maybe your job isn't as important as your older sibling or something a lot of different insecurities but I don't take the path that somebody can make you feel something it is the choice of you just feel and this is how you perceived it's Like using uh in logic of um if I can't make you feel something then on the flip side I I can't make you not feel something and so if I like look I can't make you happy at the same time then there's no way

that I can possibly choose to hurt you make you feel hurt I feel like when I used to say it almost like I was given my power away you've made me feel okay so it's up to everybody else of how you feel or is it up to you and so once I phrased it like That and I'm so much of a like how do I build my confidence every single day how do I make sure that I don't give my power away in every sense of the word I realize I was given my power by

saying other people are making me feel a certain way yeah and that's wonderful I totally agree with that the same applies for when you have statements of people who say things that upset you you are turning the use and transferring it into eyes so let's say somebody is yelling at You instead of saying you can't yell at me you can't talk to me like that it is still giving away your power instead of you can't talk to me like that I don't respond to that so that's very different Power flip of just like you're talking

about taking on that confidence you can't yell at me I don't respond to that b volume so all of a sudden it is this light bulb moment of no longer am I saying you do you can't it is I I I I'm going to control that I love that one of The phrases I now use is um I will not engage in this conversation oh that's a good one it's it really like I had to practice it over and over and over again because my instan is always engage um so it became a very like

okay I can say that feeling like I'm very respectful to the person but it feels like it's very clear on my next actions willing to tolerate I love to say um I'm not going to start I'm not going to start yeah I love that it's kind of just a very quick Way of saying no not not going there I'm not going to start yeah okay I've got a couple of other triggers um ah this is hard oh this actually hurts me just saying this out loud your purpose trigger so an example is you choose to

exit the workforce to become a mother yeah and the quote is let's say someone says to you you used to be so ambitious the impact that has as a woman it makes you question Direction your identity and your sense of meaning Purpose is something that is to them also outward so if someone would say I used to be so ambitious my recommendation would be to say oh I still am oh I am yeah it's it's just all you're doing is choosing a different career path so when you are owning things it's a part of that

confidence and assertiveness is owning it so it's that ownership of taking advantage of no I love who I am I love what I'm doing and the understanding that I don't have To justify right I don't have to justify anything to anybody yeah because in I have noticed many shifts around um where women I think get their self-esteem or at least where where Society applauds you and where they don't and for me going from being a stayhome wife into the workforce was at a time where not many women were doing it so there it was a

really hard uphill battle for me and so for people to say like oh you don't you don't care about your husband Anymore Oh I thought you were a good Greek wife and that was really hard because for me I want to be a good Greek wife I love my husband so it started to almost question my uh commitment even though I didn't feel like it was in question within myself this is why I wanted to take this example because now it's happening on the flip side we've got to a point where women are like yeah

entrepreneurship go go homie you can do it and now women that want to stay at Home are being made to feel bad like that's just utterly heartbreaking to me when you're dealing with like these just complex like deep emotional questions of your purpose it also comes down to who are you listening to like who are you listening to are you listening to Nancy across the street who has never tried anything new are you listening to Bill who always finds a way to criticize somebody and so too often What we feed ourselves is the very thing

that is just going to be corrosive it's going to just be the drip that continues to nag us when we're just not listening to who we are and what's going to drive that are you listening to like in your kid are you listening to your husband are you listening to what matters to you to y'all's family to what you've decided who else do you need to listen to so often the questions that when I have people who are doubting the M themselves And they're listening to people that make them doubt themselves it's the question of

who who are you listening to it's a question that it helps you go back to the center of why why am I listening to them are you doing things that serve who you are and who you want to be are you trying to come up with reasons to doubt yourself that's true so how would you advise someone breaks out of listening to that person or that community and then letting go of the Judgment that comes with it because that's the other part is that maybe you're listening to them maybe you still tap into your own

