[Music] what's up everyone welcome back to the collider interview Studio at Tiff 2024 brought to you by Range Rover Sport at the cinema center I can't contain my enthusiasm for this movie do we get a Range Rover as a paron gift I just want to say I mean isn't Range Rover Sport just the absolute best sorry didn't mean to derail things but I need a new car okay I need more movie is like the substance in my life my God it really is something I was just saying before I felt like like I left the
theater like buzzing and like I was on fire in the best possible way thank you for your movie thank you so much corly I want to start with you in terms of crafting this story I'm curious what is the one specific idea that kind of kicked it all off for you but then also did you have a break story moment on it something you came up with along the way that made it feel whole uh I would say the one thing um that gives this story uh uh bring this story to life I think would
be my my life since I'm a kid I think about how you know I have to live with the my own image and how I learned to be super violent about it and it made me feel that I was never good enough and at each age you have a reason that you can find uh that something not enough and I questioned myself about the violence of it and when I was past my 40s and aiming to my 50s it became even more violent that now this is it I'm going to be erased it's the end
of it and I felt it that it was so um absurd but at the same time so real this so being here that I wanted to say okay I have to do something with it it's time now to kind of say enough um I want to let this yes violence go out and hopefully make a change you sharing that personal experience via a film is definitely going to inspire a lot of other people struggling with the same thing to find peace with it so again thank you for that thank you I I hope very much
and also I want to say like I don't want to add another injunction to women to now you have to feel good about yourself because it's it's such a path and I think it's a when you grew up you know with all those injunction getting rid of them is a long journey and it's a step by steps and each one his own Rhythm never ending Journey we always have to work I have a a specific kind of I guess like rules and lore question because I tend to get obsessed with the details and I am
curious when you came up with the idea for the substance specifically did it come to you kind of fully formed or was there any kind of playing with how it works uh nothing comes fully form when you write a script it always start start with an idea with some intuitions in my case with some images and some sound which start to give the vibe Vibe of the movie that I want to make and then I think it's step by step um that you get to the core of what is really important and that the ideas
arrive because I think thematically um you kind of make it clear what you want to discuss and then you welcome the ideas that's going to symbolize it the the best so effective how all this came together all right to me Margaret I'm coming your way now I don't know if this is exactly how you approach Your Role but someone recently brought this up to me and it's been weighing on my mind how when you start on a new project it can be a little scary because you're on unstable ground and then you have that moment
either in prep or on set when you do something and you know you have just found your character did you have that moment with these characters and if so how did it go [Laughter] you know there's a really interesting aspect because this doesn't have a lot of dialogue and so for me I felt like I needed to do a lot more work before I even got to the set to really have all of Elizabeth within me everything so that it was like alive at all moments everything that was occurring so it wasn't really that it
took place on the set like but I think you're right that can happen where you kind of lock in um but for me it was almost like really before I got there makes sense how about for you I mean I'm I'm like to me I do a lot of work before I come to set so like for Sue for example A lot of it was about a physical transformation like working out and trying to make my my body um be what Corley had envis for Su which was like more curvaceous and um strong and um
and also I had some help from a prosthetic team because she need to have big boobs and so we we glued some boobs on and that um the physical transformation does does a lot and then also just like I I spent a lot of time walking around my apartment freaking my husband out by like by like you know like kind of like walking doing Sue in the house which he didn't like uh yeah so I I guess there there's all of that and then there is you know to your point that the feeling when you're
on set and you've and in the case of Sue you've got the extensions on you got the boobs on you got the outfit on and you're like well we're doing the thing TR was extensions everywhere yeah there's like almost you've lost all Mobility there you are hearing there hearing you both say their names is making me think of this Cory I don't know how much thought you put into this specific detail but a character's name means a lot so how did you specifically settle on Elizabeth Sparkle and Sue um well I work with symbolism in
my movie there is not a lot dialogue so yes image and sound and I think everything that a kind of symbolize in a very simple way and meaningful way I like it so I I for the sparkle was this idea of you know to shine to be under the light and to yes have this you know uh moment that means happiness um and I guess Elizabeth I don't know why it came that way but probably because it was it had this you know iconic Resonance of you know uh um all the big movie stars in
the past uh um and I remember at some point you know somebody tried to make me in production maybe changed the name because we didn't want to have like legal issues or I don't know I don't know why I said no no way uh I don't know I knew you know this this uh name was important um uh for Sue I always thought and I don't know if we talked about this but I always thought it was because the shape it makes while you say the like it's interesting it's like I didn't think about that
