4 Surprising Lessons That Will Make You a Multi-Millionaire | Mel Robbins

Having been somebody that was in a scary place financially just over a decade ago MH I want you to explain what will happen to somebody with crushing student debt or who's having trouble just making the ends meet right now and they don't have a lot of savings how will doing this exercise change their psychology about money starting today yes thank you for asking this because if you are in large amounts of debt whether student Loan credit card even mortgage for for some people some of this can sound really Airy fairy and I'm I'm the last

guy to get accused of us all sitting around the campfire saying Kumbaya I'm like look I'll talk about psychology but we're also going to talk about the numbers and so what I want to emphasize to people is that we often have this belief that we're overwhelmed with money okay it's easy to feel that way but when I ask people show me your Spending what percentage of your income is going to housing or Investments I would say 99% of people do not know okay so how can we I don't know yeah I I I literally don't

know yeah totally it's very common and so how can we feel in control of something if we don't understand the basic mechanics of it even when we drive a car we got got to know how to turn the ignition on you know reverse so we go through life In This Very uh arbitrary transactional way Of like okay this bill came in I'm going to pay it this bill came in that feels really bad it's transactional it's reactive and what I'm encouraging you to do is to go from defense to offense with your money that means

once you set the intention of an Italy trip if you're in crushing debt you may go hey I actually cannot afford to put $100 a month away I go okay well why don't we write that down $100 a month towards Italy but you can't do that today that's totally fine Next we're going to go through your four key numbers in the conscious spending plan let's make sure you understand your numbers and you'll be quite surprised that a lot of people discover they have more money than they actually realized once they go on offense with their

personal finances oh wow okay so what are the four T things that we all need to go through everybody needs these four numbers this is what I use instead of a Budget I don't keep a budget you think I'm going to sit around tracking the price of asparagus for the rest of my life hell no okay I don't want to live that kind of life I don't that kind of life either okay yeah all right so four numbers that you should know these are all part of my conscious spending plan the first is your fixed

costs okay so that would include your rent or mortgage y your utilities car payment gas Insurance anything that's fixed even Groceries every month that goes there and what about the minimum debt payment or is that part of another category yeah that's that counts there exactly thank you and that number you should try to get it between 50 to 60% of your Tak home pay okay okay let me let me run through these all and then I'll tell you what they mean 50 to 60% of your take-home pay for fixed costs next up your savings how

much money are you saving every month this should be Roughly 5 to 10% of your take-home and savings would be an emergency fund or money you don't need for at least one to five years things like a down payment for a house Etc next up would be Investments roughly 5 to 10% of take-home although I like to see it higher because investing early in life pays well pays dividends later okay and then little for Mel Robins did not invest early in life I'm just going to like let that one go and focus on my Dream

list okay just wanted to acknowledge that when you said that cuz people say that I'm like [ __ ] I didn't do that okay well I wish I started deadlifting when I was 13 years old but I didn't even know what that was you know so we all start from the place we start at that's true okay the last category is my favorite one of all it's guilt free spending this is 20 to 35% of take-home pay what now yeah that's right desserts Mel go get them beautiful cashmir coat that's for me go get them

you want to go you want to get roller skates you want to go to your gym 20 to 35% a take home now let me tell you why I love this and why I'm getting excited about four numbers okay so many of us shrink our lives and we agonize over some stupid $5 purchase you really think coffee is going to change your life it's irrelevant it does not matter matter how much coffee you buy so please stop Thinking about that the same people who Ag and I go oh I'm so overwhelmed I don't know anything

I go what's your savings rate they go what's that how much are you investing well I try but I don't really know okay how are you supposed to feel not overwhelmed if you don't know any key numbers so know the four numbers and you will suddenly feel totally in control some of you aren't going to be able to hit these numbers that's okay at least we can work with it We got the puzzle pieces on the table now we can start assembling your rich life wow okay I I think I can do this yeah so

you just like carve out some time on the weekend and get your arms around these four things yeah which should take 15 minutes do not overthink it's going to take me a while really it takes 15 minutes yeah here's what here's what people do you know because the the biggest um challenge is uh people don't have the right logins so their logins Are spread all they got their Fidelity account or some old 401k or whatever ever so I I would recommend breaking it up into two days the first day is just get all your stuff

assembled right it's like cleaning the garage and then the second day 15 minutes and done do not overthink it we're going for approximate numbers that's it I love you I love you love you love you you have that what is it the 85% rule get 85% of this right you're good get yeah get on with your Life you don't need to sit there and optimize everything it's a waste of time and I also love this because like it can feel so insurmountable when you've made major Financial mistakes in your life yeah that this gives you

a place to start that you can then start to get better from and and I just actually had a huge wakeup moment I realized that one of the great things About growing up with parents who were very like just I didn't ever see any concern about money and I didn't see them talking about it actually that's not true I would see my mother sitting at her desk with one of those little calculators with the tapes as she was balancing her checkbook hey that's a that's a really important thing that you saw you saw a woman

taking control of money and obviously and being capable and competent that is a very valuable Lesson to learn as a child that that obviously has come through for you that's amazing oh yeah and she then went on to open her own retail store and I I come all the women like my grandmother is a farmer and ran the money and she had a calculator with the tape and my other grandmother my grandparents had a bakery and she had the thing with the tape but what's interesting is that I think the oh it's chill aspect has

gotten too hands off For me the fact that I can't answer those numbers like that at this stage in my life for me it used to be because of fear and shame and how bad the numbers were I used to be one of those people that the bills would arrive and I would just not open them yeah common and because it was confronting to see the debt and confronting to see how much I had spent because I was you know basically shopping to escape my life with money That I did not afford or that I

didn't have and then you'd open up the bills and be like [ __ ] yeah I guess I spent that much yeah I I don't have that money and so I it used to be that but I think now that I've paid off all the debt and I have savings and I've you know maniacally saving I don't look at it at all still okay let's let's talk about a couple things that are so interesting about what you just said I love the honesty All of us have something in our lives that we are we feel

like we should be doing better and we kind of pushed the envelopes away and I I deeply understand this because for me it was Fitness and I grew up half joking calling myself a skinny Indian guy and I really wish I had not said that because it became part of my identity and you know if if any of us say something like I'm bad with money I would gently encourage you to not say that maybe reframe it and say gosh I Haven't learned to skills of money yet but I'm changing that now I want to

stop right there hold on a I apologize for interrupting you but this is so important yeah if you just heard RIT say I'm bad with money I want you to pay attention loud and clear because he's absolutely right or if you say something like I I don't understand it's overwhelming yeah I'm not good with math I'm not good with math what are other things that your Students say REM that really crystallize a terrible psychology around money my family's never been good with money we're all bad um I'm never going to get out of this debt

um we always fight about money and I'm just an overs spender or my husband yeah took care of the finances oh classic oh that drives me insane hold on I'm getting mad but I got I'm getting mad at multiple things right now so let me take them each in turn okay first off um what you said About not opening envelopes and then now as you've become much more financially successful it's almost swung the other way is totally common in my experience once people start earning around $150,000 they stop really paying attention to the numbers because

they basically make enough to not have to really pay attention and actually I'm a little okay with that I don't want people agonizing over the price of groceries if they're making 150k but What I do want and what I do for myself is I spend one hour per month on my finances that's it just one hour I review the CSP my wife and I talk about money hold on the CSP was that conscious spending plan of the four things fixed cost uh what's your automatic sa savings your Investments and then the the category I love