internal voice and you're like I I still know this is the right thing for me but you end up getting judged and especially I'm because my show is for women it's very much the focus is that we are people Pleasers and all of that conditioning comes rushing back where it's like okay well I want to go and quit my job and Have this beautiful family and stay at home with my children but I'm getting all of this criticism and I want to be a people pleaser and everyone's like oh my God but you used to

be so good at this job and us to to be so ambitious and now I don't feel like I'm pleasing people and so all of this conditioning comes rushing back in that then comes up when someone says that one little s comment so what I like to say with people pleasing is it's okay to please people Just be sure you're one of them and it's so common that we get into this routine of pleasing the other people and expecting somehow that when we tell them what we're doing they're going to be disappointed like we're letting

people down mind you most of these people are strangers most of these people are way at the bottom of your VIP list in your life but yet somehow they they're the ones that you need to make sure that you look good for when you Walk out the door they're the ones that are you feel like are paying attention everything that you do I love that on proud that's so cool um and you also say about in moments maybe not like this but in conversations where it could get a bit heated like mean what you say

and so how many people say something and then they literally then the following sentence they actually don't abide by what they're just saying like I'm going to end this conversation and then you Just keep going yeah how many of us do that and why it intuitively I know it's wrong take me through what that's actually doing yeah so whenever you are going to say something like um I'm uh I'm GNA leave the room I'm gonna I'm I'm gonna hang up and you don't all right it's kind of like if you've seen a a dog that

looks like it's going to bite and they never do and you know it's just it's just a it's a cute little dog it's wan to look really mean and ferocious But you know it's just a sweetheart it's kind of like that they're it's you trying to say in that moment I'm feeling threatened I need you to go away I don't like any of this uh and what it does is it slowly weakens your position and in fact it it loses credibility because you just means you're all bark and no bite I guess I go along

with the dog analogy that's good um you like that yeah all right um but whenever you lean off of that what you're showing Them is the boundary I set is not the boundary I follow even just using the phrase I'm going to so if I were to just you and I are an argument and I don't like what you say and I just go click like how many times do that happen it happens to probably everybody you they get overwhelmed the other person gets too triggered and they just want to click instead of saying I'm

going to hang up the phone right now and you and you do so instead of just leaving the Room abruptly and slamming the door it's I need to leave the room and then you leave it's taking ownership of the action so when you own the action you are showing the person that what I say that I'm going to do is exactly what I'm going to do and it boosts your credibility it boosts that ability to know that this person says what they mean they're very genuine and authentic with what they what they say and also

what I would add to that is what I love It gives you the credibility within yourself so when you leave you're like I'm so proud that I was the person that said I was going to leave the room and I left the room yeah isn't that funny how if you uh do something even shocking to yourself you're like I'm kind of I'm very proud of what I just I just did I really just did it I I told them yeah and it's uh it's part of that positive feedback loop yeah I mentioned earlier that the

amount of times that I've like Gone to text people and I'm like just don't text it for 24 hours the very first time I did it cuz I heard it from an expert and I was like oh I'm going to try it I was so proud of myself I was like go Lisa like I finally did it and to your point the positive feedback loop that makes you remember oh remember last time when you did it even though it didn't feel natural how proud you were and so it kind of encourages you to keep doing

it absolutely what do you think About people arguing over Tex is I think arguing over the textas is one of the worst ideas because there's no emotional Nuance there's just there's just none and so many times when you say something in a text they're going to read in the worst way possible let's put it that way that snarky text or somebody says k are okay when do you ever read that as a positive thing somebody says sure and it text you and go oh look how want look at this you don't feel good about that

you You you immediately go sure what what do you mean k oh they're furious at you that's all you think is like something is terribly wrong when that kind of thing happens it it's not going to it's not going to become any better by texting more about it and I mean you can change how you need to communicate there's some people that are great in email and there's some people like in in my world I have some attorneys that are on my no email list Oh I don't send them emails uh because they can't email