but I guess like I noticed that in the performance yeah that is kind of like inherently sexual just like well I I think the the sue the Sue stuff for me it probably had some kind of yes of sexy connotation like this stuff that Lolita baby doll like um it represent I think this to me uh and again a way to symbolize what Margaret's character was for example the Name Margaret like doesn't like L Margaret you know it's just like what it's worth Perry doesn't either to dig into Elizabeth a little more and I don't
know if this is something the two of you discussed but it really stuck out to me in the movie and I I appreciate it so the substance essentially like takes a sledgehammer to all of the absolutely ridiculous expectations society places on how women should look the movie also never judges Elizabeth for for chasing those expectations which I really appreciated was that intentional and did you two ever discuss it well for me of of course like uh uh the the whole idea of the movie is like to make people understand why we think we have no
choice but but to chase that because that's the only way I think for a long time Society has valued women you know like through their appearance through the fact that they are young that they are sexy that they can give birth that you know and as soon as so that's the way that you build for yourself some way to be loved some way to have a place in the world and when this go away no one doesn't want to have a place in in the world anymore no one's want to disappear so I think many
of us think that the only way to still have a place to still have an existence to still have people loving us is through seeking you know Eternal use or like hypersexualization and so I I wouldn't blame anyone for just wanting to exist um and I think the way still Society is structured and everything that is around still make us feel very much that's the only one of the only way that that we have it's starting to change a little bit but I think it's going to take a lot of time until like we really
feel for real that there are that we should take our our place in the world um so I don't know for you D well I think what's interesting in the film is that it's so intimate in terms of it really is the experience for Elizabeth with herself everything I mean there's external um situations but it it's so what what I loved is that it's so much more about what she's doing to herself not even what's not not what's the Judgment that's even happening outside I mean that you know kind of kicks the film off with
that level of Despair and rejection that she's feeling that I think we is human all can relate to but I think it's interesting that you say that there wasn't a judgment because I and I've never actually thought about it because I obviously I was so much more inside of it and what she was doing to herself was so much more violent than anything that was happening on the outside okay mine is Dennis and the shrimp I will watch any horror movie body horror you name I will not flinch I think watching him eat the shrimp
might be the first time in years that I actually lifted my hands to cover my eyes no it was I think also because when we were shooting it the sound but also he was so committed he was so committed I mean I don't know how many shrimp he actually ate that day he ate two kilos for real like it was but like just I I mean he I mean Dennis you know came in after we lost Ray Leota and but was so gungho so all in and really had was Fearless I feel like I mean
he really was fear but I um yeah but that's came in after we've been working for like 3 months and gave us like a a little a little energy injection with his hot dolab red suits and I'm going to steal the word Fearless now and apply it to to both of your performances when you were gearing up to shoot this is there any particular scene or quality of your character that you know you had the most fear about approaching um I would say it's hard because pretty much just like every day everything was scary I
mean I think look we we were both at we both were exposed in different ways like Margaret was pushing her body in this overly sexualized way which was different like for me having to show up every day and it not being about highlighting the things that were my least glamorous my least you know attractive and that at the end though I don't want to speak for Margaret but I will I think we both had aspects that were very liberating at the end totally because we are one we are one oh I can't wait to talk
about certain things that I'm not allowed to bring up right now but I want to make sure to sell your movie to people who haven't seen it because it is phenomenal so going back into the idea of of needing to be Fearless when tackling this I feel like one of the most important things with having the confidence in yourself to do that is having the right scene partner by you so can you each tell me something about the other that you know made you safe and gave you the confidence in yourself to go there with
these roles I think we were with each other 100% And you know obviously we didn't have as many scenes together and the ones we did have we were naked on a cold tile floor um and so I think I feel like we we know each other really well yes out but I think we really like it was just an distinctively looking out in a very you know comforting way also just like instantly love to me I've loved her uh from afar for for a long time so then like having the pleasure of meeting her working
with her and getting to know her has just been the best I'll follow up on that can you each tell me the first thing you saw in the other that you know made you say like de is the perfect Elizabeth Sparkle to my Sue and then vice versa for you I don't know if there was like I I feel like as soon as corly mentioned Margaret first of all I already knew the depth and integrity of the of where she was wanting to go and that it was not just about this e e external you
know image that it was really about somebody who could deliver from the inside so I like it was already like gung-ho let's go like I mean all in because you know I think that Mar like is willing to get dirty like you know like I feel that in her career too I mean she's delivered like iconic role after iconic role GI Jane's one of my favorites of all times but like she's someone who's always pushed the boundaries and um surprised everyone with how she shows up like going to New Territory and this is a obvious
