uh so let's talk to the former head of Religion and Ethics at the BBC just the guy uh Akil Ahmed thanks for joining us a hi Kevin thanks for having me on uh yeah I mean let me tell you what I think you may disagree to some extent but you know I think the BBC News people journalists that they are trapped in their own group think they are busy polishing their Halos to say we deliver totally impartial news balance the coverage from all points of view I think they try to do that but they don't
achieve it Akil they don't achieve it look at their coverage of the Palestine dispute the conflict in Gaza they had to admit that they were biased uh during the brexit campaign bias towards rainia so when she says oh our problem is we're too good at our jobs we're too impartial she's just wrong they're not impartial well I think she's talking about not just the BBC remember she's talking about what you would classes maybe mainstream broadcasting so news is regulated in the UK so ITV Channel 4 News BBC Channel 5 Etc Sky News and us talk
we are too trust me you are too I know and I Havey to say I'm speaking here in a personal capacity not actually I know I know with so I'm not speaking on behalf of oom I'm speaking on behalf of a ared um no the reality is she's talking about that now I think there's a difference between your show Kevin which I think is not necessarily it's not clas news right and opinion this is opinion yeah this op yeah this is opinion difference there we got I we got to agree that yeah there's a big
difference so comes to kind of like news coverage news coverage is regulated on TV and radio in this country and it has to be impartial it isn't necessarily always impartial I'd give you that I would I would have mean there lots of studies at the moment which would say your definition your your interpretation maybe about Gaza is a bit unfair because all sides think there's been lots of mistakes that have been made can I just say something there uh there's uh a uh a service out a new service in the Middle East called BBC Arabic
since the October 7th uh horror and the ensuing war that service has made 80 mistakes they're coming in uh at the rate of once every two days and you know all the mistakes are anti-israel so the BBC to say it is unbiased that is out no but the BBC my point is ail the BBC it thinks it's bias there is nothing worse than a journalist who thinks they are studiously unbiased when they're actually biased they cannot see it in I think there's a difference between a journalist who I got to tell you now you know
look remember Robbie Gibb came from that Newsroom you know people talk about Robbie Gibb as being a bit of a neocon etc but he came from that Newsroom he's not lots of people have gone from the BBC News Room to work for the conservative party and even estimate McVey was and I work together on here and now if BBC News and current affairs in another lifetime ago before she became a conservative MP so individuals could be what they want but I I I feel very strongly about this people can get it wrong broadcasters can get
it wrong but generally generally news in this country and I even said that with talks talk news whether it's whoever it is when you talk when it's the actual news as opposed to a current affairs discussion program the fact of the matter is we all try to get it right and when we get it wrong we got to you got to hold your hand up and actually lots of people have got lots of f wrongs whether whether it's brexit whether it's the war in war in Gaza all of those things people have made mistakes and
I tell you what I've made mistakes when I worked in news because if you don't hold your hand up and say you made mistakes it's a different thing what Deborah is talking about here I think fits in with a bigger issue which is globally lots of Studies have shown us and as the ratings have shown us lots of young people say they don't get their news from mainstream broadcasters or newspapers anym they get it from social media and the question is in social media as you know well that basically it's a it's a modern day
a huge version of what newspapers used to be yeah really growing up depended on what your political persuasion was you alluded to that in your intro but with regards to Echo with the social media it's on a epic scale compared to those newspapers and because of the algorithms if you like a certain thing you get fed certain things so if you only get your new news from social media or most of your news from social media then you're going to be fed the side that you already agree with and therefore you're not going to get
a balanced opinion so when you do see something which is Sky News BBC News whatever when you or hear your news on talk TV when you hear that news you kind of like say well that's biased that's one because you're not used to it you're used to getting Echo chamber one-sided kind of coverage and that's I think what she's saying it's not very sexy I know that but actually that we should be really worried about about because if this it's not this generation it's the next Generations that come over after it if we don't have