without being snarky or sounding something or at least for me to I mean I'll take the blame for that there's some emails I'm like this is not we butt heads when we email I call them they're the most polite happiest friendliest person but in email we just don't communicate well yeah I've I've had the feedback that I don't sound polite in text messages but I'm just so busy and so then I try to explain oh It's just I'm busy so actually talk to me about explaining your way out of things oh explaining your way out

of things yeah hey Jefferson explain everything away from me please yeah but so often uh when you are trying to explain things there's a sense of feeling like you need to apologize for it I take that away like uh how many times we unnecessarily apologize for things so sorry just now getting back to you I I was so Busy why would you apologize for having priorities why would you apologize for having things that you needed to knock out in your day we've just gotten so used to IMM medy in our our responses but when it

comes to justifying I'd very much limit it even when you say I'm so busy there's no need to apologize for it instead Express gratitude for them still being there hey thank you for the text thank you for the patience like just right there you're Owning the time you're owning your priorities right rather than trying to feel like I need to come up with a really good reason I do that all the time I really do it's just because I feel so badly I feel bad that I've ignored a friend for a day I've ignored you

know I haven't texted someone back in a week and so I worry if I haven't texted someone back that they've made up a story so much in their head about why I haven't text them back and that's the Last thing I want them to perceive it isn't because I don't care it isn't because I don't love them it isn't because they don't mean a lot to me it's just that I've been so freaking busy and I've got ADHD and I'm terrible resp and so I feel compelled out of sweetness to them to make feel okay

in letting them know it's not about them so what I'm hearing is you're taking it personally for them oh I am is that wrong not wrong it just over time it will you'll do it With everybody in anything so I would I would highly encourage knocking out the early sories all right so let me push you a little what if it's someone who has been mad at you for not responding before for so now you know I love them they're still my friend but last time I didn't respond to them in the week they got

upset with me so when it's somebody who's sensitive like that one if they're getting sensitive and like they should know you and they should know what's all Happening in your life too often I feel like we find that the people who matter the least we give the most in terms of our emotions and our time why is it you're so right why is is it the people that we actually don't know as well that we do that with it's because it's all of our own sense of control CU you're controlling that perception that they are

or are not happy of you so it's you're doing it of your on your own accord I love your honesty this Is so amazing thank you like that's so true okay in talking about text messages and tone and how you can't really perceive tone and that you talk about in your book the ignition phase and the calling phase AR was fasinating so you have a so if you don't want to actually take me through the phase of how I believe it's like how they looked at you their tone they used the words they use yeah

and that's thank you so much for read in the Book it means a whole lot to so good um so yeah what I teach is in any argument there's an ignition phase and a cooling phase ignition phase is when there is something that with enough friction in the conversation something begins to ignite they said something you didn't like my body goes hey I didn't like that like your your brain and your body going uh that uh hey so I didn't like that can we can we fix that and all of a sudden I'm I'm engaged

ignition when you're Getting in that argument your your focus begins to narrow so that's why your pupils dilate you start to get some people begin to like tear up or get really nervous or they they find that they're uh shaking in some way and what they're doing in that moment is I want the threat to go away so let's say it's a a an argument between a husband and a wife and they say something automatically there is going to be a struggle and each of them want the Threat of the other to go away it's

to fight or fly so when I say something hurtful it's because my true intention is to make you go away my my true intention is to make it hurt you to defeat you and make you leave so in other words I may not be picking up this mug and throwing at you to make you leave the room that's what I'm doing with my words I I'm I'm wanting them to hurt and to cut I'm wanting them to cause pain and then when there's been Enough eventually it just burns out there's nothing left to burn you

said the one thing that crossed the line you said too much and then at some point the cooling phase begins and that that's your rest and digest all of a sudden you are you might feel sad and now like you're coming down the mountain now all of a setting your more logical brain starts to come in and you're going why did I say that that was so dumb what do how did we even start this what how do We what do we even begin to start with in this argument and you're realizing all of the