example of of of that that quality in all of you is what keeps me coming back to your work I'll I'll ask the two of you now to give Corley some flowers because obviously you need a good leader at the helm to feel safe and comfortable going to these places so what is something she did for you as an actor's director that you think teed you up for success I mean this is one of the I think it was the script I think like you know when we sat down like you don't you don't come
across material that's so complex and you know that um it's a unique daring that is also creating a visually riveting world you know so I and I think corley's very detailed and it and so it was like she just she laid it out there for us corly I really want to ask you about some of the the I guess the blood the gour the Prosthetics I'm not going to push it too far so I'll stick with a broader question for this but for another filmmaker who kind of wants to swing as big as you do
in this movie on their own film what would you say is one do and one do not you would recommend for doing heavy Prosthetics based on your experience making the substance um I would definitely not recommend for a first movie to do that much heavy prosthetic because I think it's good that you've already explored the how complex a shooting can be and have a little bit you know uh experience before you go into that world because it definitely creat uh like beautiful stuff and amazing but a lot of constraint in term of shooting um and
it's true like the amount of Prosthetics that we had is like almost unknown since you know the the the thing and the prosthetic supervisor ended up in mental hospital I think after the the thing because it's it's huge and and I think we don't realize how um how it adds a lot of complexity to just you know creating great performance and everything was kind of tied to those constraints in term of timings in term of the way the order we had to shoot so sometimes we're we had to shoot in totally absurd um uh order
because of the prosthetic con constraint um uh it's so many hours in the chair to get this done uh it's so uncomfortable to wear uh so definitely that's not the you know the easiest for for the actors to work with um and so that's why also we ended up like having such a long shoot because I wanted to do everything for real but then we ended up shooting almost five months I think um so you know when you talk about it you say oh yeah yeah it's it's good let's do it and and you know
when it's everything becomes long all the difficulties are kind of heightened because like you don't have the fresh air to renew your yourself you were mentioning Dennis he was the new element that arrived it's true that brings a little bit of something different otherwise it's just almost the three of us in a white room with prosthetic doing the same thing over and over again because the film is is very obsessive and you know very uh redoing the same scenes you know in in in in different direction so uh I must say like uh um I
think we did we did good going through all this because it was very challenging it was I think very uncomfortable at some moments uh because they had to bear with all the yeah the the the the CH technical challenges that is not I think the easiest for the actors to have first time director don't do yeah like to answer the question like and and uh um yeah and after I I I think it's a um [Music] uh I I think it on the other side it also brought I think what is also unique in the
film like I know that thei you created your your iterations of your characters by wearing the prosthetic and I I remember she never complained one second of the long hours in the chairs because I think that's kind of where you were putting also the suit of your performance because you start to embody like through through the transformation but it it is I think physically for all you know departments because when you're in the chair anywhere from six to n hours and then you have only so few hours to shoot and we were doing something that
was also not still it was very physical which this is very delicate like all the stuff around the face like I think you were talking the other day Margaret about how you know like it would start to be B problem was I was having to like cry while I had the monster costume in so at a this is graphic at a certain point you're just like swimming and you're there's like a layer of tears and snot inside your you start to like see and they're just trying to glue it down and you've just got like
pools of like tears and snot snot glued to your head there is a the whole industry around them to kind of cool them like there is hoses to do airons in the in the suit like they could drink with a stro like to refresh how she said de me never complain well that was pointed everything you all went through to pull that off is is something else beautiful I've seen a lot of things I've never seen anything quite like that but also like my horror movie loving mind appreciates seeing big swings like that but ones
that are done with purpose and have something to say so job well done every single layer with that um I did want to ask a personal question for each of you based on the content of the movie because again this movie basically says like a big you to every single expectation that is placed on a woman whether it is about how her body must look or how she operates in the world so can you each give me an example of something about yourself or the way you operate that you thought was wrong and then you
came to realize like no like you all suck this is my truth and I'm going to embrace it now I mean so many things I used to my my hands and feet really bothered me as a kid I used to I have really big feet and I would put my feet into like way too small shoes and then that made them worse that made my feet worse you know cuz then your like toes are kind of like um and I used to like sit on my I've got like big long hand I was just like
a tall like you know I was tall than all the boys growing up and I then I remember someone telling me my knees were weird so I stopped wearing dresses for a long time like just all kinds of things that you're just like well I'll never show my knees again no but that's really the craziest things that really happen that's that's what I mean like the craziness of it is like how how true it is and how strong it is and how violent it is and and and that's crazy yes that that is we all