the most guilt-free [ __ ] spending people well I love it you added the f word that's so good I got to add that that's beautiful it it Is exciting okay so all those things when you have money carved out for guilt-free spending it is literally defined so that if you want to eat and get an extra cheesecake or you want to go to the movies like you don't have to feel guilty because you know my debt is being paid off my rent or mortgage is being covered I'm even saving money I'm not trying to

save money just like I don't try to brush my teeth it is happening automatically it's even better Than brushing in so that is if you're listening I hope that's a sense of relief that you don't have to feel bad about having debt you do not have to track a gajillion numbers that you don't even care about you do and I would highly encourage you to focus on four key numbers that will totally transform your life I love this I love how easy you're making this thank you for that it's absolutely my pleasure I I I

don't want to spend time doing that either I Don't want anyone else to waste their time on it I just I I want to clarify one thing so these four pillars of the conscious spending plan and again I come from the lived experience of crushing debt yeah where you feel that unless you can get to zero balance you don't deserve guilt-free spending yeah that somehow you're cheating on your goal to get out of debt which is what every financial advisor pounds into your head yeah and you feel Like that latte robs you of the opportunity

to be out of debt you feel like spending to go on a trip with your friends robs you of the ability to be out of debt and what you're saying is no no no no no you can start right now by figuring out these four things and allocating incoming to those things correct we have a very unhealthy relationship with money in this country on one one hand we have a puritanical uh strain that tells us do Not buy anything and you're a bad person for having debt and you should live in a monastery until that

debt is paid off and then maybe you can go buy a pack of gum okay on the other hand we're like uh okay hold on let me look at Instagram oh my friend's in Bora Bora on Tuesday oh I think I'm going to go uh take a trip even though I don't even know how much I have in the bank what a two paradoxical beliefs and usually it's the consumerist one that wins but we still feel guilty We love to feel guilty in this country I don't really know what I don't want to feel guilty

with money I don't also I'm not naturally like I don't feel guilty I'm just like let me just fix this so um when it comes to having debt here's my belief uh number one you need to know how much you owe 90% of people I talk to who are in debt do not even know how much debt they owe that's number one you got to know your numbers number two you've got to know the exact month and Year your debt will be paid off 95% of people in debt do not know their debt payoff plan

easy way to do it literally go on Google type debt payoff calculator plug your numbers in and you will see and don't worry if it seems depressing oh it's going to take 28 years what I want you to do is just plug the number in and sit with it for a day and later you will learn things like wow if I add an extra $50 a month it can shave off three years from my debt but that comes Later I just want you know what I also love that you're saying is I love that you're

saying it's okay to have it like most rich people actually finance a lot of things and it's yeah and that go ahead you're the expert I don't know why the hell I'm talking about money go ahead well first of all whether it's okay or not a lot of people have debt yes so let's just accept us for who we are that's that's the fact of life now I do want you to get smarter with dead so There when I look at people I always look at a snapshot of their finances and I talk about all

these numbers on the podcast by the way we have folks who come on $800,000 of debt they're not even sure really are you serious well that was me uh over a decade ago yeah when the lean at the house okay no College savings no 401K credit cards maxed out home equity line maxed out plowed it all into my husband's restaurant business did not go According to plan I lost my job leans the house he hadn't been paid in 6 months friends and family had invested holy [ __ ] hell that was my life okay so

this so you really know what it's like yeah this is not a joke this is it's like um you think about it every day of your life when you're in it yes and in fact there's research I believe that says that the number is 75 or $78,000 in the United States is what you need to make in order to be relieved of The day-to-day Financial stress that you have that when you reach that number there's a level of Freedom involved I don't know if that's true or not I I I know the research um is

it's not that it people have wildly misinterpreted it let me put it this way and I want to correct it because people listening who are making $75,000 they're like wait a second why do I still feel so stressed what's wrong with me right and there not there's not something Wrong with you nobody is broken with money nobody there are ways for you to get uh informed about money so you know the basic language of money which anybody can do you do not have to be a math genius I'm not and second to work on improving

your money psychology you know I I spoke to a couple on my podcast and uh they were in a lot of financial trouble and they you know they think about it every day and they were so stressed out and I asked them have you Read my book not judging it turns out like almost nobody who comes on my podcast reads my book which I find hilarious and so I said okay uh and they go well you know I don't really I haven't really read a lot I said okay you're a new parent she was a

mom I think her baby was about like six months old I said um when you first had your baby did you know how to hold her she goes no did you know how to feed her No did you just wing it did you just tried your best you know no I got help the nurses my mom I read a bunch of books and on and on and on and that is so normal there are things in life we don't know that's okay but we do have to say hey this is important to me my rich

life is important I deserve to dream bigger than a box of pickles and therefore I'm going to prioritize learning and also improving my Psychology um I'm going to read your book I've never read a financial book in my life oh okay I love it you know there's audio it I'm just admitting it I have never love your honesty read a financial book in my entire life I have read plenty of blogs and listened to podcasts I've never read a book and the truth is I am intimidated by investing and the irony of this is that

this is the one area of my life where I have goals and I want to Get more into investing and also investing in uh startups as an angel investor and I don't know the first [ __ ] thing about it and there is this I don't know like self-doubt or whatever that's I realize in talking to you is keeping me from starting and yet one of the things that if I make that 10-year list that you're talking about of Dreams it is to have advised invested in and nurtured a number of startup Companies particularly by

you know underrepresented Founders in spaces and categories that I deeply care about and it's almost like what I just realized is doing that would help me fulfill in a w in an amazing way that ripple effect of sending desserts to people there you go that that is the money dial the desserts are beautiful but they are such a small example you are so much bigger than a table full of desserts that is it yeah that like that I I it connected the dots between those two yeah and so you know you've given us so much

to do and so much to think about and I want to recap kind of what we've covered so far for everybody so that you can also REM tell us what else or where to start or we're going to list we're going to link to absolutely everything all your resources where people can listen to your podcast where people can find your website of course your new Netflix series where you are following a Number of people that need their mindset about money changed in a show where you've got like six weeks to turn people's Financial life around

and so you know this is something where you can can get coached by RIT not only through his programs but through this new zeroc cost Netflix show so make sure to tune in to that but I want us to just make sure that we have everybody leaving in action because you've just poured so much into us number one take two days Everybody one for your logins for your financial thing the other to get the number straight and don't overthink it you got to get your conscious spending plan together which REM taught us has four aspects

of fixed costs savings Investments and you're guilt-free [ __ ] spending people um the other one is you're going to do this 10year dream plan where you get to just get your 10-year bucket list on and this is so important because this is how you start To reclaim your life and take control of the psychology around money you get to dream you deserve to dream you deserve to have a big beautiful rich life and without this bucket list you haven't identified that you've also given us this exercise of money dials and thinking about what is

the thing that if you dial it up and it's the thing that you smile big about and you know could be eating out could be experiences Health and wellness uh convenience things things that make your life easier make you feel more supported you also guided us through a short kind of reflection of those moments in life that really impacted your core beliefs right now about money and so you've given us a starting point you've given us the research and the why you've given us a road map for what to do get to get started what

else REM when it comes to Having this be day one of you having a different psychology and relationship to money and somebody truly taking control of their life is there something else that that we haven't talked about um I would love for people to have an answer to this question I spend extravagantly on blank and I cut cost mercilessly on blank and that really is the Capstone of a lot Of what we've talked about you spend extravagantly on tipping or on clothes or on what whatever it is and to be able to write that down

and be Unapologetic about it oh you're really standing in who you are and that's okay not everybody has to agree with it and it also means you have to be honest about what you are willing to cut cost mercilessly on you know maybe I'm actually overspending on my house maybe I didn't know about the 28% Rule and Maybe I didn't know about 2836 and all these different things that you can learn over time but you have to be willing to also say if I want to live my rich life then what am I willing to

say this is not part of my rich life what are some of the things that you typically see with the people that you work with that are cost that they meres I can't even pronounce that word they mercilessly cut yes uh I'll tell you what they overspend On tell me cuz it's very it's always same okay the number one area that people overspend on is housing costs and so in their fixed costs that is the first there's a reason it's first uh their housing costs a good guideline is that your housing cost should roughly be

