Bitcoin indeed topped 100,000 for the first time ever the cryptocurrency on that record-breaking run since president-elect Donald Trump's Victory joining us now Michael sailor executive chairman of micro strategy of course micro strategy now one of the largest Bitcoin holders with just over 402,000 of the coins I don't know if like you want to do a little Dance Michael if you've got some champagne behind you but obviously we've been talking to you for a while now and you have been a staunch Bull on bit coin you put your money where your mouth is in terms of
adding it to the balance sheet over there and micro strategy I guess you know now that we've gotten there now what what what's next every day for the past four years I've said buy Bitcoin don't sell the Bitcoin uh I'm gonna be buying more Bitcoin I'm gonna be buying Bitcoin at the top forever I joked with uh Dave port today he said I missed it at 10,000 I missed it at 20,000 I missed at 100,000 I said Dave it's still less than a million of coin you're getting a 90% discount from a million of coin
I'm sure that I will be buying Bitcoin at a million of coin probably a billion dollars a day of Bitcoin at a million of coin and so I think it's a very simple idea just keep buying Bitcoin with your spare Capital it's going to appreciate against the dollar forever so Michael so if I don't own own Bitcoin though and I'm listening to this your advice is buy here or no wait for a p pull back and then when I when I do buy Michael your advice to folks who are listening about how to do that
what do they buy you know do they do they dollar cost average into Bitcoin what's your advice I think you should think of Bitcoin as a long-term capital asset so if you have money you don't need for four years or even better yet for 10 years you put it into a portfolio you might hold scarce desirable real estate you might hold your your favorite artwork you might hold some portfolio of of companies you're going to all forever I think a part of that is Bitcoin so I say dollar cost average into Bitcoin every quarter sweep
some long-term savings into Bitcoin expect to keep it there for a decade or longer and and don't get uh too worked up over the volatility in the near term well and Michael you know you kind of alluded to this that you you don't try and time the market here you're just G to you the strategy through micro strategy is to just keep buying consistently regularly no matter what the price is yeah I mean I I look at it like uh Manhattan real estate the year is 1650 and if you had a chance to buy it
in every decade from 1650 to today wouldn't you just keep buying it if you didn't have to pay property tax and you could hold it you would just ACC keep accumulating it forever there's never a bad time to buy it there's a sailor tracker you can look at it it just shows we bought at every price point every quarter at the highs at the lows at the mids I bought it every week for the past four weeks in a size billion or more I'm going to just keep buying it and uh and it's not that
complicated I expect that it'll be the most valuable thing of the world a 100 years from now so why wouldn't you just keep accumulating it Michael we've talked a little bit about this before so I want to just reup the question before we move on when you've likened it to Manhattan real estate Manhattan real estate you collect rent on it right so at some point do you somehow you know monetize the Bitcoin that you hold in some way yeah well imagine I gave you the chance to buy uh 40 city blocks of Manhattan real estate
a 100 years ago but there were no buildings on it and there was no rent associated with it but you knew it was going to be the greatest city in North America and you could buy it and hold it it's you know you would still do it just like you might buy Alaska in 186 7 even though there's no rent on it because you think that over the next 100 years someone else will find a way to take advantage of it with Bitcoin it's cyber Manhattan there's 8 billion people that have money they're not going
to live there but they're going to put their money there because everybody has to park their money somewhere and so you're just buying one block out of 21 million of all the capital in the world it'll be the center of the digital economy you may not know the applications but there are applications micro strategy makes a a lot of money by holding that digital property we're generating massive amounts of of of uh shareholder value from that so you don't have to understand how we do it you just need to hold your Bitcoin and let us
drive the price up and Michael obviously the move since the election has been powerful Trump is moving back into the White House he could positioned himself you know as an ally of Bitcoin an ally of crypto what would you like to see Michael his his priorities being now his policy priorities well I mean I think low regulation low tax uh pro-innovation policies give PE especially specifically with regard to digital assets if we have a digital assets framework that supports digital Commodities digital Securities digital tokens digital abts digital currencies digital nfts so that people can innovate
in the United States of America and and spread those assets everywhere in the world I think that'll be good for the world and good for the United States Michael I'm curious because we've talked to some of your your peers in the crypto industry who have talked about maybe some of the friction at times that they have felt when they've been trying to buy crypto assets under the existing regime under Gary gansler at the SEC for example you guys have obviously accumulated an awful lot of of Bitcoin at at micro strategy has there ever been that