I think have little things all I and I mean the number of the ones I have like no but totally and that's uh uh and and I think to be honest like you for me I would say I think you have it for life like and you can just pretend sometime that it EAS is and and it does easy but I think you find another thing once you've get rid of maybe okay the fits are okay then it's oh okay maybe my elbow are problematic or or whatever like there is I think it's the mental
process that is so strong um yeah it's endless I think no it really is I feel like it's unfair to ask you all for an example without giving one I'll never forget when I first moved out to LA and did my first collider video Someone one person in a comment section was like like she needs to wax her lip I left wax my lip for the F now I'm cursing um for the first time in my life and then nothing looked any different after I'm like I just listened to a commenter for a stupid reason
that didn't apply and I I think about that all the time whenever I see a comment that criticizes something I'm like that's probably not true true who cares not true who cares yeah so for me um so I I feel like i' I've had my own Journey around placing a lot of value especially when I was younger on my body and what it looked like and that if it wasn't thin that that I was less valuable but what I've come to really see and I do believe believe it it is an ongoing Journey like we
come up against things but um there's a couple of things which is you know we have the circumstances of our Collective Consciousness that has for a long time seen women's value as diminishing as they age as they're being certain you know uh uh idealized uh body types faces looks that are you know more desirable than others but at the end of the day I feel that all of that is in service to us that it's happening for us not to us that it is there essentially so that we can actually get to the place that
is of self-love and self-acceptance because you know what other people do or don't do is irrelevant how we hold it is everything and that's what creates our reality and our experience it's like you believing that your upper lip was not acceptable then made you insecure but thereby you did something but to get to the place now where you could that doesn't actually matter but you wouldn't have known that without that experience it's very true it's very true I'm going to lean into self-love for my last question this is a question I've gotten in the habit
of asking a lot lately because I think it's very important in this industry we give each other Awards I think that is super cool we she keep doing that I find that nobody says good job to themselves nearly enough I want to know something you each accomplish making the substance that you know you'll be able to look back on and say I am so proud of what I did there I mean I I I think there is an any one piece I feel like it's the whole I feel like you know for me knowing that
um I was like letting go of actually needing to look good letting go and that you know I don't know I don't know if there's like I can't say one thing I think it was it was tackling the whole I mean if I like really am honest for me it was well there there's that I wasn't going to say that but I was going to I was going to say within the in relationship to the conversation we're having right now was like I'm meant to be playing perfect right and like no one can play perfect
no one's perfect and I'm so I it couldn't it wasn't my idea of perfect now it's you know I'm going to what Coral's idea of perfect is within the concept of her you know under male gaze within the context of her story right um but even that is kind of impossible to do you know like we relying on Prosthetics and working out and all these things but I guess just like the reality is is that I didn't realize how like emotionally challenging that was going to be um to try to look perfect um so trying
to be kind to myself throughout that process um and like protect my within that um as naturally you kind of never feel perfect um and I think in life I'm I'm pretty okay with that you know like I like what is different about me and and I can be pretty nice to myself but when the idea is to play quote unquote perfect it can be really hard so I guess I'm proud of like not losing my mind I get I get it I respect the answer a good deal corle you want to take us home
on this one um yeah I would I would say a bit like the me I don't think there is one specific thing but for me obviously like just to be able to achieve the movie like to as you said from the very first idea till now us here it's five years you know of having to um fight a lot together everything to get the movie finan to you know um not lose my creative freedom which can also happen you know uh uh for for some films um stepping into the the English you know world uh
of making film but still doing it at home in France which was which was great um yeah and basically like uh uh accomplishing what I had in in my in in my head it's it's a you know it's it's a it's a long journey it can be really tough on the way I think for all of us like uh but in the end I'm I'm really proud that the movie respond because I think yeah we I allowed myself to be strong and ambitious and to and to think that this movie Yes was important would matter
and would have a respond in the world but in then you never know so that's great to have it here and I'll just add if I may that I think the one of the parts of the self-love is also being able to depict Elizabeth to have the Rival with Sue but to be here today also representing being an older woman that we aren't that and that we don't have to rival that we are connected and we are one in other ways and I think that that's part of the living you know part of the legacy
of what we've shared oh my God that's so true to love all of you I love this movie seriously you should be so proud you made a movie that is just like Bonkers and wildly entertaining but also a movie that I deeply believe is going to make people out there who see it be kinder to each other and also themselves and that's a really beautiful thing that we need more of huge congratulations on the substance to everybody out there do not miss the movie also stay tuned we have so much more coming your way from
Tiff 2024 [Music]