28% of your gross income now I will tell you that that's really hard number especially because housing has gotten so expensive yeah if you especially if you live in New York La Etc so if people Come and they go well hey mine's like 31% I go okay you know we can approximate it's like adding a little more salt to your dish fine but sometimes they look at it and it's 42% now I'm going to tell you what that means because again most of us do not have the full picture of our finances we simply pay

the bill that comes in and they're wondering why do we keep fighting about Target why doesn't my husband or my wife uh want to go out to Dinner once a year I'm so annoyed I go well I could tell you right right now it has nothing to do with Target nothing to do with dinner out it's that your housing cost is 42% of gross and because you're spending all your money up there there's nothing left trickling down the waterfall you can't save you can't invest you can't go out and when they realize that then suddenly

they have they have the knowledge and they can go okay do we actually love this house do We need to live here fine then what are we going to cut back on or do we actually need to live here could we downsize could we move do we have options could we rent out uh Adu in the back if we've got it etc etc that's number one number two overspending is cars you know you get somebody I get this all the time and I always get mad at them and then everyone gets mad at me because

in America we love trucks so I have nothing against TR well that's not True I have a lot of things against trucks uh including safety and a variety of other things but what I really have a problem with is somebody making $75,000 who buys an $80,000 truck because their buddy Chad at the dealer told them oh you can afford the monthly payment and then they forget to factor in what I call TCO total cost of ownership that $80,000 truck actually cost you 120 Grand once you factor in insurance tax gas and on and on and

on they can't Afford it so I asked one guy he comes on the show you know they're struggling with money he goes you know they tell it comes out way late they're like oh we tried everything we buy generic we buy generic macaroni and cheese I go I don't care about macaroni tell me about your car they go we have this big nice truck I go oh okay that's so interesting uh by the way why do you have a truck and he looks at me like I'm crazy he goes to pull the trailer I go

what you can't Afford any of this so um anyway those are the two areas people overspend on it's it's house and car and if you can just avoid that if you can just get your numbers in line and fit your fixed cost the rest of your life will be so much easier wow wow you have a truck mail my husband drives a pickup truck yeah what kind uh I think it's a Chevy well I don't I don't really mind because I know you can afford it but let's assume you and your Husband made like one

tenth of what you made now and you had that Chevy what do you think about that uh I I'm I would be S it costs $125,000 that's a lot of money well it's this another thing guess and but I also live in Vermont and I would not be able to get up my driveway that's a quarter mile long during mud season if we didn't have a pickup truck we literally have to shuttle people up and down this driveway I drive a 9-year-old car that just [ __ ] The bed and now I I drove it

in to get repaired and was told it needs to be towed out somewhere to be sold so I am currently without a car so this is very timely but I'm not a big car person well good I like that you know that see now what I want to hear is that and it could be car I I don't need a fancy house I don't need fancy clothes fine I but I also want to know what you are into and once people start to define those two things that really helps create the the Dimensions of their

rich life also never buy anything expensive based on a monthly payment that's a trick people do this with their house their car and they forget all about the Phantom costs that are not in included in their monthly payment so if you've been guilty of that do you then like have to have an honest conversation with yourself that's like when I and again w i want you to leave us with this rich life concept because while ramit is a financial adviser he's The host of a hit television show he's a New York Times best-selling author and

he has helped millions of people change their thinking and mindset psychology and relationship with money and launch businesses and get out of debt and create and build the life the rich life of their dreams um I really want to make sure people leave with a paradigm shift yeah what do most people without realizing have if they don't have a rich Life already like if you talk if you think about the people that came on the Netflix show or any of the millions of students that come to your website every month what is the current mindset

that most people have and then I want you to leave us with a definition of what is possible if you apply these tools and you listen to REM the mindset that most of us have is what I would equate to being at work and getting one email after another and Simply being an order taker okay this person emailed me oh I got to get back to that person and that is life and that is most people's lives forever when it comes to money I got this bill we got to get diapers uhoh the car broke

down how are we going to respond to it yeah it's just one arbitrary problem after another and I don't wish for those problems to go away cars break down sometimes we go into debt that's life Instead I want to give you a whole new way of looking at them which is to say agonizing over you know some tiny thing at the grocery store is actually never going to go away and it's never going to change your life and you could spend the rest of your life worrying about it and in my Paradigm that's a tragedy

what a tragedy to live a smaller life than you have to what a tragedy to defer the rich life until some mythical day which you don't Even know when it's going to happen and if I ask you you apply an arbitrary number no we're not going to do that because you've listened to the two of us talking today instead we're going to Define it right now what is our rich life what are my money dials what do I want to spend extravagantly on and therefore cut cost mercilessly on and am I comfortable saying to myself

and perhaps other people I'm going to live my rich Life today and an even richer life tomorrow that's the vision I want to leave everybody with I freaking love that oh my God you're amazing this is this is the uh thank you this is like I I love doing I love seeing people's lives change when they see money in a different way fantastic because when you see it in a different way you act differently with it and that's why this matters rem's not saying think about a rich and all of a sudden There'll be a

million dollars in your bank account that's not not affirmations no no it's you got to be competent you got to know your numbers absolutely I hold people to that um but when most people think about money they see stress and overwhelm and debt and when I look at numbers I see a trip to Disneyland with your kids I see an amazing food tour in India I see the ability to never have to look at the price when you're at a restaurant and that is what you can Get when you understand how to use money I

love this one final question for those people that have a mindset I'm terrible with money I'm bad with money I'm never going to get out of debt if you could drop in New programming please tell them what they should start saying to themselves all day long about money instead the new phrase that I want you to use is I haven't always been great with Money but now I'm learning it's so simple such a simple reframe just you nobody's expecting you to become a multi-millionaire overnight we don't even need that but day by day you put

a a little bit of time and attention into reframing your identity I haven't always been good but I'm starting to learn about money now that can be listening to this episode listening to my podcast watching the Netflix show it can be putting some time During your commute to listen to the audiobook and certainly having some conversations with a partner might maybe saying you know what I realize that when we talk about money we're always stressed out and I don't want that for us I actually want us to feel good about money and I realize I've

got some work to do absolutely but I'd love to do it together with you would you be willing to do that together that's how you reframe it solo and with a partner I Love that I love that and I want to add one more because I'm thinking about my husband and one of the reasons why I love your reframe I haven't always been great with money but now I'm learning to be great with it I love that because as you know those sort of mindset reframes only work if your brain accepts it as true and

by Leading with the fact that you acknowledge the fact that you haven't always been great it's not a make wrong it's just stating a fact it Now opens the door for your brain to go oh yeah yeah but now you're learning to be greater okay I got that and so I could say for those of you that are on the spectrum of always been stressed but you have it I've I've I haven't always been you know free with my money but I'm now starting to enjoy it I used to be stressed about my money but

