How To Turn Your Idea Into Millions With Jade Holland Cooper

When are you going to slow down when is there enough money why don't you just retire was just not a narrative I could understand B Cooper has grown into a global brand that now turns over 40 million a year what were some of the early challenges you faced with building in the business people give you 5 minutes who are you what are you doing I booked a stand at badminton horse trials and I arrived with like 15 or 20 Minik Skirts on a 2 meter stand talk to me about Holland Cooper's first big break so

I'd like to talk about the fact that you have children and you're running this business you're trying to be a mom a a wife a businesswoman it's not easy and it's not everyday as a Bed of Roses we make it work and we juggle what are some of the habits that you have in place yourself I don't think you can build anything without that tenacity without that Obsession the business sort Of engulfs you sometimes I think why am I doing this to myself that mental load is very very heavy it's quite isolating cuz you don't

really have anyone to talk to what is up and welcome to working hard hardly working today I'm joined by Jade Holland Cooper she is a Powerhouse in British fashion she founded Holland Cooper in 2008 with the ambition to bring luxury British Heritage to a modern audience and what began as a small collection of tailored Tweed Clothing that she sold on a stand at horse shows has grown into a global brand that now turns over 40 million a year I wanted this episode to be a deep dive into her journey how she went from Country Fairs

to building an empire the key inflection points and what it is about her that's given her such a mindset set for success and viral product creation if you're interested in entrepreneurship brand building and the very real behind the scenes of having a Business that big this episode is definitely for you before we get into the episode it makes a huge difference to us as a podcast if you can just go and click that like button and subscribe to the channel what that does is make sure the podcast is getting in front of the right people

and means that we can have more interesting conversations with interesting people [Music] thank you so much for joining me thank You for having me I have been looking forward to this episode in particular for so long I remember your name popping up when we were talking about episode planning and I was like yes like I love I love the way that you build your business online and I love consuming that content and yeah I'm just really excited for this conversation thank you thank you for having me I've been so excited to be on it and

nervous cuz I've not really done anything like this Before amazingly I think this is my first one well the best exactly that is what they say um I want to go straight into talking about your early life I find that gives us a good background of finding out kind of who you are could you tell us a little bit about what Young Jade was like I've heard a story about you having an egg business was it age nine yes that is right um so as a child I mean I I had a lovely childhood I

I really did it was a very I was Allowed to be a child I think for a long time I was very shy um I love being out outside I was very lucky to to grow up on a farm so I had a very free childhood um and that involved ponies and chickens and dogs and um you know living in my Jers and just running around being free and and I'm looking back on that I'm incredibly grateful to have had that time um and I lo I loved the horses we were lucky to have to

have ponies from a young age and I think that definitely Taught me a lot of things you know my parents said you can have a pony but you'll be doing it all and from an early age that's what I was doing you know before school and after school and everything in between and uh yeah I I had chickens I loved my chickens and I did start an egg business when I as you say when I was nine and that just consisted of taking the eggs to school flogging them to whoever would buy them and that

that was essentially the start Of I suppose my first business and I I found when I went home uh last year my little notebook which was effectively my first kind of profit and loss where I'd written down you know bought a bucket and bought a feeder and you know sold this many eggs and it was it was lovely to look back on that and I I you know I didn't think that much of it at the time I don't think but looking back I suppose that was the start of the seed of trading yeah and

did you from that point Onwards because obviously there's a big gap between um both nine and you know coming into adulthood and also a big gap between an egg business and the enormous business you have now did you know from that point onwards that kind of you were an entrepr entrepreneurial person or were there different views of success that you had in your head in terms of you know I'm going to I don't know leave school and go to university or I'm going to leave school and do this or I think In a nutshell no

I I really didn't I I felt like I was the only kid at school that didn't know what I wanted to do um and I felt like everyone knew you know they wanted to be a doctor they wanted to be this they wanted to be that I I didn't know what I wanted to do I think my version of success at that point was my horses and I was really vested in that in my own way um and you know I was very focused on on that and trying to do my best in that area

I think I watched My parents both work very very hard um and I was obviously absorbing that all the time you know I was growing up in that environment and my mom had her own business and my dad had several businesses of his own and they worked very hard and they had a lot of fulfillment out of working hard making their own money and then being able to do things with that and I think you know subconsciously I was absorbing that all the time I loved the farm by the time I Got to the age

of 18 I wanted to be that's what I thought I wanted to do be a farmer wanted to take over the farm um but alongside that I'd grown up with my mom's fashion business that she ran from home on the farm and so I I did have that creative side that that I was kind of on boarding and I think um you know by the time it was where are you going to apply to UNI I I said right I want to be a farmer but then do I also want to do the Creative so