a you know may not be perfect but unbiased news yeah well that's my point I I'm with you on what you just said I I absolutely accept it I've been around a long time and I I've noticed the similarities between what the newspapers used to be like in the 1980s when they were tour of forces and sort of social media now uh you're right about that uh but my thing is my point is uh you know Deborah turn turnus you know holier than thou stance you know we deliver unbalanced bi you know uh we deliver
unbiased balanced coverage that's my problem because I don't think the BBC does I think the BBC talking about the BBC well yeah but let's talk about the BBC who is she to say this when the BBC clearly delivers biased news it's biased about Palestine it was biased about uh brexit and she's saying oh well our problem is we're so impartial we're so balanced that it turns people off because we don't give them an opinion and they see that as a challenge to their values well Deborah you are biased your journalists are biased your journalism is
biased it's quite clear I think that's a bit harsh Kevin and you know you can't stand that up 100% it's not all bi well of course it's not all bias but but a lot of it is tell it's not all bias it's not I think I think a great deal of it is because it's full of people who polish their Halos and think they're delivering this wonderful service but fine and the BBC News is a fine service but don't tell me it's beautifully impartial because it is not you know if you if you have a
problem with any of it you can complain you know that right 12 be found guilty I'm just saying you can complain people oh believe me people complain you know they'll complain about TV as well people complain oh they do they do feel that strongly put the complaint in about the specific I'm I'm a radio I'm I'm a presenter talking to you about it and I'm telling you what a lot of people think you know this the BBC going around saying we are wonderfully impartial we're balanced we give you a balance coverage of everything let me
tell you millions of people around the country think that is one big pile of BS and they're entitled to aren't they yes they are so what the so where the hell is deborra off they don't have to be right where's Deborah turnus getting off thinking or stating that they're impartial and uh balanced but they are impartial next to that's the conversation they're not are they 0 mistakes BBC Arabic is an affront to journalism how many hours are you talking about for those 80 mistakes 180 mistakes that means the mistakes they've been making of mistakes that
have had to be apologized for at the rate of one every two days one every days listen everybody has made a lot of mistakes dur especially the BBC no a lot of people have made a lot of mistakes do you remember do you remember when they announced that the israela bombed that hospital it was a Hamas missile that misfired Kevin Kevin every broadcaster made that mistake no they didn't it started with the BBC no no every broadcaster made that mistake we didn't we didn't we waited we waited to find out what actually happened a I
agree with you my the BBC didn't wait jump to a conclusion Kevin I'm not to talk about that kind no it's is it's it's the issue at hand that Kevin if you want to go over that let me tell you this right the fact of the matter is 30 times to one I think is a top my basically if we wanted to talk about that cancer if we could talk about the amount of times that Palestinians who died have been referred to as dying as opposed to being murdered or have been or killed there's so
many different things so okay okay is so why won't the why won't everybody depending on what your eyesight is bias works for all of you pretty damn biased to say we're not going to call Hamas terrorists isn't it well that's that's a policy that not only the B biased policy biased policy against Israel not just the BBC Kevin not just the B well everybody who has that policy is wrong violently wrong BBC doing that is an utter disgrace and it betrays pro Palestinian stance do you see what so ITV and Sky if they that they're
also Pro Palestinian yeah probably Sky definitely well that's my point you know it's in the eye of the beholder isn't it because you could throw loads of things at you I mean listen they've just taken Al jazer off there in Israel yeah yeah Tak the BBC off if the BBC are so biased you'd think they'd be taking them off as well yeah well maybe they will next they don't like the BBC they're F furious with the BBC Israel are furious with the BBC the Jewish community in Britain are appalled by BBC's coverage of the Palestine
War so you know that is a fact they are they they are I have them on this show on a regular basis it's an echo chamber isn't it on your show I'm not sure if it's an echo chamber we do our best to present other points of view uh I don't see quite what's so wrong about an echo chamber typical problem with it yeah nor do I nor do I problem with it it's a commercial Enterprise you can all I'm saying a but very entertaining discussion by the way good to have you on board uh
Deborah Turner should take the damn plank out of her own eye before going on about the splinters in mine uh and every other broadcast it's typical BBC holier than thou H Halo polishing cat clap trap they really think they're great and they're really feel don't hold back hey a that was great fun thanks very much for for