now I'm learning how to enjoy it ah so good I love that you add that that positive emotion Because deep down most Of us don't need the fancy Villa but we do want to feel good day to day with our money yes we want to know that if our kids ask us for something for school we can get it we want to know that if a friend comes into town and they say hey would you like to meet for lunch yeah we can go we don't even have to think about the numbers because we've already

built in a margin of safety we've built in some ability to to take these spontaneous things that happen in life That's a rich life to not have to always be tight and restrictive but to be fluid and accepting and I love the way you put that enjoy money that is so good well and here's the other thing that I love if I had to put this all full circle is that one of the things that we talk about all the time on this podcast and you talk about it too is the fact that we're all

obsessed with getting to someplace like I got to I got to get that beach house I Got to get out of debt because we presume that we're going to feel a certain way yeah when we achieve it and what you're offering is a very clear simple stepbystep road map that helps you change how you feel about money and how you think about money so that as you're creating this rich life and as you're taking responsibility you feel more freedom you feel happier it starts today it starts today yeah exactly and the D I never believe

in living a life Of you know I'll start doing all these things when I retire it's about the journey and I want you to also get to where you want to go but it's even sweeter when the journey has been intentional amazing and that is what we really want to create a rich life today and a richer life tomorrow amazing I want to be very clear about something I am unbelievably talented when it comes to making money but I am not a financial expert in fact I consider myself to be Bad with money and it

may surprise you to hear that I feel that way about myself and I'll admit to you I have a lot to learn when it comes to being responsible with money managing money and if I dig even deeper I have a lot of emotion about money see I shop when I'm stressed and even though I can pay my bills at this moment in my life I don't open my bills when they arrive they literally sit there in a little stack I don't know if You have a little stack like in the entryway of your house or

on the counter in the kitchen but I always have like a little stack I don't know what it is I kind of want to get to the bottom of it today and this has been the way that I've been for as long as I can remember in fact I can give you some examples if I go back to college so I arrive at College and they have that sort of like opening registration Forum thing where there's these tables and clubs you can Join when I went to college I'm 55 years old no kidding there were

Banks there and they were handing out credit cards like literally handing out credit cards as if it was candy to trick-or-treaters all you had to do walk up to a table fill out a form you get a credit card you get a credit card I'm like I'll take a credit card it was like free money until I graduated with $10,000 in debt and I had no idea what I'd spend it on and that Led to the next era in my life of financial irresponsibility in which I would play this game that I called credit card

LeapFrog which basically involved Mel Robbins searching for a credit card with a 0% offer and then transferring balance from my last credit card that I had maxed out to this new one and I get it I was an idiot and the fact is though that what was really going on is I was intimidated by money and I was also really embarrassed by the Reality of my financial situation and it felt like living in financial quickstand and when I got into my 20s my first job after law school was to be a public defender and I

could barely make the ends meet I mean I'm talking pay rent pay for groceries and so I started putting my living expenses on a credit card I mean it got so bad in terms of me being in debt and just constantly being irresponsible around it that when Chris and I got married 28 years ago I came Into that marriage with five or six credit cards that were completely maxed out now did I tell him of no I'm being serious in fact if I sit here and really think about it I'm not sure he even knows

this today because I kept it secret and I just kind of kept paying the minimum balance and I'm telling you this because I think this is more common than most of us realize and when you get into debt or you are like I was and you are Constantly living beyond your means because you're like okay I feel terrible so I don't want to sit and look at my bills so I'm just going to go out and spend money that I don't have and eventually I'll have money and so it just creates this level of stress

and shame and it became for me a very toxic cycle that was hard to break out of and you know as my story progresses a lot of you know that when I was in my 40s my husband and his best friend followed a Dream of going into the restaurant business and like a lot of you who are small business owners we put up our house as the collateral for that business because that's all the collateral that we had and that's great when your business is successful but the market took a turn the business started to

fail we found ourselves 800 Grand in debt I'm 41 years old three kids under the age of 10 and let me tell you something if you think a credit card Bill is scary that is nothing compared to what it feels like to have leans start arriving in the mail saying they've hit your house and bankruptcy no notifications and so many of you that have heard that story that was my life 15 years ago want to know Mel oh my God $800,000 in debt almost going to lose your house you were unemployed how the hell did

you get out of debt and I've never really given the answer because I just outworked it like that literally is The answer that I realized nobody was coming I realized that my husband was doing the best he can to try to keep the business afloat he hadn't been paid in like six month like if I was going to F this I I had to do something and what that looked like is working like a freak I mean I had two three four jobs at a time I just never stopped and I started chipping away at

the credit card bills and paying off the minimum balances and then making more chunks and then when I Paid them off I cut them up and when I finally got myself out of debt not mortgage I still have a mortgage but like all of that debt that had racked up the leans on the house all that stuff that was like six years ago I had one rule any dollar that came in 50 cents had to go into savings why because it was so terrifying to be under that kind of excruciating Financial stress and shame I

never wanted to be in that position again and I know there's a lot That I can learn which is why I'm so excited to learn from Tiffany but I'm also here because I look at my three kids our adult kids so 25 23 and 18 and here's what scares me I pass this stuff down to our daughters I see them struggling with their relationship with money it's not a powerful relationship they are scared of it they want more of it they don't feel empowered by it and you know one of them is so afraid that

she will never have enough money that She's like a squirrel she works like crazy she's always working on and then she's taking the nut and she's squirreling it away and she's not enjoying it and then there's our other daughter who's 23 and she is identical to how I used to be you know what she does she does what I do she shops and she buys something that she can't afford in fact the other time I was talking to her on FaceTime this was two days ago she's sitting there eating something That looked weird I'm like

what is that she's like oh it's seamoss it's like the next it thing everybody's eating it La mom which means of course you have to buy it in some organic blah blah blah blah blah blah blah kind of thing which means it costs Way Beyond the budget of a starving artist and so I know better I'm like don't say anything well cuz you know that's not a good thing to do but I feel like I don't know how to empower my kids to break out of the Cycle with money that I was trapped in and

that is why I am so excited when our next guest today said Mel the Mel Robins Pock of course I'll get on a plane and fly to Boston and sit down with you and spend time teaching you youl and you listening the five things that you need to know to take control of your financial life Tiffany aliche is here and you might have already met her before because she is an expert and star in the Netflix series get smart with Money her podcast Brown ambition has won a Webby award her book get good with money

as a New York Times bestseller and she has built an eight figure business and she runs an eight figure business and she has been in the depths of debt and you know what's interesting is I can almost hear right now all the moms and dads pulling up the share button and sharing this episode to their kids because you know as soon as we're done editing this this is going straight to My kids and if you're listening to this because your mom or dad or Aunt or uncle or brother or sister sent this to you I

want to tell you something you're going to freaking love Tiffany and you need to hear it Tiffany has helped two million people just like you save manage and pay off hundreds of millions of dollars and one of the reasons why I like her so much is she's been there she understands what it's like to be under crushing debt to be a victim of a scam to not be able To pay your bills and she is living proof that you can learn everything you need to learn you can literally not only climb out of that debt

you can build a mountain of wealth and she's going to meet you wherever you are so are you ready to get good with money I sure am Tiffany welcome to the Mel Robbins podcast I'm so excited to be here Mel I would love to just jump in and talk about your story with money and first of all I want to offer up that your story Is very common that you know you are not the exception but the rules so many of us especially when we're younger struggle with our financial relationship with money so like I'm