logic that is now flooding you and the emotions are now starting to dread and that's why you feel like sadness and grief because that tension that high that you were feeling that adrenaline does not has to leave your body and now you kind of feel sad about it and that's that's what happens that cooling phase is when you now are starting to to go I'm I'm so sorry I Didn't mean to do that I shouldn't have said that I don't even know what came over me right so how that was so true but then how

why do we just keep repeating over and over and over again cuz it's part of our Natural Body and the only way to to slow it down is the pauses and the breathe because what it does is never gets your ignition phase fully set so imagine if you and I were an argument and we started up and all of a sudden we take a break let's just I'm Just going to take even my own breath all of a sudden I kind of come down on the graph and then something else happens I might start to

rise I'm getting upset he reach bre and you kind of start to take it back down again it's telling your body I'm I'm good this is this is I'm still safe this isn't threatening me in some way that's why often when uh the whole point of it is not only controlling and better recognizing those symptoms within Yourself what we talk about and teach is recognizing those symptoms in the other person and knowing that when you're yelling at me I'm not going to take that personally I'm going to recognize it as your ignition phase pleading for

me to go away it is your ignition face to say I am not comfortable with any of this that's what I need to hear the next time I hear somebody raise their voice that's so good um can I ask you a personal Question let's do it I assume you argue with your wife yes is there something that you feel like is the hardest for you that you keep getting trapped in yeah what you see is what you get for the most part and they they would tell you that my family would tell you that what

I will say is what makes a big difference is because she's also attorney and of course you guys get each other completely but the key is that arguments Are very short because it's it's very matter of fact very uh being quick to know where the problem areas lie and so when you are quick to forgive and quick to say apologize and that eliminates 99% of your problems quick to apologize quick to resolve it I mean it just what hurts is when the arguments just go on forever but when you find ways to quickly resolve it

it's going to go away but yes it's for the most part I'm exactly what you see the defensiveness I Would say that's probably my number one weakness as everybody really really is that everyone's problem the main one it's a big main problem defensiveness because it's so reactive it's so just natural to what we do because your body is already just on the alert for anything like if you were to let's say I was looking away and you decid to throw that mug at me like my something in my body would go wh I'm ready in

my peripheral to catch that and so our Bodies are just naturally very perceptive and ready like our reflexes are great right so it's the same thing with our words uh and so when you say something that is hurtful and you say it to hurt me I'm naturally going to get defensive about it but having the ability to regulate your emotions ask where it's coming from how to be assertive with your statements and call it out it's going to make make you a Whole lot better Communicator it's so good your advice is so good and as

we're talking I've interviewed a lot of psychologists on my show and one of the things that made me realize is these tactics that you teach really do go hand in hand with doing the Deep work of your childhood traumas and things what you were taught as a kid really just show up in your adulthood and so I think a lot of it comes from the conditioning that you had as a child especially with women So in thinking about okay maybe you were dismissed as a child for your emotions that then can show up in how

you respond in arguments um how you become defensive in arguments how you take them personally yeah there I mean there's a whole concept of you how you argue now mostly a reflection of how you saw arguments growing up because that's just what you saw I naturally have mannerisms as because it's in my DNA that are reflective of Both my dad and my mom same thing happens with our arguments and the truth is many of them are not healthy for the vast majority of people the way you saw arguments come out and and bred in your

life are not healthy and it's very cultural too that's what I was going to ask you actually because I'm Greek Orthodox so the Greeks areow they interrupt they shout just generically like almost everyone in my family when I go to Cyprus like every Greek I've ever Met is like that and then I come to America and my husband is like from Tacoma Washington like white boy of white boys and so he's just like why is your family shouting oh my God what is happening I'm like that's the Greeks but like in building that relationship and

even how we communicate and as we're talking about conversations we had to understand our base assumptions of how we saw things so my base assumption is if you yell or if you interrupt someone It doesn't mean you're rude it doesn't mean you don't care it just means that you're comfortable being around them exactly my base assumption my husband's base assumption on shouting an interrupting is it means you're rude you don't care you're dismissive and so even in that some of these things I think can be the perception that you've had as a child and the