so I applied To um the agricultural college and then London College of fashion I was lucky enough to get a place at both and at the last minute I went to the agricultural college but um I think I was very grateful in a way for making that decision because I wouldn't have seen the gap for what I do now if I'd gone to London and that's so funny I think that's a really good point for anyone who's younger and listening to this and really trying to work out what their Career path might be because I

think that a lot of people would have looked at the moment where you chose the agricultural College over the fashion over the fashion college and and being like okay well now you're going to do that forever and actually you're here now owning a huge fashion business and having been able to build that and I think I'm such a big proponent of the fact that you build every step and it doesn't need to your first job doesn't Need to be your career your first business doesn't need to be like your Forever thing you can just go

step-by-step building skills before we come on to talking about Holland Cooper um in an interview in your 15-year campaign your dad mentioned that you were one to always really push yourself outside of your comfort zone where do you think that came from was that a kind of innate ability just to push yourself was it because you know you'd been Allowed to really be a child and really kind of embrace yourself at home where do you think that kind of pushing yourself outside of your comfort zone came from it probably was an innate um trait that

I had that I maybe didn't know that I had and I think when you you know when you start a business or or you get into an industry and you want to be successful you do have to make sacrifices and you do have to be able to push the limits possibly more than other People and I think that that is probably the barrier that you come up against if you if you're not able or prepared to do that and I I think both my parents probably did do that and I think you know they were

very of the mindset that if you've got if you're doing something be the best if you've got you know three hours in the day maximize that to the best of your ability you know they always said to me jade you you know you can do whatever it is you want to do if You if you are prepared to put the work in and I think that resonated and that constant reminder of that I suppose made me feel like I could do things and if I was going to do them I was going to try my

absolute best and I was going to push myself to the limit to see what I could achieve you know because that that is you are your only boundary in that sense yeah no I I think that's a really good point I think that when you start to realize that in order to do things that No one else is doing or very few other people are doing you have to do things that no one else is doing in terms of work ethic in terms of how much you're putting into it in terms of risk in terms

of all of these things I think that can both be a really terrifying thing but also a really empowering thing when you start to realize that actually yes of course there are so many different factors that come into success and so many different areas of luck and Privilege and all of this but actually a huge element of being able to realize do you know what actually if I really lean in on this and I put in more work than I deem possible and more time and more you know I spend all of this time kind

of conceptualizing this and I take it to people and I trial and error and all of this it's also quite an empowering thing too to feel like you're quite in control of somewhat how well things do based on how much you're willing to put into it Because I think a lot of what's happened on this podcast in terms of the people that have come on it's not it's not necessarily that the first thing they did just absolutely hit off it's not that the first idea they had was the best one it was truly resilience yeah

and and I think that's exactly right you can't or well I'd love to know if you can but I don't think you can build anything without that you know without that Tenacity without that Obsession it is an obsession you are different to other people and that's okay um and you know I think that's one of the first learning curves is like that's okay that you are different because you're bringing something to the table that maybe other people don't have and your ability to be able to push forward and and you know go that extra mile

and have that obsessive compulsive desire for growth and everything that goes with that and you Know it's not all you know a Bed of Roses it's not you know it's it's tough It's really tough yeah no absolutely very much vou for that really having one of those weeks it can look like it is all a better voes at times and I think perhaps social media you know is an enemy in that in that space sometimes because we're all we're all uh culprits for for making it feel like it is but but you know let me

be clear now the that it isn't at all but I think you Know there are of course elements where it's amazing and you get that euphoric buzz and there are moments that was really horrible and lonely and difficult and then there's things in the middle that's kind of just okay and and and that's all right you know life is never going to be this one happy rainbow that's just not realistic for anyone so I think it's the acceptance that as long as that's kind of balanced and it's not always miserable or always something in The

middle you're getting that you're getting that that group of three I think you're okay yeah no I I completely stand by that and let's talk about your time at the agricultural college and moving from then into deciding you wanted to build something of your own can you talk to me about that that timeline and what your thought processes were within that time yeah so I um arrived at at the agriculture College uh and started my course and quite quickly realized Probably that wasn't the route that I wanted to go on um it was about diversification

in agriculture through equestrian and um you know I was quickly just looking at the pnls and the the finances that were going on and I was thinking yeah this isn't adding up in the way that I I want it to and simultaneously I was going to events like the the Country Events Chon races binton horse trials and I couldn't find anything to wear that that everyone else Wasn't wearing and I was thinking wow there's got to there is a white space here cuz I I can't find what I want and then there must be other

people that are thinking the same so after a year of being there um I actually my law uh teacher there who was brilliant uh said to me do you know what Jade you you know you should just go this is not going to be the place for you yeah I think he was thinking this just isn't where you're going to be fulfilled you need to go and And I said to my parents look this is what I'm thinking and again a bit like I said in my early years when they they were very accepting of