not surprised by some of the things you went through cuz I went through them as well and when you've helped as many people as you've helped I would imagine that you hear some of the same things whether it's fear or shame what is something that you want someone To know if they're struggling to pay their bills right now or they are like Chris and I were their house has leans on it they're in a mountain of debt or they think they've done all the right things but they're still feeling this level of why can't I

get this right what is your overarching message in terms of what's possible for somebody well one I want you to know that it is quite possible if you can hear the sound of my voice it means that you are still Currently here yes and because you're still currently here then you can turn around whatever situation or circumstance that you're in I promise you you awesome no matter how much debt you have no no matter I mean when you said 800,000 I'll said I see your 800 and I had 300,000 well we're going to get to

that so why don't we get into I know your background but why don't you tell everybody how you became the budista Like your background I feel like I was born into the budista I'm one of five five girls and my parents are both immigrants from Nigeria and my dad especially was really focused on teaching his girls about money okay he was an accountant he has his um Bachelor's in economics His Master's in finance and we had money lessons at home wow yeah so every Thursday we would have like a family meeting usually about chores and

homework but also the Family's Financial State wow you know and honestly when you're a kid you think like whatever is happens in your home is like that's what happens everywhere it wasn't until probably middle school and I'm like you guys don't you don't have money class cuz my dad let us know that this is normal everyone does this and I'm like so you don't do Thursday night money sessions got it okay uh but it was great because I mean at the time I Didn't think it was great but it really taught us the basics and

not to be afraid of money because we talked about it so openly okay like he would leave the light bill on the dining room table which was Central in our house our dining room and he would say if the light B goes down we can put money into our our traveling fund and we can go to Disney you know what I'm stealing that right now no I'm serious because I think as a parent having an 18-year-old son Like I come downstairs in the morning and if he's the last one up it's like every light in

the house is on and you can say it intellectually but even just that strategy of leaving the bill out and saying if you turn off the lights this is lower and I can use that money to do more things for you yes that's a great tip thank you to your dad cuz one of the things that he understood and is that kids don't care about your bills I don't care if your kid is 30 or three True they don't care about your bills what they do care about is what's important to them and so if

you can link your bills to what's important to them then they will care about that outcome match it to what's important and then all of a sudden even for yourself like money for money's sake is usually not motivation enough yeah you know matching it to a thing vacation less work more time with family if you can match it to something that's important then it's Easier to stick to the money goal interesting so did you like literally graduate from high school and head off into your life and you were already chipping away saving millions of dollars

well I was financially quote unquote perfect until about 25 26 because I just did what my parents told me to do that's around that age gotcha you know you start um old people call it smelling yourself when you're like I'm grown I can do what I want And so I was really good at savings I went to to school for business um and I hated all my internships cuz I'm fun and it was like I'm dying here yes and so I decided I wanted to teach because I Lov kids and I thought I think I

want to be a teacher but I don't want to be broke how do I reconcile those two things um so I decided Well if I'm really good with my money I can take a job that takes less that that pays less true so I did that I became a preschool teacher I Bet you were great at that oh my God I was the best I'm not gonna lie everybody loved Miss Tiffany I mean cuz I was like 21 and I had a ball teaching okay so you're you are following the advice of your parents you

are working the systems you are able to do a job that you love yes you are checking all the boxes what happened just saving saving saving cuz I lived home for the first year smart and my dad Showed me how to do my own taxes um so much so that I was so good at like budgeting and and managing money that I would show the other teachers yeah um the maintenance men would come in during nap time the parents I started to have like parent University so the kids would nap parents would come in and

I would show them this is how you budget this is how you save and that's how the budget Easter was born informally because I realize I don't just like teaching kids I like teaching this too right you know okay that's super cool you know and then I want to say about 25 that's when I said I don't actually want your advice anymore because I'm an adult you mean your father's advice okay I'm an adult I have it I have it um and so it was then that I decided to go back for my Masters in

Education I thought maybe I'd be a principal so all of a sudden you'd be a great principal too well you know I don't know because I Feel like you put the best people in the classroom if I'm being honest um and that's when I realized after my Master's $50,000 later I don't like this yeah so so I didn't have undergraduate loans my parents helped and and I lived at home part of the time so I didn't have student loans okay so now you're 26 you got $50,000 in student yes and then too around that time

I said you know I had $30,000 saved y because although I was um working and making by then about $50,000 a year as a teacher I was really good at side hustling I I babysat I tutored and so I saved about $30,000 and I said I think I want to buy something i' bought a condo which was not necessarily bad except for it was right before the crash the recession I so we're talking 2007 2008 yes so I it's all happened to me too so I bought it in 2006 right y so I paid 220

for the condo and I was like no problem I've got a good job and then I thought I want to Learn how to like be rich and I had a friend air quotes who I thought was rich cuz in your 20s you think if someone has a nice car yes in apartment they're rich so I asked him can you teach me to invest not my dad but you can you teach him to invest he said sure you look stupid I mean yeah yeah and so he told me to pull money for one he said do

you have credit cards I said just this one that my dad told me to pay off every month which I do he's like no no open up A couple more because you can pull money off a credit card I didn't know and I was like sure so I opened up the cards and he's like pull I think I want to say I pulled off um $115,000 yeah and it should have been such a red flag because I was at the bank I can literally see the Banker's face saying are you okay they kept me there

for an hour like grilling me and no red flag went off like Tiffany they were worried because they're like is she getting scammed well Obviously yes but I didn't know that and so I cuz I was like we have a contract signed this contract with him of course he promptly flew the coupe I did not no yes wait so this was a guy who basically told you to take out credit cards get a cash advance on the credit cards give him the money and he was going to invest it for me oh man but at

the time I just I was like but he's Rich he wouldn't steal from me that's true like if somebody is like doing all the things And going out and they're wearing the FY you're like oh they know how to make money well he was this is a Serial I didn't realize he was a Serial scammer that's why he had the money cuz he then took your 15,000 or 20,000 and then like bought more nice clothes and then went on to the next person wow so I but I didn't know at first because and even thinking

about the terms it was this 15,000 is going to yield you $2,000 a week for two years I don't even know I Didn't even really ask what it was going to be invested in I was like that sounds like a lot of money I'm in so because I thought I'm about to be rich I had these credit cards that still because I had such great credit yeah I had these credit cards that I never thought about using credit cards before but I'm like since I'm going to be rich let me start using them I ran

up another 15,000 on the CR oh my God so you got 30,000 in debt and it's probably at like 18 20% Imine yes so now I've got $50,000 in in um student loan debt 220,000 a mortgage 30,000 credit card debt literally the year before debt-free and I was just happy as a clam cuz you know like you're just a little fool like I'm about to be rich and then a week or two in after tricking up all my money on my credit cards you know reaching out to him like when can I expect my first

payment he was the worst kind of thief I like just a clean Thief just steal my money and go He instead would be like you didn't get the deposit I sent it call your bank so it he took me through so now he's gaslighting you I didn't have the word for it then and I'd be like Bank you know did you get the money and then like no um so he did that for a few months and then maybe he was trying to like get away cuz he then moved so maybe he was hoping you

know that I wouldn't call the police until he could move away um then he just stopped answering and I remember I was devastated like wait what do I do now and so I was like that's all right Tiffany you're a really good saver a really good budgeter so you're just going to you know babysit tutor in your job and you're just going to pay this Deb down you're going to chip away at it and you're not going to tell anybody yes and then the recession hit and people were losing their jobs and I said wo