culture that you've been brought up in absolutely I get a lot of comments uh when I I'll post a video and They'll say this is how we are in Canada this would never work in um you know Japan like there's all kinds of different things of yeah it's very cultural and how we communicate that's why it goes into how you connect with the person that I find crosses bound like cultural boundaries often it's in the little bitty things and just the it's not in all the big words it's in the little bit Words which I

think that's where tone and body language Comes in because it doesn't matter what what uh language you're speaking tone is tone you know when someone's pissed and you know when someone's not um you have not it's not out yet but you have a section or a bonus that you're talking about um in dealing in conversations with narcissists yes this is a Hot Topic especially for my community where a lot of us have felt like they've either been in relationships with narcissists or currently in relationships in the Research that I have have done you can't talk

to a narcissist like you talk to a normal person because they lack so much empathy they literally don't care about where you're coming from talk to me about that let's just put in the legal world so when I'm cross-examining somebody so often I have to remind myself that I'm playing their game like even though I'm in the room with them to them this is their room this is their game their conversation it's not a we're Having a conversation they are and I'm just there and so it's a game of what I call praise or provoke

meaning if you're not just giving them all these this praise well they'll often start an argument with you to get you to begin to have a conflict with them and so they will provoke you into an emotional response because they Delight in your anger as much as they Delight in your praise they like that control and that sense understanding that they are Extremely sensitive to outside perception so if I were to tell them they give me a response that I know is baiting me you never take it because as soon as you do you've been

in that argument where soon as you take the bait from a narcissist now you're the one that has to apologize now they're the victim how quickly that started you go wait wait wait you started this no no no no all of a sudden you just fell into the the Trap of now you're the one that Has to apologize you always do this this is so offensive to me how could you possibly do this and now nothing's going to happen until you fall on the sword even though you're the more reasonable one and you're apologizing you

know so you can't you can't take that bait oh my God it's the manipulation I applauded yeah yeah because it's it's such a I mean you clearly know exactly what is going to bait them you know what's going to uh spark them and so in playing that Game which I think is a very be almost beautiful way of putting it because I think once you start to frame it like that to me again I go to like I I can detach myself from it like it's a game it's not about you Lisa and so thinking

of it like that orients me into a mode and then understanding what they feed off is super important and knowing if you say this then they're going to either feed off it or trigger you or you're going to trigger them um Dr Romany has something called Deep And it stands for don't defend don't engage don't explain and don't personalize I'm very familiar with her work she's she's fantastic um I I agree with all of it the where I would even push it further is the understanding of when you are in the space of somebody who's

um giving you those qualities as a narcissist you have so much power when you do nothing it's the opposite like you feel like you have to manage I have To control I have to get them you don't no you don't I have to say something no you don't you know there's nothing you have to say you just need to be still being still um carries a lot of power I love how calm you are you're very calm um one of the quotes that you said in your book that I love is who you see is

not who you're talking to yeah the person you see isn't the person you're talking to and the reason I love that that line is because it is so relatable To every day and that's the kind of stuff that I I have a passion for that I really really like when it comes to how do you talk about communication I love the everyday little bitty interaction actions and so often when it's let's say you and I are having coffee at a cafe and somebody's being rude to us or the the the the waiter is being rude

so easy to go they're being rude to me instead of understanding the person you see is not the person you're talking to you're Talking to the person who didn't sleep well last night because they're taking care of they're they're six-month old and they're doing it all by themselves and they don't have anybody to reach out to and how offended you must be that they didn't get you your coffee right on time and so those little little moments like this just add a lot of Grace into your life and it's so rewarding and gives you a

whole new sense of Peace when you can apply that to your Communication and unlocks this eyesight that you didn't have before where you can start to see everybody is just a little bit more human that's amazing um I don't know if you've heard of Reddit stories but there's a section called am I the beep okay and I change it to am I the mean girl and so I've got a story for you and I would love for you for you to help us navigate this so the question is am I the mean girl so am

