[Music] you've asked us to cover the effects of narcissistic parents on their children so we sat down with dr seth meyers to explain how to spot the signs of narcissistic traits in your parents plus we discuss how to cope with those psychological effects of having one or more parents with narcissism all right now narcissism may be one of my favorite for lack of better term mental health topics what is narcissism so narcissism is a personality disorder the official name is narcissistic personality disorder it involves a few central uh criteria an over-inflated um overt sense of
the self um it involves lack of empathy at times with others it involves a difficulty in relationships so there are several things involved in that here's what's most important though with understanding a narcissist a narcissist is not who they appear to be on the surface think about it like an astrological sign of a gemini right there's two selves that is who the narcissist is so there who is who the narcissist tries to appear to be on the surface the image they try to sell to the public and to themselves and then there is their underlying
true self now of course anybody who really likes themselves loves themselves isn't going to be so hell-bent on proving to the world how great they are how superior they are so clearly what they don't know is they're so much more transparent in some ways than they know so there's the two selves there's the false self which is the self they try to sell to the world and there's the real self which is how they really feel and deep down there is an insecurity a feeling that there's only enough love and attention enough accolades to go
around so it's a bit of a chess game you must do what you can to make sure you get as much attention as possible got it now before we talk about the implications with having parents who are narcissists let's first talk about what a healthy romantic relationship looks like so a romantic relationship between two adults involves emotional intimacy now to have emotional intimacy what do you need vulnerability you need to be able to say i show parts of myself that even i may not like or be comfortable with i admit feelings of weakness feelings of
uncertainty i depend on someone else i go to them i lay myself down to someone in that way and they do the same so in a healthy romantic relationship there's intimacy both people are willing to be vulnerable neither person ever cares about something called power who has more power at a given moment yes you mentioned being or depending on the other person in a healthy relationship is it true that we also must have some independence for in ourselves a healthy relationship it's a mix of dependence yes and healthy dependence i'll give you an example um
a single person who doesn't have good relationships or is uncomfortable with relationships one of the things you may want to do is consider getting a pet getting a dog for example that teaches you through the practice of daily taking care of that animal that someone depends on you and you comfortable you actually come to depend on that person too so dependence can be very helpful just not depending too much okay uh parents who are narcissists yeah have children and there are a lot of consequences that come from the child being raised by two narcissists what
is one of the big red flags that you could see in a person who might have been raised with two narcissistic parents an adult who inherently feels like they're not good enough who beats themselves up who va who questions their own value their own values who has relationships that are dramatic um where people treat them badly in 99 of those cases did that adult when they were young have a parent who unconditionally loved them probably not because why on earth then would they ever say at 18 20 25 years old hey i'm gonna totally change
the types of relationships i have i'm used to being treated great being valued feeling like i count and i'm i'm just okay the way i am and now i'm gonna actually go into relationships where i'm treated like crap where i don't get called back where i have to chase them where i have to constantly wonder if they really care about me because they had narcissistic parents so a lot of times if someone questions their own worth doesn't have that self-confidence um a lot of times they had a narcissistic parent now they could also have had
other issues maybe they had a trauma background and whatever one of the hallmarks of someone who is raised by a narcissist is the overachiever who is telling themselves if i achieve this that and the other then finally i'll be good enough is it common for narcissistic parents to raise narcissistic children it's a great question so what a lot of the literature says is kind of depressing for children who are raised by narcissists which is that if you are raised by narcissist you too may take on some of those narcissistic qualities and it makes perfect sense
when you think about it right in a parent relationship that's the closest relationship a child has with really anybody and that the degree to which a child depends on a parent so they are figuring out all kinds of things in that relationship so it makes sense then if a parent treats a child in a certain disrespectful dismissing unloving negligent way that later in life that person would do the same thing to somebody else in a romantic relationship so they might behave narcissistically in a relationship and they also might seek out somebody who is a narcissist
right and think about it this way kyle they should right that's what they were told right that's that's the that's the narcissistic parenting program that they were taught and they were the best little students in the world right so here's the thing what is one thing that can break the cycle raised by a narcissist you don't want to be a narcissist too get therapy get therapy and and that will help you gain some self-awareness um it doesn't need to be just therapy though it can be getting educated simply going online and doing searches for what
is the effect of a parent who treats a child badly right so just getting educated could be a relationship you have with someone at the church could be a coach that you develop a close relationship with but the really sad thing is you know and it's just sad all around for a child who is raised by someone like that because it's conditional that they understand from the beginning don't get too cocky you're not just gonna be loved it's it's not that's not a part of the deal now you will be loved if you meet these
various stipulations in the contract here's why that is important earlier i was talking about the narcissists two selves there's the false self the self they want everybody to believe they even try so hard to believe themselves and then there's their real self what that means is to the narcissist image is everything so when a parent has a child what does it mean that child is the child is what we call a narcissistic extension of the parent so that child fails in school that child doesn't live up to the image the parent wants the overall family