not me cuz I'm a teacher and then they called us and said actually you too 3 Days before the new school year was set to begin oh man I was like I don't understand because teachers don't I mean you're you're you need teachers yeah but it was a nonprofit based school oh and so they lost their funding because the corporations that gave us funding it was the recession for them too so I'm like yeah but school's supposed to start in 3 days and then the summer you don't get paid so I was waiting on that

first check to start this new plan oh my God And I remember being like what do I do now I owe all this money I have a mortgage and so I call my oldest sister Karen cuz you know she's mom Junior yeah I was like what do I do and she was like honestly Tiffany what's the worst case scenario and I was like I don't know I guess I lose my condo yeah and she's like well what would happen then I'm like I guess I would have to tell Mommy and Daddy and move back home

and she was like well why Wait I think you should just do the thing now preemptively you know and I was like so I didn't even tell my parents I just brought like a lamp home and then I brought like a blanket and then my mattress and my dad's like are you back I'm like yeah but he didn't know why I was back because he knew it was like a recession and he didn't know he didn't know that I lost my job so he just he just assumed I was trying to save money right but

I didn't want him To know all the other Shenanigans surrounding all so did you lose the condo too yes it was honestly you know how some things you're like it can't get worse and it was like hold my beer yes indeed it can so I ended up losing my condo to foreclosure I tried to keep up with the mortgage until my retirement account was was emptied so now I have no retirement account I lost my condo I still owe all this money and now I'm living back home with two Nigerian Parents who think like I'm

in 12th grade still because by then I was like 28 29 and I they were like well I hope you know you have a curfew I'm like a curfew they're like if you're home cuz I had SP of money yes I had a sister who was still in high school they're like we don't want you coming in and out like her her rules are your rules I was like wait what and so I stayed there till I was 29 and on my 29th going on 30th birthday I remember laying in my middle School bed because

that was the bed available because the baby sister was in like my cool teen like spot in the basement and she was like I don't care if you're home go live upstairs with Mommy and Daddy Y and I remember laying in my middle school bed tears streaming down the sides of my face and I thought I had more money the last time I laid in this bed when I was like 14 cuz I babysat I walked dogs and I was like I had more money then I had maybe like Three or $4,000 save then than

I do now at 30 and I was calling myself every loser like just talking to myself in a way that I would never let anyone talk to me and it was I was filled with such shame yeah that it set me into a state of depression because I was like I'm never going to get out of this never ever ever so that's why when people come to me I'm like I feel it deeply you know um and so I just I stayed in that state of depression for a while until my best Friend Linda who

used to call me all the time was like you never want to go out you always sound so sad what's wrong and I used to lie to her and just like everything's fine everything's fine and then one day she's like everything's not fine Tiffany like what's happening so I tried to lie to her again and I just broke down into tears and I was like I'm at home I lost everything and she was like that's it if you knew Linda you'd be like cuz that's Linda and she was Like so I'm calling you from my

mother's couch she's like girl we're all broke it's the recession and I started laughing and she started laughing and it was like the first laugh I had in a long time but she was like have you called any of our other friends like literally Tiffany we are all broke everyone lost their job everyone's losing their homes like you're actually not special I mean it's sad but you know join the club basically I wish you had been in my uh circle of friends then because I needed somebody to tell me that as you know we were

about to lose the house and it's hard like really hard cuz you think you're the only one yeah I mean the recession isn't your fault losing your job isn't your fault the fact that you were targeted by something someone who had the intention of scamming you that's not your fault and yet you tend to say to yourself I did this yes so what did you Do so what one I realized that so Linda allowed me to shed some of the shame yes and shame Shields Solutions it was like say that again I love that shame

I realized Shields Solutions and when I was deep in the shame I couldn't see all the lessons that I did know I Tiff you've always been a great budgeter you've always been a great saver you've always been a little side Hustler those parts of you are still there you've you can't see them because you're so steeped In this shame and shame honestly loves it when you're by yourself shame is like don't tell anybody it's just me and you like stay here with me the only way to really to ban a shame I realized was to

give voice to it was to say I did a thing and shame was like damn cuz once she tells someone then she's going to realize she's not the only one yes and then we're not the only one here and then I have to leave and so once I told Linda and Linda's reaction was like is That it then I told someone else and they were like okay and then I realized like oh I'm really not the only one and that what I'm going through can actually be helpful to other people because I'm not coming to

them as like poana perfect right because they're like me too so we're just all Whispering me too before you know the whisperers are loud and we're all like me too now let's get to work yes and so what I did first and foremost is like I said I I took all my Credit cards and put it on a balance transfer card thankfully before the foreclosure and things hit and my credit score would not allow me to do that okay that was one two I was like I cannot live here with my parents I mean I

need like to go so I then traded my parents house for my sister's um couch you know which I know everyone is not able to do you know but I was fortunate enough to be able to sleep on her couch um for a while and I started to look for Side hustles that were aligned with either my degree or what I had already been employed as you know yeah because at the time when you get let go as a teacher right before the new school year it's not like a ton of teaching jobs lined up

yeah cuz they have to have a teacher in the classroom already yes so it's not like oh you know like I'm an engineer and engineering jobs are always open I wasn't sure if I was going to go back to the classroom but in the Meantime I'm like I can tutor I can babysit and so I did a lot of that to try to get a little money together and I did something where I had to give my permission to myself that not everyone's going to be paid Tiffany cuz you don't have it and so I

had to make a list which I call my money list of all of my expenses and look at them and say of this money list which one are your health and safety bills meaning the bills that you have to pay to maintain Your health and your safety and I was like Verizon it ain't you girl it's that you but it's like like I have asthma I was like you're going to need that pump yes yes and things that I must have and so everyone else I was scared but when you have like I always tell

people get yourself a Linda so Linda used to sit next to me on the couch and we would open up mail together and so sometimes I'd be like especially if you get like a um a pink or red envelope you Know it's like so then I wouldn't open I would slide it to Linda and she would open it and she would read it out loud she'd be like okay this one says oh this one's not so bad you oh I understand there's some interesting research about how simply looking at money can change you yeah uh

this this's sort of interesting evidence that it can do lots of different things so one thing it seems to do is it makes you a little bit more independent makes you feel a Little bit stronger and reminds you of resources and having more of things um the other thing it can do is though it makes you a little bit less um helpful towards other people makes you a little bit less generous makes you a little bit more independent yeah so there's some research where if you show people money or you show them you know dollar

bills or things like that and then you have a task where they have to be helpful they're going to be a little bit less Helpful if they've just seen money than if they haven't and I think that's because one thing you get from money is you can be you can stand alone a little bit more you don't need other people quite as much that's at least the theory and so it makes you more independent and less communal minded and it might make you a little bit less generous well Dr maybe that's why I'm such a

generous person because I never have cash in my wallet there you go it's all about the Credit cards so are do you have favorite tweaks based on the research that you either recommend or use in your own life that help cue you to be your best or to make Behavior change stick yeah I've talked about the one the biggest one six years ago I left New York City with my wife and two kids and we moved to a town where it was natural and beautiful and we could go less than a mile in any direction

and we would have either a beach or we would have a forest or we'd Have something where is this shangrilla you still work in New York the shanga is in Connecticut just outside yeah so it's it's beautiful and and it means that on any day I can drive for 10 minutes or even walk for 10 minutes and be somewhere that does all of this restoring so I think being around nature for me is a huge one different people have different things that matter to them that was very important to me it also it drew me