I the mean girl for Telling my mother-in-law that she can't wear white to my wedding so I'm 29 female and I'm getting married soon and I've been very clear with everyone about one thing I want to be the only person wearing white at my wedding I don't think this is unreasonable request it's my wedding and I'm a bride pretty standard right well my mother-in-law who's 55 stopped by recently and said she wanted to show me her dress for the wedding she casually mentioned that it Has some white in it so I assumed maybe it was

a pattern dress or had some detail with lace or trim nope she steps out wearing an all white gown not off-white not cream straight up white I was taken back but kept my call and calmly reminded her that I'd already made it clear I didn't want any one else wearing white I said I'd really like to be the only one in white since you know I'm the bride her response she put on this overly sweet voice and said oh okay Honey that's fine I mean I don't know where I'm going to find a dress this

close to the wedding but I guess I'll just figure it out yeah in looking at the response there were many things that came to mind number one dismissiveness of your boundaries yes number two the passive aggressiveness of it and then number three the guilt tripping yeah guilt tripping is a a funny thing so I I would be on the side of if it is that important to you and that is means that Much to you then there should be the ability say you are not attending if they're going to not abide by those instructions then

they they don't get to they don't get to come I think that this you know oh I I guess I'll have to do this so late in the game this passive aggressiveness I leave it alone don't touch it just let that be passive because what she's doing is trying to also probably be important try to also put some importance on her in some way If you say the person you see isn't the person you're talking to maybe she's feeling some sense of loss in herself or loss of status and that she's now not going to

be the the main caretaker but I will say that if you feel that somebody is not respecting your boundaries enough you have to follow through with what you say so too often when somebody is they put up a boundary and they just do not follow through with it but the reality and I maybe this is just a a female or Male thing I'm not sure but like that would be so hard for a lot of women to turn around to their their future mother-in-law and say you can choose not to come oh forget explosions GW

that the future husband gets brought in the mom's like can you believe your future wife's talking to me like this and this is the woman you're marrying and the wife is like do like just supposed to be my husband you're going to have my back and now the poor gu in the middle like it Becomes this like massive thing now it's the reason why I wanted to pick this story though it wasn't just about the the the Nuance of this specific story it was the idea of how a lot of times you can somewhat be

uh pushed pushed into oh I think you're going to call me on that you don't get to be pushed in it's your choice if you get pushed in you say so it in that moment let me rephrase in that moment where you feel like you are um you're setting bound is and someone's Trying to bulldo them in that moment where someone's being passive aggressive and there isn't a call for it that moment where you feel like you're being disrespected or dismissed that I think can be very Universal um when it comes to someone that is

so close to you that maybe you're not blood related and so in those moments whether it's a partner or a mother-in-law how do you navigate those boundaries when somebody's being that Passive aggressive when somebody is trying to block your boundary in some way and and I'm not I'm not trying to be rude about it by saying yeah sorry you're not going to come but when you have to lay out that boundary I like to do it in terms of a thank you for following it prior to them instead of asking them to thanking them for

doing it without asking so often when you thank them there's kind of this obligation in their mind internally that They've already they have to now live up to that they now have to do it how much you think about them because I don't know if priming is the right word but it feels like you're kind of priming them to oh yeah it's a great word so how what other priming tactics or techniques do you potentially use I like to prime it with the room so let's say you and I sat down I might ask I

want to make sure that this is that this is a room I can be very transparent in I me sure I Didn't say anything about you I said the room I sit down and say okay I just want to make sure this is a room where I can be fully transparent and what's the difference between saying this is a room for being transparent versus I want to be transparent with you because now they're in it now they're in the now they're also in the room ah and so anytime like u in a legal setting let's

say I might sit sit somebody down and say okay I want to make sure this is a Room where you're going to tell me the whole truth even if it hurts can we be in that room and they're like yeah that's fine um often you can even say the it's kind of like framing the the conversation ahead of time of what you want to talk about how you want to end the conversation that's that's a very good way of priming telling them how you want to do it so often we get into conversations and you