that but they said you can do this but you are going to have to do all of this leg work and you know at the time I was saying yeah yeah no I will I had no idea what that meant at all um and I left after a year of being there and you know I had drawn some Tweed miniskirts which was my first product and there was an outworker that Used to work for my mom when she had her clothing business that was still based in suffk A lady called Janet who sadly passed away

but she I said to her will you make these skirts for me these 15 skirts and I booked a stand at babington horse trials and I arrived with yeah like 15 or 20 minis skirts on a 2 m stand which was Tiny I mean you know it was like a l cubicle with me and a friend who'd also uh went to the ad college and left and Uh we stood there and I thought oh my god I've got to make this work now this is this is it I've got to sell these skirts and we

did did sell the skirts and I had more money to make more skirts and literally that's how it went and I went around the show circuit with a two and a half ton trailer and with the stand in it and I set up and sat down and set up and sat down did 38 shows I think in our first year wow it's pretty grueling it's you know you're in a Middle of a field you know in the pouring rain at night at the Yorkshire show setting up to be ready at 8:00 a.m. the next day

5 days there then you're driving through the night to go somewhere else but what it gave me was an amazing understanding of my customer how did you start to I guess evolve out of the first product and into really working out what your brand was well I was with the customers every day that that as I say that was for me the best Thing I could have done and I learned on the job you know you are effectively on a market store that that one of a better word that's what you're doing you're trading and

you're with the customer you're with the general public there is no holes barred people just tell you how it is and you're standing there with your especially a certain demographic they really happy to be like yeah with your we basically saying hey I think I'm great do you agree and you know I as Tough as that was at times because it is tough and there are people that don't like it and they tell you they don't like it but I think it's how you take that and what you do with it and I think for

me missing a was not an option so if I didn't have that product or the product wasn't fitting or I could see there were body shapes it wasn't working on I had to go away and refine that because all that meant was money not in the till so that that made me very Commercial because I was with the customer I wasn't in you know a glass office designing for size six runway models hoping that everyone else can wear it I was designing for people on mass and I was presenting it to them myself so so

there was nowhere to hide and and actually that was a massive benefit as you say I think that becomes harder and harder um you know in this day and age and and maybe with the bigger fashion houses where you're just You're not with the customer enough and that's what I try and that's why I go to all the events still because I want to see that and I you know Instagram is another way for me to connect with my customer because as you say that's another way for people to tell you how they feel but

for me it was an easy Journey you know I wanted the skirt then they wanted you know something to wear with the skirt so it was a waste coat then it was a jacket then it was a coat Then it's you know I wanted as quickly as possible to be wearing everything that I could make so I I already had that Vision I didn't want to just be skirts I wanted to be everything yeah as quickly as possible I'm really interested about the decision when it was to first move online and how you were able

to preserve the Brand's magic whilst you not actually being there in someone's ear being like this is great for this and This I think I you know I can't actually remember when we first went online but it was quite early on I I think look to be successful in retail I think you have to own a whites space and you have to know what that whites space is and you have to be absolutely clear on what that is and I believe our product does have a really strong DNA a really strong handwriting it's different it's

offering something different and certainly back then it was offering something totally Different to the customer so it's always nerve-wracking when you come from a physical trading space whereas you say I'm telling you how brilliant the product is and I'm giving you my best sales job to the clinical nature of a website you you detach from the customer in that way but I think because we owned a whitespace and because we had that DNA and that point of difference it wasn't an easy sell but we were definitely Offering the customer something I didn't think they could

buy anywhere else and that's the key really or you've got to be the best of a space that you're owning but I think we we were offering something different and we continue to do so and I think saying staying true to your customer and staying true to that DNA and knowing who you want to be as a brand and who you are is the the the biggest bit of advice I think I can give to anyone wanting to come into this Industry is who are you who do you want to be and what is the

white space that you're filling yeah no absolutely and I think it that's especially important in a world of Trends and fast moving areas and all of this because very easy to run to shiny objects and I mean I've definitely done that before and I think that actually really knowing more importantly than who is this brand is like who is this brand not and what is this brand not and being able to see Something and being like that's great and I hope that all of the brands that that fits within their brand capitalize on this fantastically

and I hope they have a great time but actually this is not us and therefore we don't do this product therefore we don't you know capitalize on this trend and I think that it's very easy because business is hard and because you want to make sure that you are always doing the best for your business it's very easy to want to Capitalize on every moment that you can and I think that's been one of my biggest learnings has been okay cool that doesn't mean it needs to be everything yeah and and you can't you can't

be everything and I think again as you say making sure that you know what what your product should be to fit with your DNA and your brand I think is is a big learning curve it is and and being true to who you are and you know as you get bigger and the brand gets bigger There's more voices in your ear there's more people and I think I have to be very clear and disciplined about what our product curation should be and what that should look like and I like to think we've stayed true to