back back to my Childhood because being growing up in First South Africa and then Australia natural environments and especially the beach in Australia was a big part of what I was used to and I missed that yeah and so being near near a beach the sand and the water was really important to me so I think picking the location that that does the best for you most of the time is really important that it's worth sometimes sacrificing other things for and that's something that I've Always I've always followed you know that makes a lot of

sense I remember this was decades ago but when I had just graduated from law school and I moved to New York City I basically spent all of my puny income so I could live walking distance to Central Park and so that I could also get to the wests side highway because just being able in the big city to get to some green space was critical and you know you said that thing about it also Has a sort of nostalgia thing of being able to be outside anything about your inside environment like the way that you

think about your workspace or you might think about the kitchen or places where people want to be primed or prompted to be their best yeah so we mentioned earlier especially if you're in a big city it's useful to have something natural inside that environment it could be hopefully a real plant but if it's not real a fake plant anything that Gives you the sense of that Greenery and that nature maybe even like a little Fountain feature just a little thing that you plug in that maybe has a light and a little bit of running water

even the sound of running water reminds you of all these things and I had the same experience in New York I was always in Central Park or running on the West Side um and so to the extent that you can bring these features into your home there's a there's a huge amount of Benefit to that um I think for me personally and this varies but I think the lack of clutter that you create in a place is really an important um source of well-being uh so for me trying my best and this doesn't always happen

but trying to remove clutter from an environment especially where I'm trying to think is really important I think that's a really good way to think about doing your best work in general that having blankness in front of you and Just moving forward and pouring out your ideas is the best way to go without being infringed upon by other things that are in the environment around you why does lots of stuff around the environment where you're trying to work or Focus impact your ability to do your best thinking well every single thing even if it's in

a small way is distracting everything draws you out of the Here and Now some things more than others a smartphone massively Distracting for all sorts of reasons that are obvious even other objects like if you have a momento that's in view that's really nice a picture of a loved one that's really nice but of course if you stare at it it's going to take you out of the her and now that doesn't mean you shouldn't have photos of loved ones on your desk but you should at least recognize that if there are a thousand different

nice momentos around you the Clutter of that while it's lovely and it Brings back good memories that's probably not the time and place to do it so having having Clarity in front of you as you work I think is a really important driver of of good ideas and creativity in general I I'm sitting here thinking about my workspace at my home and it is knickknack attack like everywhere like little stuff that I really love and means a lot to me and I can tell you this is probably an indication of just How distracted I am

because I could go look at my computer and I've got like four little mason jars with all like the pens in one and sharpies in another and pencils and then I got a photo of my uh mom and my grandmother at the I and then I've got a little Compass my parents sent me and then I've got a mug that Chris gave me and then I I mean it just it's like a little zoo of objects if it makes you feel great though so I know that it does I just feel like holy cow Even

though I'm not staring at all this stuff you're saying that subconsciously your mind is still pulling it in to some extent to some extent it's processing things around you constantly and so to the extent there are things around you all the time you might ignore them consciously right but they're always there they're always the Clutter is always there and on some level even if it's on a small level each little thing is pulling you away in some Small sense and that's the opposite of what you need especially in the world that we live in now

where everything is so distracting we're actually getting 10 minutes of good hard quality work is vanishingly impossible that's it 10 minutes I mean it's very very hard for a lot of people to work if you track them across the day to get 10 15 20 minute bursts of good hard work it's tough for a lot of us especially if your phone is nearby if your your computer's dinging You with emails and things like that it's it's really hard to do the same task for 20 minutes in a row I started with coaching maybe 10 years

ago but I've never made I lack confidence in myself or what I was selling and so I never made any money coaching you know I just kept going to to uh groups and like Bryan and some of those others and I just kept going think was going to happen well about the first of the year I just I had a really um I I was Introduced to grief for the first time okay and I just said grief is wonderful about eliminating all the chatter around you so I just said okay I'm stopping everything so I

quit every program I was in I sat down and I say okay what do I like about my life well I have a podcast I've had it for eight years and it's always been about Women in Transition and it's called Second Wind with Joyce so I love doing that so my natural Inclination is to go into speaking because I like being being in front of audience telling the story but my audience is still about the transformation but because I have continued to age so has my group that I want to support and I see this

group of 50s 60s that go through re-evaluating who they are finding their identity they've never found their identity because they inherited it and now they're faced with What do I do now I've lost my partner I've lost who am I so is that what happened to you no I divorced in my when I was 50 and who did you lose recently uh my ex-husband and my sister okay so [Music] um so anyway okay hun how do I make a business I don't get the sense that you want to be doing This I get the just

hear me out yep I get the sense that you feel like you should and what I want you to really just hang with me for a second yep I love personal development if I didn't have a business around personal development I would just constantly go to seminars and I'd listen to podcasts and I would consume it because I love it it makes me feel human it Makes me feel connected to other people it makes me in moments feel in touch with something larger in life and there's something that is bigger than a podcast or coaching

or speaking and there's more of a um I just get the sense with you that there's more of a calling and that's why it's not turning Into a business there is a desire to serve there's a desire to support there's a desire to connect and what is coming up for me maybe it's because my husband is going through this training but he's going through the training to be a death Dueler and and I don't know if that's what you would would do but there's something like to me you love the podcast the Most what do

you love about it interaction with people sharing the story their stories are all about how they life is better after the trauma because of the trauma mhm and so I like sharing that message I I feel I don't know what are what's your reaction to what I'm saying um yeah I I agree with some of it you know I agree that I have a bigger Purpose and I've started writing because somebody said to me you're grieving why don't you write and I went duh you know it had to come from outside of me so I

started writing I'm enjoying that very much so he went okay do you have to make money you know be honest no okay now we're getting somewhere but let me tell you this I've always from childhood money is a measurement to me of what Making money that of what what is what is money a measurement of success [ __ ] well it's for me it's my belief I think you need to change your belief well maybe I'll tell you why I'll tell you why because you have not you say you value it and yet your actions

don't tell me that you do your actions tell me that you value connection and you can you value purpose and you value making a difference right I think somebody else made you feel like it didn't it wasn't successful or what you doing what you're doing is not helpful or big enough if there isn't money attached to it that's probably true that's 100% true I'm look I'm not saying it's not fun to have money and I'm not saying it's not fun to make money I love making money I love building [ __ ] I love like