kind of friction have you seen seen those regulatory obstacles to what you've been doing well I think Bitcoin is the one digital asset that has the most regulatory Clarity in the world because there's General Universal consensus that it's a digital commodity the friction on bitcoin has been slow approval of the ETFs the inability to do cash create and Redemption the the slow approval of the options Market on the ETFs and and uh and um resistance to Banks uh cussing and handling Bitcoin so that's held back the asset class I think that uh a favorable crypto
regime will accelerate the development of Bitcoin and I think on the digital assets side right just the lack of a digital assets framework for digital currencies and digital exchanges and digital tokens has put that uh that industry in limbo and I think we're looking for those things to be resolved with the incoming Administration and that should accelerate growth for everybody and Michael this week on the show we did speak to uh Senator uh Kirsten gilbran and I asked your Michael specifically about this idea of a Bitcoin strategic Reserve listen to her response here I don't
know what the purpose of a Bitcoin Central Reserve is and I haven't really seen the details of any idea about why you would do that and why that's important uh I think it would have an obvious impact of supporting the Bitcoin industry um which in and of itself self isn't good or bad I just would want to know what the reason is all right Michael so the senator not sure about the reason for it what do you say to that what's your response Bitcoin is emerging as the world's Reserve Capital network if you want to
store your capital for the long long term and you live in Africa or Russia or China or South America or even the US your choice is local real estate or local stocks or Bitcoin well people are realizing that Bitcoin is better than real estate it's better than stocks there there's not a single company or real estate property in Africa that you would rather own for the long term than Bitcoin so the very simple idea is buy 20 or 25% of the Bitcoin network uh on behalf of the US government catalyze the development of that world
Reserve Capital Network and then let all the Chinese and the Russians and the foreigners sell all their assets and buy Bitcoin and then the money flows into the United States if you want to put a a great a great Twist on it dump your gold sell all the US Gold buy Bitcoin then the trade is free because you could buy five million Bitcoin for the cost of the gold you will demonetize the entire gold asset class and our enemies hold gold in their Banks so their assets would go to zero our assets would go to1
trillion and we would control the world's Reserve Capital Network as well as the world's Reserve currency Network as usual you're painting a um Grand and and Vivid picture Michael with this kind of stuff um I know your long-term price targets are sort of almost infinite um let's talk shorter term um and let's assume that the Bitcoin Reserve doesn't happen right let's assume that conditions continue as they are where do you see Bitcoin at the end of 2025 you know I I don't chart it mon by month but uh I noticed that it's been a 60%
ARR for the past four years and and even before that point and my model is generally that it will grow at at 60% ARR decelerating to 20% AR over 21 years so if you start to crank in 60% then 58 then 56 then 54 you know and you put that on a scale you know absent you know abent the cycle cyclical volatility you get to a forecast which makes sense Michael quick question on that cyclical volatility right because typically Bitcoin does move in these fouryear cycles and there is a sharp pullback typically is that anywhere
in sight and what would be a potential Catalyst for that I think as the asset grows and matures the volatility decreases and those draw down the extremes of the draw down decrease the the structure of the market determines the volatility and so you have if you're going to forecast the structure of the market You Can't Look Backwards like if you if you looked at a bicycle four years ago and I show up with a motorcycle right now it's a different set of physics the market right now is driven by the ETFs driven by the options
Market driven by companies like micro strategy uh driven by the global adoption so I think what you'll see is you will still see volatility but you won't see the extreme draw Downs of the last cycle you see a more gentle volatility it'll surge up it'll come back but I don't expect like a we saw an 80% draw down in the in the depth of the crypto winter from 66,000 to 16,000 in order for that to happen you had to have a bunch of very poorly capitalized companies like FTX and Genesis and Celsius and blockfi uh
forced liquidate we don't have that kind of those kind of companies in the system now the the the capital structures of the companies participating in the market today are much deeper much more robust and there's a lot more Equity Capital today so you'll see a a different Dynamic I think it'll be muted to the upside and the downside because of the options traders that are uh moderating the market Michael great to see you thank you so much for joining us especially today on uh on seeing this Milestone of Bitcoin appreciate it yeah thanks for having
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