you have no idea of where you want to go with it we wait Until we're talking to figure out what we want to say or you actually say in your book like you just say a lot of things and it's like you can't even deal with one issue because there's so much coming at you yeah you just try to cover a whole lot of topics or the other person gets in the conversation and they're not sure where you want to go they they say hey we need to talk you go what about or if you're

you're just giving me paragraph graphs and I'm like Okay what am I supposed to be looking for here all of a sudden I'm wanting to go into fix mode I'm wanting to fix things okay so this is what you going to talk about you're like no no no that's not it just just wait just wait and you start continuing to talk like oh you want to do this no no no no no no no listen to me I'm like I am listening uh you're just not telling me where you're going that's so true okay so

um let's say you're in court and you're trying to Get the truth out of somebody and you want to make them really comfortable so let's say because to me that part is somewhat priming of like okay I want them to feel comfortable around me what are the things that maybe you say to make them comfortable the more comfortable you can make them and how warm you can feel in the conversation the more they feel comfortable with you and the more they want to share in that conversation because they know that this Is a safe place

so if the more angrier I am or the more Curt or short or um more I want to try and prove that they're wrong the the more they want to prove that they're right and so often that's just kind of clam them up you want to want to open them up it's kind of that idea of when you claim it you control it so when I'm maybe you sit somebody down and I if I were to say look I I want to talk about this with you and I will get upset or I am upset

or right I mean You're telling them already there's going to be a part of this that is very upsetting for me and I will get loud or I am going to cry it it does not have to do with you it has to do with the issue in the conversation because if you don't they feel responsible for it then they feel like they made you cry versus the the issue itself so so when you can prime them then they know to expect it it's going to come for a much better Dynamic where they're like it's

not Coming out of nowhere yes one of the things I also want to talk about that uh was fascinating it's called weaponized incompetence and I have a definition of it if you don't mind if I just read it to give it okay so it's when someone intentionally performs a task poorly or claims are incapable of doing it to avoid responsibility or to shift the burden onto somebody else now as we're talking about why this matters in conversations when I think about what Are the reasons why we women feel like we can't speak up that we

can't control our future that we can't control a conversation um there was a stat that according to a survey uh Harris poll 53% of women feel they are labeled as nagging when they are repeatedly expressing their needs their concerns or their frustrations in a relationship this perception often leads to them shutting down or being less vocal about their feelings despite the need to Communicate openly okay so I go to you've got somebody that weaponizes competence by saying I'm I'm really just not good at this they're doing it because they don't want to do it then

you've got the woman so it's like please just do it over time the woman starts to feel like they're a nag they start to be called a nag so what we end up doing is we shut down we don't speak up and we end up doing it ourselves so when someone is weaponized Ing that incompetence how would you even remotely start to address it yeah that's difficult you know people who say let's say the husband's going oh I'm just not good at I'm not good at folding laundry not not good at it you're way better

yeah yeah and yeah exactly once she just do it when you were dealing with somebody who is using incompetence as a weapon to try and get out of things or not lean into things or they feel like they're nagging what I would encourage Them to do is to say when you don't do this I have to say it again you're going to make me need to say it again that's the key point of this instead of in instead of telling them hey go take out the trash will you please go take out the trash hey

because you haven't taken out the trash I'm going to need to ask you again when you do that it is it's not nagging is informing them because this not happen because of X I have to do y the thems the braks you know that's How that is it's not me nagging that's so good because the nagging makes me feel so bad and growing up hearing women being insulted oh she's such a nag like it's absolutely an insult growing up like that isn't a compliment at all and so then you start to go internally it's like