who we are we don't chase a trend we're not fast fashioned that isn't what we are we are about a product that you can wear in 10 years time and hopefully will still be beautiful and classic and that's okay we run black Roll necks all year we run white t-shirts all year we run jeans all year we run some products for 10 years that's okay for us so we I came at this in a different way and I looked at the industry and I thought right I'm going to take the general fashion ruling which is

spring summer launching in January autum winter launching in July and I'm going to not do that because I'm going to make clothes for when I want to wear them cuz I think that's what my customer Wants as well and I remember when I first started doing wholesale that was quite a shock for people because they're used to that cyc especially buying like for anyone who doesn't know they're used to a wholesale cycle well they'll come into a showroom they'll see what it is for the next season they'll Place their orders and they want that newness

they want it continuously and they can have it but when the customer wants it sure so we're not doing spring summer in January we're doing it in April I know this is one of the things that I found absolutely crazy as well it's like you're telling me that winter starts in the beginning of August and you're telling me the spring summer starts in January that's weird because I'm very hot in August and I'm very cold in the beginning of January you're probably still cold till the end of March right exactly so so that that was

unusual I think but what it does is it gives Longevity to your season and that gives security it to your stores and that means that the product has time to breathe so our Autumn winter starts on the 1st of September and it ends at the end of March so we're selling coats till the end of March yeah at least and that's okay um and so I came at it in a different way and again it's having the confidence to to look at the industry and say well that's not always the right way for me yeah

and that's okay CU it Can be a bit daunting cuz you sort of think well I've just got to do it that way cuz that's what everyone does but again sometimes don't be afraid to think I'm going to go with my gut instinct and that that again is another big learning for me is when you've got things coming at you all the time I always go with my gut instinct if it's a maybe it's definitely a no yeah fact if I'm having to think is it right or isn't it no I think that's so interesting

and really Helpful for anyone who's building a business but I think that's such a good point in in sticking to your guns and being very clear and not just being like okay just because the large fashion houses do it like this I have to do it like that in order to be like them no and I think that was one of a big learning and but one of our biggest strengths to do that also to not be afraid of of continuity product you know a lot of this business is continuity Which means that you bring

in a product and you don't change it for eight years yeah and that's quite frightening in a lot of fashion businesses because all about new must be new must be new but what happens then is you end up saying well okay we've got a black roll neck to make it new what okay we're putting that one in the sale and then we're making a slightly different one same and same again why why why do that I know and it's so funny because I also look at Lots of the continuity I love from other brands and

I'm so pissed off when that perfect white T-shirt goes because I'm like I've now tried to buy this in a different color because it's such a nice shape and it's slightly different and it's like a little bit of a different material it's like what's that about guys no so we we we don't do that so we we go the other way and we say you know probably 50 60% of the range is continuity and I have women that go oh I Just love that Jean and now I buy it in all the colors you do

and I can always buy it I can always buy that roll n that shirt that t-shirt so we do a base what we call the essential range really which is a a paint by numbers set of product that then you can build on like a capsu wardrobe and I want to make it easy for people not overwhelming not frightening easy you know this is about a wardrobe working hard for you and and working hard for your lifestyle this isn't about Very difficult products you've got to have a degree to piece together and then in six

months time you're not going to wear it because it's not in fashion yeah that's not what we're about we're about making life easy in that department and I think that's again why it's been so successful and when women find us they think it's great because actually that that you know roll neck and that pair of jeans can go with 15 other things brilliant easy care thinking about you Know everything being dry clean only in terms of shirts it's not realistic for a lot of people and that was not realistic for me and I didn't want

to start bringing out essential ranges that needed really specific looking after because who has time to do all of those things again not realistic yeah so we're trying to build product that is easy does work hard does do day to night does do multiple different things for you again that's what our customer certainly Is looking for yeah no absolutely and I think that shows the real power of knowing your customer and knowing your brand and talk to me about Holland Cooper's first Big Break was there a specific product that just outperformed all the rest was

it very slow and gradual and then there was an inflection point talk to me about that I think our growth has been what you would just call consistent you know I um a Creator a designer but I'm also a business person And I love my numbers so for me um this wasn't just about kind of turn over and growing that as quickly as possible it was well and I didn't have the luxury to do that it was about I've got to make money as well so we grew organically and so we didn't do you know

the overnight success we I grew I sold some more I made some more you know I reinvested reinvested um probably the first Big Break on a kind of a mass scale or something that everyone would have heard Of was the call from hars and that was you know a moment for me where it was like hars are on the phone you know everyone's running around and uh that was amazing because that gave me a global platform to sell the product and I always tried to you know even when we were tiny appear bigger than we

are you know you've got to put your best foot forward you're trying to pretend you're a global office when there's two of you in a shoe box that's just what you're Trying to do so for me to be able to say at that point we are in herods made people think of me in a different way so so you know oh you've got a brand okay first question where are you oh I'm in herod's okay immediate light bulb moment okay you're worth talking to it's really hard in this industry you know people give you five

