the times of London columnist Melanie Phillips great friended this show her new book is out how to save the West which is fantastic Melanie joins us now the book's called the Builder Stone how Jews and Christians built the west and why only they can save it I'm pleased to say Melanie joins us now from Melbourne Melanie you're in Australia always great to have you here in Australia Australia is very very happy to have you here and hopefully welcoming you although I do know it's a certain Queensland Cricket Club uh objected to you speaking there which
just shows what a disgrace they are but Melanie welcome to Australia and tell us right up front your thoughts on the Gaza deal can it work is it the way forward I don't know whether uh Mr Trump actually uh means precisely what he has said or whether he's used it as a kind of uh leverage in the negotiations he's trying to conduct with Saudi Arabia and other Arab states um if it is true that he means it uh it's quite difficult to see how in practice it can be put into practice but I think that's
not really the point the point is that he's changed the conversation in the right kind of way and in my view it needs to be changed still further um the idea that uh the gazans need to be moved out is only part of the story the idea that uh the Palestinians as such are a cause that is worthy is one that has to be scotched it is a misapprehension based on a set of historical illusionary facts that are not facts at all um that has actually driven uh the Middle East into war for the last
century and has knocked in my view knocked the entire Western liberal intelligencia off the moral rails completely uh there is no such thing as the Palestinian people the idea of a Palestine state was never wanted by them it was devised as part of the explicitly named strategy of stages in order to be a staging point in order to destroy Israel it is based on Islamic holy war to get rid of the Jews to get rid of Israel as the Jewish homeland as a precursor to destroying the west west civilization and replacing it by uh Islamic
Rule and consequently the adoption of the Palestine cause um has uh uh distorted everything basically what's happened for the last 100 years is that the West has rewarded Palestinian genocidal aggression against the state of Israel and against the Jewish people by promises that they will have a state of their own uh by being told by telling them in terms that they're intitled to a state of their own now if you're saying that people who are bent on genocide are entitled to something uh then you have lost the moral plot completely and you incentivize more war
more War Terror uh resulting in you know what we all saw on October the 7th uh an act of unspeakable barbarity and sadism conducted against Jews as Jews although other others than Israeli Jews were involved as well so this is an essential precursor in my view to saying to the Palestinians as a whole uh you're over you're finished uh we don't support this cause we identify now this cause as utterly bogus you will get nothing from us in future is not going to be a state you are not entitled to a state you are not
entitled to any more funding from us until you stop this campaign of Terror and murder against Israel and the Jewish people you will get no diplomatic recognition from us now this would be an absolute Revolution and it's Elementary moral and political reality as far as I'm concerned but the fact is it is so thoroughly embedded in the whole Western mindset that there is a Palestinian people there has to be a Palestinian State that's the root to peace um that uh it's almost impossible to envisage that happening what Trump has done by uh uh moving the
the the um the the discourse in the way that he has over Gaza and we've seen the reaction to that I would hope that's the precursor to some sanity finally emerging over this whole issue what is the attitude in the Middle East to relationships with Israel being normalized without pales Ian statehood because for decades that was the view in the west that you could not normalize those relationships without the Palestinian issue being resolved and and with a two-state solution is that attitude changed in the Middle East the the short answer is I don't know people
talk at different levels to different audiences and say different things and they don't necessarily mean what they say we do know that Saudi Arabia and the other Gulf States uh have a problem with What's called the Arab Street a tremendous amount of uh uh visceral fundamental hatred of Israel and the Jews which in uh past decades and centuries they have themselves Unleashed they are responsible for this now we are led to believe and I believe this is true that among the Gulf States put aside Qatar for a moment Qatar is a rogue state which is
identified with the Hamas with the Muslim Brotherhood but the other Gulf States and Saudi Arabia uh understand we are led to believe and I believe this is true that their future in the future of their uh their countries depends upon good relations with Israel uh and they wish to normalize those relations to a large extent they have been normalized in the last few years uh Saudi Arabia has still to come on board now they are as you say uh still saying in public you know nothing can happen without a Palestine State they don't want a