I like love all that stuff but I will never be able to coach You in how to make money if in your heart you actually don't care about it and I don't think you do I think that somewhere back in history you got it in your head that you're only successful if you're making money and that's horseshit you're successful if you are happy with who you are and if you are happy with the life that you're living that is what success is if you Get to spend your days on a podcast talking to people making

a difference you are a very successful person particularly if you don't have to worry about whether or not it makes money and so what I want you to do is I want you to go to work on dismantling this notion of what a successful life looks like and what your worth is y you are wildly successful Tell me why that's true because I make a difference [ __ ] yes that's right Joyce that's right you focus on that and you show up and you show up with that energy on that podcast and you show up

with that energy with the women you're talking to and trust me if money is supposed to fall out of the sky it will land in your lap there is a reason why you haven't done it because deep in your soul you Know that's not what matters you know what matters is what you're already doing and I want you to launch yourself into a new ch where you honor that and where you truly celebrate the fact that every day you you have been we have been given the gift of Joyce Joyce has the ability to wake

up every [ __ ] day and make a difference in someone's Life Joyce has the ability to sit with people that are grieving and help them understand that grief is so important because actually what you're present to is the love that you feel and Joyce has the ability to get people to talk about their trauma and that's helping everybody that is such a beautiful thing Joyce it is a gift that we have all been given that you can do that thank You what are you getting from this well tears I always have tears um I'm

just getting more permission just to sit back and enjoy life yes stay out of my head probably yeah you deserve to enjoy your life I'm trying to learn that lesson too and you know suffering can become a habit and it would be really wonderful if you could lead by Example and enjoy yourself yeah beautiful job Joyce beautiful beautiful beautiful so what is the one thing that you've stopped doing that you know you need to start doing taking steps toward learning a little bit more about my goals and finding a mentor okay and what is the

goal that you're working on or the dream Financial Freedom okay I I want to I'm 50 years old I have you know a mortgage for kids to get through college 15 to 23 10 years From now I I Want to Be Free of that so I want to make as much as I can in the next 10 years right A lot of times particularly around financial goals we spend all of our energy thinking and working towards making more and you also have to look at what you got to stop doing so where are you spending

money where are you being stupid with money where are you I'm speaking to myself specifically you know where are you doing things that are not aligned with That goal so it's both what do I need to start and what do I need to stop so i' also look at what you need to stop doing um the other piece of this is that one of the coolest things that you can do if you're trying to just create a little bit of momentum is always go back to your morning routine I cannot tell you how important how

just of a Cornerstone foundational habit this is if you ever feel like you're losing momentum if you ever feel like you're off track if you Ever feel lost overwhelmed go back to your morning routine I believe that how you start your day dictates how the day goes and the morning is the only time of the day the only time that I can guarantee that you can have a little bit of control I cannot guarantee that people aren't going to call you or it's not going to break or there isn't an emergency at work or someone's

not going to get sick but I can guarantee you if you set that alarm early enough and if You wake up when that alarm rings and if you have a morning routine that works for you that is where you can find 15 minutes a day because you can bake it into that schedule to be able to inch forward every day and look you know the the email that you're talking about needing to write you might write that one morning but not send it that's okay the next morning in those 15 minutes you might figure out

all the people that you're going going to send it to fine The next morning you're going to hit send and then yourself you know like cuz you get it like so that is foundationally for me if I get overwhelmed if I get out of whack which I do all the time I go back to the morning routine and what I see is that's the piece that dropped out and you know I also cannot uh emphasize enough how important sleep is seriously you want to make a lot of money you want to be financially free you

want to be more Present seriously look at how much sleep you're getting the more successful I become the more boring I am in life because I prioritize being rested when I wake up and I prioritize the morning because my days are so chaotic and when I lose those foundational things the wheels come off what is it about quitting your job that scares you I'm an organized like planed person and I've been in my corporate job for 6 years love it but it's not my passion okay I've been with the USANA business for 3 years okay

but finally pursued my long 7-year dream of becoming a personal trainer okay so now I'm trainer have you I want to do Health Fitness and change lives fantastic so here's my take on quitting jobs I want to be clear about the research because I know a lot of you feel a ton of pressure to quit quit quit quit quit quit quit quit quit so the research shows very specifically that people that keep jobs that they hate While they build up a business to a point where it is responsible to step into it fail 33% less

of the time than people that just quit cuz they're sick of it because what happens when you quit too soon is you put too much pressure on your dreams and on the new business and then self-doubt and overwhelm and the realities of what you have to be responsible for kick in and particularly for those of you with a family with people that you're taking care of with Obligations you need to be responsible do not use being responsible as a shield for hiding that you're a chicken when you're ready cuz you know when you're ready and

my formula is this if you generate enough money two or 3 months in a row to pay your bills you've demonstrated that this isn't luck and you're ready to go go as long as it's financially responsible so that's my opinion again everything that I say is my theory it doesn't mean it's right you Have to take whatever people are telling you and calibrate it against what's right for you because when I walk out of here and Ally walks out of here she's going to go live her life and I'm not going to be there except

for on YouTube with her okay she's got to own the decision so it's clear that you want to do this the question is is this a question of being responsible and doing the math and the calculations or is this a question of you're just scared to make The change I'm definitely scared okay because I want to be responsible and I've looked at some of my best friends that have quit and pursued their passions and because they've opened the space of having time yeah they've tripled their income correct and doing what they love so can you

make enough money to pay your bills and have you done it consistently for a couple months no okay how much longer it going to take you well I've been thinking that I need To give myself a timeline to have like fire under my ass so look she's a very organized person I am not a timeline would not work for me I am more of a I need to build up an emergency and then be left with no choice okay but if a timeline works for you you need to create a timeline so let's pick a

date right now that is responsible I I think that if you put your head down and you did this in the next 3 months you could create enough Income to prove to yourself that you could do this you're going to work yourself into the ground you're going to be doing the hustle at night and working during the day and you're going to be exhausted and then you're going to make it happen but I think for your personality let's pick a date right now go 5 4 3 2 1 let's go what are you waiting for

I'm for so am I What's the date today I don't know 17 August 17 how much money do you need to quit how much money do you need to make in one month in order to say I can do this I haven't done that yet and I feel like I need to do that say it right now how much money do you need to make in one month to say to yourself I can pay my bills pick a number don't make it too big you can kill going to Starbucks for a month we can ratchet

things down for a little bit no lash extension no Lash extensions jeez Lise let's go hold on are your dreams more important than lash extensions yeah okay don't you have a friend that's training that can do the fills for cheaper or something you I'm going to have to add one to okay yes let's go with 25,000 a month yeah is what you need what the hell kind of Life do you live I want no no no no no no no no no how much money do you need to pay Your bills you're not going to

replace your corporate income overnight and you're not going to do it while you are trying to personal train and do USANA and based on the fact that you can afford lash extensions and based on that gorgeous ring you're wearing your lifestyle is more expensive and more important to you than this dream right now so let's get real how much money do you actually need to pay your bills not for the fancy stuff $33,000 boom how Fast could you do that tomorrow correct yes so this is actually the the fact like I love how honest you

are so thank you I love you okay all my new friend yes who can relate to her by the way who can relate to her you are so right because you know intellectually that the second that you quit you open up all this time and all this energy and all this passion and you're going to Triple 10x and all the things that everybody says it's going to happen but first you Have to get real with the fact that your dreams are more important than holding on to the luxury of the lifestyle momentarily make sense yes

got it secondly when you put a number down like three grand which isn't a small amount of money but you can make that happen for sure now it becomes obtainable and you've just given yourself permission and a road map to quit now let's go back to your original question which is the date oh God I love you you're so Smart okay I'm think I mean I'm going on my honeymoon in September so I want to definitely utilize the vacation time yes of course why would that would be stupid not to have Thanksgiving so I'm going

to I'm really thinking December 1st I'm really thinking that you're giving notice when you get back from Thanksgiving right let's move it up a little and make her uncomfortable yeah okay okay okay so what I want my request Is that you uh put something on social media the day after Thanksgiving announcing that you uh have started your uh new personal training business in the next chapter of your life and I want you to tag me okay and we will cheer for you online I'll give me a hug hey it's Mel thank you so much for

being here if you enjoyed that video by God please subscribe because I don't want you to miss a thing thank you so much for being here we've got so much Amazing stuff coming thank you so much for sending this stuff to your friends and your family I love you we create these videos for you so make sure you subscribe m