minutes who are you what are you doing and hars gave me that hook to give me The credibility to start doing other things and in the end uh in Harris we had a really wonderful partnership and they were brilliant and we started with a tiny area in the end we had a 2,000 squ foot you know bespoke store had our own staff in there it was wonderful um and we were there for about five years until the floors moved and unfortunately they did something completely different on the fifth floor and then we were in the

second floor we moved around and moved around and and you know that that didn't work in the EMP for us but I'm very grateful to harod at that point because they gave us that platform and their customer loved it um you know it was all of that Heritage looking feel the British made they loved the tailoring uh and then from that we got the call from B Village and again that although is a discount offering it wasn't about the discount I knew that if I wanted the global platform with those global players that Was a

big Market to be invited onto that round table with those stores because it's not Independence in there you've got all the big players so again that was another important brand moment for us I think to sit alongside you know the big boys effectively on the same playing field and again the journey with B has been amazing I think we're 60% up year on year you know in there at the minute and and you know that has been a journey so so those moments are pivotal I think Certainly in the industry and just when you're talking

to people about your business you know okay these are these are Milestones that other people understand yeah no I I think it I mean I completely agree and I think that as a business owner to me that's really that's a really effective I guess it's an effective way of driving home how many different Journeys there can be but also just how important brand is and it's not you know I mean we all know it's not all about sales but when you're looking at long-term growth brand really does rign superior it does and they've got to

go hand inand and that's and that's again another learning that I had was always how do I balance that investment you know with brand as we call it and keeping the money coming in in the till with sales because I think again in the industry they push us into thinking we've got to spend in every single Sphere and we got to be at every single thing and ultimately that is just not wasn't realistic for me because I had to make this profitable that was how it was um and so I you know I think I've

always been very um curated with how I'm going to market the business had to be clever with how I'm going to do that make sure it's cost effective can I afford that um and getting that organic growth and meaning that we can grow year on year both the top line and the bottom line For me was what I deemed a successful business yeah no absolutely I think that's really powerful for anyone trying to build a business and really recognizing that brand doesn't need to be the most expensive thing but it does need it does need

to be help to importance um and what were some of the early challenges you faced with building the brand and the business as a whole oh my gosh so many I mean it'sing to the choir and it still is you know there's Challenges at every stage of your business and anyone that says there aren't challenges is is lying I think because it's just you know impossible for anyone to do this and not make mistakes um you know I think there were times when it was very lonely you know and at the beginning when I left

uni early all my friends were still at Uni and I'm like oh bloody hell you know I am working 24 hours a Day seven days a week and this is this is hard this is really hard um I think you know you make learnings all along the way but I think it's what do you do with those learnings you going to make mistakes that's just a fact but what you don't want to do is make them two or three times in a row so the the quick learning is right I made that mistake it's okay

we're all going to make mistakes we've got to either find a positive in it or just make sure we Don't do it again and I think you know anyone starting a business if you think you're not going to make a mistake or you know you're doing something wrong if you make a mistake it is just not the case you know you are going to make mistakes and that is okay yeah it's so funny because I think that that is definitely what puts a lot of people off getting into building a business is the unknown and

the fact that it's definitely not something that's Traditionally taught I mean entrepreneurship classes even if there are business classes places entrepreneurship classes are just not really a thing no not and there's no better entrepreneurship class than actually just doing the thing I always quote this I can't remember what podcast it was on but it was with Toby Pierce and he said that the biggest thing when it comes to entrepreneurship is the speed and intensity of the feedback loop When you in a job where you have protections on on different sides you're able to make a

mistake and you probably have to make it a few times to be able to learn from it you might make it quicker but you might not even know you're making a mistake so it takes a bit more time whereas as an entrepreneur the speed and intensity of that feedback loop when you make a mistake you know very very quickly because you can see it in the numbers or you can see it in Whatever the knock on is to your production line to the timings of things happening or whatever it might be and the intensity of

that in terms of the Fallout from any mistake you make means that it really is a gift because it's it can be pretty awful at times but you mostly can't make mistakes more than once or twice because that is where the business starts go very downhill like you just don't have the luxury and I think that's one of the best things of Entrepreneurship when it comes to intense learning is you and anytime I've hired people who've had a business before I've just known I'm like you have learned so much in that short period of time

even if it wasn't a long time because you do not have the luxury of making mistake a few times and you will know very very quickly when you make a mistake every time you do and also you are doing every part of your business so you have to do everything you know there Isn't there isn't lots of departments there you know you don't have the luxury of that so you have to learn and do everything and I think that's that does set you up hopefully in good stad when you're employing people because you've okay maybe

not done it to that level but you do have a general understanding of the business in its entirety and I think you've got to be able to think of 69,000 things at once because you're in every certainly in the beginning you're in Every single Department all the time and that means you can't just have the luxury of focusing in on one department and just spending all your time in that you are marketing you are the mouthpiece you are brand you are website you are design you are product you are everything sales you know you you've