Palestine State they hate the Palestinians uh the Palestinian Arabs um the the the Arab world loads and detests the Palestinian Arabs they don't want them anywhere near them the only people in the world who support the Palestinian Arabs are the Western liberals unfortunately unfortunately for us that the Western liberals support them so you know I don't believe that they want a Palestine State the the Saudis and the Gulf States would understand that a Palestine state would be a threat to themselves so you know they have to say this now um I think that they want
you know they want to see um the people uh uh of Gaza and the territories uh of uh uh what's called the West Bank Juda and Samaria they want to see them treated decently uh they don't want to see them you know abuse in any way uh but on the other hand uh I think that they will be open to um a settlement of this whole issue uh which fall short of a Palestine State and would would accommodate them in other ways well I want to just get back to something you just said a moment
ago about Western liberals and they're being the ones who really support the Palestinian cause the most and I mean we've seen it in London we've seen it across this this the um cities you know here in Australia and United States you know they actually don't just seem to support the Palestinian cause but also seem to have a fair Bit of Sympathy um if not encouragement for Hamas um is this part of a kind of a suicidal urge on the part of the left and a sort of a self-hatred of the western civiliz ation that brought
them the Liberties that they enjoy um and is there a sort of a strange kind of weird perverse pleasure they take in sort of supporting people who would treat them just the same way as they treated these Hamas captives that we've seen released under the most horrific circumstances every week well I think this is absolutely to the point and it is indeed the point of my book which uh Rowan very kindly mentioned the Builder Stone which is published uh just uh uh in the middle of last month that one can't understand the behavior of the
western liberals on this matter unless one understands it in the context of the allout onslaught uh mounted by the Western liberal intelligencia over many decades against the whole idea of Western Civilization which we're told you know was born in the original sins of colonialism and oppression and and white privilege and all the rest of it and that uh that belief has led to an onslaught on all the institutions the core institutions uh that keep the cultural show on the road the education system the traditional family the very idea of the nation and on its fundamental
uh moral values and one of the uh one of the uh uh results of that Onslaught has been the doctrine that says uh of cultural relativism the doctrine that says that you cannot say that Western Civilization is any better than any other um and therefore you cannot criticize any other other civilization uh or any other culture such as uh the Islamic World such as the whole of the developing world uh because if you do as a Westerner criticize it any in any way and hold it responsible for uh its misdeeds you are guilty of racism
and so um uh the Palestinian Arabs have been perceived in this way to be the victims of colonial oppression by Israel this is a complete lie it is actually Arab colonialism against which is is is fighting the the intention by the Palestinian Arabs to take over Israel uh to exterminate the Jewish homeland and turn it into an Islamic an Islamic State um uh but uh the Western uh Liber to the Western liberal mind this is actually resistance uh they are uh entitled to resist what they what the Western liberal perceives as uh Colonial uh Israeli
colonialism uh uh by a resistance movement of which the hamash is one and so it is a complete moral deformation of the western liberal mind based on what they're doing to their own countries you know this whole idea of victim culture in our own countries in Australia in Britain in which people who purport to be the members of a victim group they Define themselves as victims and they Define everybody else as an oppressor uh they are considered to be untouchable when they do something wrong uh they are considered to be Untouchable they can't be held
responsible for doing the wrong thing because they are oppressed by the oppressor and it is the oppressor who might be white people might be men might be uh might be uh heteronormative people um or whatever who are responsible and for this purpose these purposes and this is the really terrible kicker as far as the Jewish communities are concerned Jews are considered to be white oppressors now in Israel most most Jews are not white actually believe it or not most Israelis are brown or black skinned most Jews are brown or black skinned but they're considered to
be white because they're considered to be oppressors um and so Jews are considered to be white oppressors not just in Israel but in the west why because Jews says the modern Progressive ho ho liberal Jews control everything they control the economy of course Melanie which is of course which takes us straight back to the original tropes of anti-em ISM and of Hitler and the Nazis which is why it was so disturbing to see those three poor men released today Melanie Phillips enjoy the rest of your trip in Australia it's great to have you here uh
you're a great speaker and a great thinker one one of the great thinkers of the modern era and I urge you Outsiders viewers to buy melan's book The Builder Stone how Jews and Christians built the West