to represent the child will be criticized shut out frozen out dismissed you know disowned it's really sad it's really sad but at the end of the day it's not a tragedy as long as the person who is raised like that talks to friends is honest about their feelings because objective people will give them feedback hey what the parenting you got it was messed up it wasn't right see the child who was raised like this they don't have that healthy editor right they were not allowed to be angry right they were not allowed to be resentful
or screw up that's right do you think there are more narcissistic parents today than there were 50 years ago well in terms of generations um i would say that you know we talk about millennials these days right the attachment the obsession the the attachment to electronic devices it's a very um it's a very unique relationship notice it's it's the individual having a relationship with something that's not a person yeah so i would suggest if there are any generational differences we may see it in in decades in the future where you know parents get off your
devices and actually connect with your child you know when someone's watching this and they think you know i just had the realization that i likely had narcissistic parents and they are going to seek treatment for them for themselves or reach out to like you said friends or coaches to get honest feedback at any point should they go back to their parents and address it with them well again that's a really good question but the question gets to the root of one of the hallmarks of narcissism which is narcissism means there will be no self-awareness no
accountability so i'm your narcissistic parent i just make you feel like you need to do what i say you need to be better you can call me out on things i've said or done i will never take ownership of it i cannot allow that now what's happening underneath it all psychologically is the narcissist this is unconscious they have fought for so long to build up these strong defenses they can't let themselves think there's anything wrong with them they can't even let it in they are afraid if they acknowledge one little flaw or one thing they
did wrong that that will open up the floodgates and then they will be targeted and attacked what's so sad is narcissists are not evil people narcissists they were actually victims too someone taught them that in close interpersonal relationships there is something called power what like where did that ever come from but that exists in relationships with people with personality disorders what does exist of course there are differences between parent and child the parent is the authority but that's different from the powerful one yes the person in authority also has the responsibility of protecting of setting
aside their own feelings acknowledging the differences in their child all these things are absent in the narcissist but what people need to remember is just because you have a narcissistic parent doesn't mean that they are a bad or evil person i promise you if you look deeper at the relationship they had with their parents it wasn't probably so great either and i i want people watching this who think well maybe i have narcissism it doesn't mean you are a bad person if anything this is a great opportunity to use this information go the next step
and get therapy and make some changes to just make your life better there's i'd never like the stigma of a label you know because that doesn't do anything all it is is it gives us information to take the next right steps right right i mean we are all works in progress you know yes it is never too late to change and the most impressive the happiest the most powerful people in this world they are actually people who can say things like i don't know or did i mess that up a little vulnerability a little humility
you know so so so let's go for a mix let's not always try to be so strong to win to let everybody know we're boss you'll have much better relationships much more peace in your relationships if you can give out a little vulnerability and you also accept it um in others when they show it to you yeah that's so that just makes me feel so good i'm going to work on being more vulnerable i think that's something that i can we all have right yeah of course i want to end with this question if a
loved one or a friend has a pattern of seeking out romantic relationships with a narcissist what can that person do to help their friend so if you see somebody who is suffering in romantic relationships who is routinely going for people that that make that person kind of feel like crap you don't need to say many words at all okay right you don't need to educate them in a 30-minute monologue it's just saying simple things to get them to see for real how they feel at root which is is this relationship making you feel good or
is this what relationships are really for aren't relationships supposed to be sources of comfort not stress yeah yes relationships can be stressful but overall aren't they supposed to build us up yeah not tear us down you know and and you give all we all need in our lives is someone to give us not 25 sentences of advice but just little nuggets that then we can go get in our car close the door drive home for that whatever 10 minute drive and think about ourselves and that's where the clicks happen we just need a little nugget
so give someone you care about a little nugget are you sure this is working for you honey i really think there is something better for you out there yeah um i love that i love asking a question is also way more uh way less aggressive than judgment could you ask um what would your ideal relationship look like and after they explain it say and are you getting that in this relationship it's it's a version of something i would recommend a way of tweaking it is i would say when you think about the relationship when you
were little think back to like when you imagined as a grown-up the kind of relationship you'd have when you pictured that person what's the main feeling you hoped that person would make you feel yeah yeah and i guarantee you it won't be the feelings they're feeling in this relationship wow right do you feel safe in this relationship does this relationship make you feel secure it is possible you know and one of the things that i say to my patients is you may not be ready now but there may come a day where you say you
know what i'm gonna actually just surrender and give up and say i'm actually just gonna let myself be happy nothing else to say after that perfect