got to wear so many hats and you've got to be able to do that unless you have a business partner which can you know that can work for some people as well I Didn't so I was every single hat all the time and I loved it and hated it at the same time because it is tough and I want to talk about the growth of the business it's very clear how you started and I think that now when people might log on to your Instagram they're like okay if I've just listened to this and I've

seen the those kind of markets all starts how do we get to this point so I want to talk about the growth and some of the key decisions you made in order to be Able to grow how you have your team are the most important well other than your product it's then your team you've got two things in a business both those things have got to come together to make this um this work and I think to be successful you've got to understand where your real skills are and where they are not and you have

to be accepting to welcome other people to the table and not be I suppose afraid or intimidated of um success of other People and bringing people with experience onto your table at the same time you've got to have confidence in yourself that often you're sat with people with a lot more experience than you in their particular areas but your gut feeling generally is the right one for your business so I think you know I'm very lucky with the team I have around me now they're passionate entrepreneurial businesses are really demanding you know you've got The

corporates and you've got the entrepreneurial businesses and whenever I'm interviewing people you know that maybe haven't worked in Entre entrepreneurial business I'm sort of looking into their soul think are you going to enjoy this because you have to enjoy it people that work for you have to enjoy it otherwise it never works and you know this is a two-way street you've got to love them they've got to love you they've got to be passionate You Are I Am demanding fact but I'd like to think I'm also you know like to tell people when they've done

a good job I know who everyone is you know everyone's got a voice at the table and I think when you're leading a team that's important because ultimately job satisf action means people want to come to work and they're enjoying being on the journey um but that that you know team building is a whole learning curve in itself because you're trying to take lots of people on A journey very very fast and what worked last year doesn't work this year and that's frightening for a lot of people and it's disconcerting and you know they've just

got their ducks in a row and we're changing the row of ducks again um and I think it's finding people that can cope and thrive in that environment that's the key because as entrepreneurs we we love being in that environment like that's our natural habitat is change Evolution if I'm not Feeling nervous or frightened I'm not pushing myself hard enough you know every day I should feel nervous at some point because otherwise what am I doing and that is okay to be in that space because when you get comfortable you're probably not moving fast enough

so it's getting people that are also of that mindset and enjoy I supposed a slight Thrill of the unknown cuz we're pushing ourselves into the unknown all the time because we've not done it before I've Not done it before so I think that's exciting exhilarating terrifying yeah it's an addiction Allin one go sometimes I think why am I doing this to myself but you know if it was taken away tomorrow I would my identity would be gone I don't know what I would do yeah no I think I I mean I agree with all of

that and I do also think I spend so much of my time just staring at myself and I'm like are you insane anyone who sees the online probably only Sees the Euphoria first of all I will say I mean I try and give a good balance but if I'm you know Korean in the gym I probably don't want to hard it's hard I agree with you it's hard to sometimes be confident enough to show those realities yeah and and you know that's been you know a learning for me as well I think in covid is

when I really started leaning into Instagram in a different way maybe you know letting down those barriers a Bit but I I do think it's hard it is hard for me to show those times when I'm thinking you know I I can can I do this those self-doubt moments which we all have and you know you're leading a team of people you don't want to be standing at the front saying you know should should we be going into battle or not you you've got to be saying you you're the hype person you got to be

saying yeah this is exactly the right thing to be doing even if you're not thinking That and I think that's hard as well because you've always got to be the voice of confidence you've always got to be happy you've always got to be on you've always got Powerhouse this person everyone's looking to so when when you're waking up thinking I I don't know if I can do this that is not an emotion that is acceptable to be showing ever so you are just painting this on whether you're feeling it or not and that can be

quite draining sometimes because you Know you're not a machine you're not a robot you do have emotions like everybody else yeah no I think think about that a lot and I think about the fact that that mental load is very very heavy how how do you deal with that side of things whilst also obviously needing to show up in a certain way and needing to build the business and needing to be high energy I think you just learn to be able to do that it's it's you just learn to do it and I think um

you Know it's not easy and there are days where sometimes you are struggling and thinking can I do this and do I know the best way to do this and you know can I do these 50,000 things at once and but I think every time you push through that there's a learning of okay it is okay I am going to be able to do it but I think again for anyone watching this that maybe is wanting to start a business or has started a business you are going to have moments of self-doubt that is okay

