not only might Marco Rubio leave the administration you think Elon Musk may as well yeah I think so um you know he's going to become uh kind of the lightning rod for all of this that's happening they're going to either very quickly or a few weeks down the road road realize that a lot of these um let's call it destruction to the federal bureaucracy is U going to really make people's lives harder do you think Michael we may also see the possibility of a fractur ing of of the Trump Administration when it comes to Ukraine
the New York Times reported over the weekend about a very fractur cabinet meeting that happened last week reportedly a spat between Secretary of State Marco Rubio and Elon Musk over musk department for government efficiency Doge as it's become known and obviously that that's not directly about Ukraine but we understand that behind the scenes musk and Rubio have slightly different approaches to Ukraine do you think there's a chance that some of those divisions could spill over in into the way the Trump Administration is approaching the War I don't think so and I'll tell you why because
I think um there may come a point pretty soon um it's hard to believe the um inauguration was in January we're only in March seems like an eternity ago but I wouldn't be surprised if Marco Rubio um exits on his own I think the other thing you'll see if there is any dissent at the cabinet table or elsewhere you'll see um Trump um voiced his favorite phrase you're fired so he won't tolerate any descent whatsoever and you know you do have to wonder because I I think um there are some U growingup uh genes in
some of these key players from the American side that they do see the value of bringing peace to the region because we're also intertwined and interconnected these days that you know a a War or conflict in one part of the world can easily affect the entire global economy so I think um the the gentlemen coming to the negotiating table this week um are sincere about wanting peace although they do tend to contradict themselves as well but at the end of the day it's Mr Trump to make the decision and uh as the Canadians are finding
out very quickly he can say one thing one day and another thing completely different the next depending perhaps of what mood he woke up when you know what mood he woke up in or what he ate that day or what was the last thing someone whispered into his ear but one thing um this is kind of going back to your earlier question is um I think it's also becoming clear or if it didn't become clear to people should have in that Oval Office uh chaotic dust up that Mr Trump has in his um uh puppet
vice president JD Vance has have unbelievable animosity towards Mr zalinski and towards Ukraine I don't think this was an act I think what you saw was was genuine anger um bubbling like like bubbling up like Lava Hot Lava out of a volcano um uh Mr Trump you know recalled things that go back years and years and years and the problem with his type of Personality trait I think is that he doesn't forget things he's very vindictive and of course that doesn't uh play well for Ukraine oh I wanted to ask you about the importance of
Elon Musk starlink satellites system because over the weekend he called it the backbone of the Ukrainian Army and he said their entire front line would collapse if I turned it off separately Marco Rubio had a spat with the Polish foreign minister over who is paying for the starlings how important are they to the Ukrainian war effort and do you think there is a chance that Elon mus says you're not using them anymore yeah there is a very good chance I mean he reportedly restricted uh use of the starlink system um over Crimea the Ukrainian border
there giving the ukrainians a disadvantage because he apparently thought that this might lead to World War III or something like that but um you know I I think uh in a way it was good that this came out in public because now gives the ukrainians an opportunity and it certain certainly set off alarm bells and Warsaw and other European capitals that something needs to be produced to replay to um replace this and yeah the Ukrainian military is very very reliant on them it gives you internet access basically Anywhere But as Mr zalinsky pointed out as
well there are a lot of um humanitarian and other organizations in Ukraine that rely on it I mean I used it the other day on a bus traveling from um Odessa to the Border there was starlink available there so um Ukraine is a very high-tech wired place but you know closer to get to the front you get to the front line the more damage and destruction there is um overhead wires underground cable things like that so um you need a kind of independent secure very secure system like that I mean you know you mentioned Elon
Musk uh the the king of the tech Bros and uh there are questions now being raised in the past days after that apparent um chaos at the in the cabinet room how long he will be around because the other thing we do know about Mr Trump by this point is that he doesn't like anybody overshadowing him and um I think um I may be going a little bit off topic here but I think it's important to say this I think um you know at the pace they're going with cutting uh jobs and benefits that are
now very indiscriminate to the point that they're affecting veterans and other supporters of Mr Trump um that this could very well backfire and I don't mean only Mr Elon Musk uh exiting the scene but a huge uh turmoil in the United States I've had very very smart American friends tell me they fear that because of what's going on at there very rapid Pace who knows there could be a Civil War and you think it's it's perfectly possible that that in the next who knows few weeks few months not only might Marco Rubio leave the administration
you think Elon Musk may as well yeah I think so um you know he's going to become uh kind of the lightning rod for all of this that's happening they're going to either very quickly or a few weeks down the road road realize that a lot of these um let's call it destruction to the federal bureaucracy is U going to really make people's lives harder I mean I was stunned um when Mr Trump in his bombastic address to the Joint session Congress said you're going to addressing Americans you're going to feel a little bit of
pain uhuh I think it's going to be a lot of pain and you know now we see he's backtracking on certain things for example tariffs that he slapped on to the Auto industry he's realizing oh gosh that's going to raise the price of cars or you know these big gas guzzling machines um prices all over could go up so um it's it's it's turning out to be a little bit like an Administration in in chaos uh and um again as we've already talked about it's causing so much chaos and uncertainty I mean it's got to
the point clearly where it's already influenced um the uh uh race for the new leader leader of the liberal party in Canada uh the Liberals have vastly improved their uh support in in Canada whereas the ru the opposition conservatives may not have have a majority government they're still going to win but not to the point where they thought and then similarly in Ukraine uh the popularity of zalinski has gone up quite a bit because of Mr Trump's attack and I'm not talking about only the official um polling data but in my daily interactions with countless
ukrainians they all say he's he's he's a strong leader we have to hang on to him thank you for watching Frontline for times radio with me James Hansen for more on the war in Ukraine and other Global conflicts you can subscribe or sign up for a membership for exclusive videos and you can also get the latest news and Analysis on times radio or from the times.com