I've told them three times well now I'm just a nag fine I'll just do it myself and that's unfortunately what a lot of us do fine I'll just do it myself yeah and again this is me on the other Side of this no please I actually want you to push back because often well let me say from at least my experience sometimes yeah you can you can have that weaponized incompetence there's also of you might want it done when you want it done and you haven't communicated that to the other person uh because for me

say okay well you clean the dishes oh I might see that in several different steps and I'll get to it in my mind of when that's going to happen but you had A very different idea of when that should happen it should happen immediately so sometimes I tell my son I need you go uh put put up your shoes and he goes okay now I give him a time frame no it could be any time but I I need you to go put issues right now very different so that's really important cuz the whole point

for me in this discussion reading your book is really how do you become aligned like especially with your partner like how do You communicate through arguments through you feel dismissed but they didn't mean to dismiss you all these things that we get tripped up on and even though it's like a little silly example those are the things that end up becoming the big mountain of like arguments that people then escalate and escalate and you go where did it start from and it can be as simple as she asked me to take the garbage out I

wanted to do something nice for her I Didn't do it in her time frame so she did it and now we have this conflict because I didn't show up for her she doesn't feel like I show up for but she didn't give me a chance right and then these become bigger and bigger issues so in that scenario then you're saying be clear on what you're looking for and then be clear on the timeline yes whenever you can put a time frame it's just it's it's just being clear it's uh telling them what they're going to

be And that's the whole point of the the book is and why I have it called the next conversation that we all make mistakes mistakes we all have a lot to learn but it's the next conversation that that matters even more cuz they weren't taught this in school they weren't taught really how to communicate how do you handle people who say things that are ugly how do you communicate things um with confidence and also find a way to connect so that was the whole Point of the book is to give them these three main areas

in the formula of say it with control within yourself say with confidence and bold in yourself and then say it to connect hell yeah you there's a line you book on paraphrase but it's something like um you you're not looking to win the argument you're looking to win at the relationship yeah well the idea of winning is just sold to us everywhere I mean there's books on how to win every argument there's tons of Blogs how to win every argument you ever get into into and that's just is I I I find it to be

disingenuous because the more you win the argument you more you lose the relationship what what did you really win great you threw out that point that that hurt their feelings and now they don't want to be an argument with you oh yeah you said that thing in front of others at the meeting and now you kind of embarrass them what what did you win Really you won awkward silence you won their contempt that's really what it is you it's you lose so much more because you you lost that relationship that connection to actually grow with

that person that's why I say the best time to actually increase your relationship with someone is the difficult conversation there's never going to be a better opportunity the deeper relationship you want to have with someone the greater tolerance you have to have for deeper Conversation and that conversation can go two ways it can go disastrous or it can actually bring you together and that's just one of the thousand reasons I love your book because you're really helping people come together understand each other more speak the same language um this has been phenomenal where can people

find you and you're insanely good book which I'm going to read again by the way I I read it once I have to read it again because I just didn't write Enough notes yeah no they can thank you very much they can um find me at Jefferson fisher.com uh if they enjoy any of my social media Clips uh I make Clips in my car on social media advice this is how this whole thing happened and uh yeah on Instagram Facebook just Jefferson Fisher and uh being able to share so much of the the tools that

I teach and sharing with your community is that's my passion so I'm really really excited and um yeah I'm just thankful For the time a thank you for being here guys guys I am not joking I read this book and as soon as I put it down I was like I have to read it again because there are things that we unanimously struggle with I read the comments I see what you guys are struggling with and standing up for ourselves having our own back being able to defend ourselves with confidence without feeling like we have

to fall to our knees every time we have a difficult conversation is something That a lot of us struggle with and I'm telling you this book has so many tactical things that we can do in order to stand out for ourselves it's got scripts it's got anecdotes it's got stories like you got to go check it out if you're not following me follow me at Leisa bil and guys if this episode brought you value please please do smash that subscribe button and until next time be the hero of your own life peace if you want

to stop tolerating his Shitty behavior and set the right boundaries that they're going to stick to then click here right now why the hell do we tolerate shitty behavior from the one person that's supposed to love us the most because what we really want is to have