Nobody wakes up every day and says oh I'm the best business person ever to exist and I eternally confident to have that self-doubt is probably normal it is normal um and you know I I should show that probably more than I do I think but you you're equally trying to be the PowerHouse and you're trying to be all these things so it's it's hard sometimes to find the balance of of what how you portray that I think no I completely agree I completely getting the balance Of who you who you are and what that looks

like but but certainly you know I employ I think it's and and this isn't because I don't like men it just has happened this way 95% of my Workforce are women you make clothes for women yeah we wouldn't be surprised the and the senior leadership you know again 90% women so I think that's nice in a way because you know we can share those empathies sometimes that that I think are important when you know you're Working with women and and you know you face some of those challenges together but um I think it is it

is a can be a difficult balance to know how your persona should be you know yeah no absolutely and and having brought up the fact that obviously you have a largely women leadership team I I'd like to talk about the fact that obviously you have children and you're running this business and I always preface this on the podcast with the fact that I hate That I have to ask women about how it is running a business with children but also we know that it is different for women as much as it shouldn't be yeah so

I would if you are okay with that love to ask you about how you found balancing running this business growing this business having huge success online having you know becoming a public figure and all of that with with raising beautiful children and trying to you know balance everything that comes with That look it's not easy it's not easy however you do it um it it's the best thing I've ever done you know it is just a joy and it brings something it's it levels you in a way that nothing else can you know when I'm

with my children it's just I I yeah it's it's the best thing I think I was lucky that I had an easy pregnancy I think if I didn't I don't know genuinely what I would have done so when I see people that have really difficult pregnancies I I don't Know how I would have coped with that I'm going to be really honest you know I was lucky pregnancy isn't easy you know it's still very demanding but I wasn't very ill you know it was both my pregnancies were were straightforward so touch word I'm very thankful

for that um and the business was at a point where I was successful enough that I could afford help so you know again I feel very lucky for that but even if you have help and you want To be a present mom you know it's a Juggle everything's a Juggle you're trying to be a mom a a wife a businesswoman all of these things again it's not easy and it's not every day is a bed of roses but um we we make it work and we juggle and we understand what that juggle looks like and

when I'm talking about empathy and and understanding you know a lot of the women in my business have children or pregnant or have just had new babies or Whatever it is I hope I can be that boss that is understanding and we're trying to make it work and we're trying to do it all as you say it's it's it's not double standards but I think there is a double standard for men and women in terms of those questions and how do we do it all um but for me it it has been you know an

element of my life that's just been I feel so lucky to have been able to have two healthy children and they definitely give me a grounding like Nothing else and you know when I come home from work and and they're there it's it is a joy but everything is a Juggle and obviously both you and your husband Julian have backgrounds in fashion he found it super dry I can imagine that in a family environment when you're coming home from work you're running this fashion business coming home you've both done this and you've both been in

this kind of area how first of all how do you find It having worked in the same industry and obviously having understandings of similar things what are the synergies there but also how do you find the ability to switch off given the fact that you're probably both very similar in some of those areas I look it I feel so lucky to have found someone that loves working as much as I do because it is difficult you know questions when is enough when are you going to slow down when is there enough Money why don't you

just retire was just not a narrative I could understand so to find somebody else like that was you know we have so many similarities similarities in work similarities in Morality similarities in parenting when we're at home we are Mom and Dad dad fact that's what's happening phones are down we're with our children he loves the children he's an amazing dad he will get home at quarter 5 and he is going to be a dad until they go to Bed and so we both prioritize that when we're working we're working like dogs that's where we are

so again I think I feel very lucky to have found someone where we've got the synergies in so many different areas um we are both Traders at heart we both start on a market stand we there's no happier place for us than standing behind a till taking money however we're doing that whether it's online or not or we're both as excited about business now as we were then And you know I think to be have longevity in business you have to retain that excitement it isn't just about the money it's about that's who you are

whether you like it or not you are excited by business you are excited by working if it was it's just about the money you cap out at a certain time you want to retire that's the end you don't mind because you got the money but for us it's not about that it's about growth it's about The journey it's about what can we do as people um and we do work together in different aspects we you know we have hotels and restaurants and we enjoy that bit but we are you know we're two elephants in the

room we have to have something that's our own we can't we're too biger people to sort of you know be both doing the same thing and we understand that and that's fine and luckily we share you know the same Aesthetics we're very similar as people Which is is lovely because again it can be very lonely sometimes so to be able to share that with somebody what do you think about this how are you feeling about that is is lovely because it's quite hard for other people to understand or friends that may not be in this

space it's quite isolating because you don't really have anyone to talk to I think being present is something that that we both really share so I you know yeah I feel lucky to have to have that And what are some of the habits and routines that you have in place yourself and as a family that means that you're able to maintain some sort of balance whilst also building something that should really take over your life I think the children have been a massive part of that because you know anyone that has children will know they

are all consuming so you you know trying to do be with your children and send an email And 15 other things if you can try and say when I'm with my children I am going to switch off and have that discipline that that has really helped I think it is look it's a constant battle and and often I do run out of you know the scales are are tipping the wrong way um and that's where you do become stressed and you do become tired and you do become sometimes resentful towards it you know why do

I keep wanting to be like this um why why don't I you know Why can't I just accept you know not having so much growth you become irritated with yourself I do sometimes I'm thinking I definitely do why why am I like this what's wrong with me yeah uh and you know I think again sometimes when the scales tip in the wrong way that is a catalyst to say no right I need to be more disciplined with my time go back to the drawing board where does my focus have to be and I think as

you get bigger again you have to and your Team has to understand you are only one person there is only so many hours in the day where are you spending your time that is going to be most effective to that growth Channel and that's a journey for everyone because when you had two hours three years ago you've got 20 minutes now so it's about everyone being able to deliver what they need to you in a timely way you delivering to them what they need in a timely way your time management has got to be spot

on and if You can't get that you the business sort of engulfs you and you can't see out and everyone will have moments of that and you've just got to rework that plan and that's happening to me almost every six months where I sit down and go right hang on this is feeling unmanageable I just can't do it all um and we have to sit down and say right what does this look like now but that's that's just an evolution and that's a journey yeah what do you look at when you're doing that Type of

kind of Life audit and work audit I think you know you have to look at what can I what what do I need to be giving to the the business what do I need to be able to do product I need space in my brain to be able to think about it because if I'm going from design two hours straight into finance an hour straight into marketing an hour straight into something else an hour there is no time in between those meetings to even think of anything the Diary is so stretched that I'm in a

meeting somebody standing outside the door ready for the next meeting your brain's got to go into something else and the lack of thinking time can be very detrimental to actually delivering as you say a good job and I think to be able to have that half an hour where you you don't have a meeting where it's like right I'm going to think about what that new collection needs to look like for me that often comes when we go away for a Weekend because I you know we might go to Paris or something and I will

have that thinking time okay breathing space almost to think about what those next steps are because the the the fear or the problem can be is that you're so stretched and you're so pushed for outbound to people that you don't actually have any time to think of anything and then you're not giving those forward thoughts those forward plans to the company and look I I've Fallen into that traps several times recently because the business has got so much bigger so much more demanding and I'm doing I suppose what you would call a traditional influence a

bit as well which anyone that says influencer jobs are easy is has never done that because you know that takes time you know you're trying on all the outfits I want to talk to my followers I want to do that as well but you that that is a time you have to carve out in the day where There's no minutes yeah so you know it's all it's all juggling but I think the time I've recently um purchased a horse and the horse is an hour away from where I live which sounds nuts but when I

drive to see him on the way there I will do calls on the way back I won't I get one hour of thinking space and that probably is making me more money than these back to back to back sessions where I just don't have any time and it's that thinking space and allowing Yourself that time that I think is really important and that that that I'm not brilliant at I'm going to be honest but I'm doing my best to try and find that space yeah and one of my favorite things is um the saying that

you can have it all but you cannot have it all at once and I think exactly righta and I'm like cool well I want to have some different things right now yeah yeah no like that's just not possible I yeah the the have it having it all is is I don't Know how you do that yeah I don't think you can I genuinely don't I definitely have not found that a possibility as you say you can have it all at once but not all at once it's it's it's it's very hard and there are things

that you you just can't do and you have to accept that because you're you're wanting to take a different path and so that's your choice you know you're accepting to do that but that's not always easy even though it is your choice yeah no I Completely agree and I think that auditing and re aiting and having that space cared out to actually be like am I focusing on the things I need to be focusing on now is incredibly important and before we end I'd love to ask you what the best piece of advice is that

you have ever been given oh that's a good question um I I I know I touched on it earlier like listening to your gut but I think very early on and I can't remember who It was said that to me you know you will have lots of people talking to you and the bigger you get or even the smaller you are because I think that's when you're most vulnerable because you're thinking I'm new to this do I know what the right answer is surrounded by experts go with your gut feeling and I think if you

are a natural entrepreneur and you know what your white space is you you may know over and above the expert in whatever that field is because They maybe haven't built a business and you are going to so it doesn't matter if you're in your first week of business or your 20th year of business that gut instinct can seem naive and maybe frightening to go with that but I would say it isn't and for me that has always been the right decision and if it is a maybe it should be a no if you're not sure

and you're having to think about it a lot I I put that into a no bucket as quickly as possible I think that's a Great piece of advice um and something I think I definitely didn't do early enough and them now having to like reclaim stand ground dig deep yeah and dig deep and be like yeah also you don't need to be an expert in everything you could be an expert in your brand and that goes a very long way a long way and you know your brand better than anyone else and that's not to

say you don't listen to other people of course you should but there are times when you have To chop out the noise dig deep and think no I I am the expert in this and this is what I think and that's okay yeah and that does take a lot of confidence to do that you got to you know you've got to be you've got to have that inner confidence and if you don't have it you've got to find it and dig deep to find it somewhere but um yeah that would be my advice yeah I

love it well thank you so much you've been fantastic and I will be personally Walking away from this with a lot of things I need to do thank you so much [Music]