what's the least favorite season that we as Believers experience without a doubt I would say it's a Wilderness season the Bible says that Jesus was led by the spirit of God Into the Wilderness for 40 days now what is the Wilderness if this is your winter season this is your Wilderness season don't see it as you've been put on the Shelf don't see it as God rejecting you don't see it as God ignoring you it's actually God preparing you and I have found in my hardest seasons of Life what you would call A wilderness I
have put my head down and found God to be the most faithful when you are going through that that season of hardship you can look at it one of two ways God's abandoned me my friends have abandoned me you can get bitter you can get upset and that's exactly what Israel did [Music] or hey everybody Welcome to conversations I'm John bav joined by Lisa Lisa it's great great to see you it's good to see you you look actually really cute today very studious today thank you thank you I feel studious do you yeah I do
I feel very intelligent you know I'm really excited about what we're going to share about today we're going to be talking about times and Seasons yes yes and one of my favorite scriptures Lisa is Ecclesiastes 31 that says for everything there is a season and a time for every matter in heaven now that's a different translation yeah I like the purpose I like the word purpose so there's a season a time and a purpose and a purpose there's a purpose yeah one of the translations says it it brings that word purpose in and that's exactly
what seasons are for for purposes right right now it is cold here in Franklin Tennessee yeah which means we are in a season of winter yes that you wouldn't want the purpose would not this the purpose of this season of winter is to actually put things in the ground deeper like plants that are not that are not annuals things that are perennial their roots go deeper in the season of winter because they're I don't know if they're running from the cold or they're deep diving for the nutrients you want to hear a a really cool
story I do a pastor friend of mine he um their water just shut off in their house and he was like what's going on so I mean water company everything and they can't figure it out so finally this guy comes out and he had seen it before he found out that they were in such a drought a season of drought the one of the big trees in their yard the root system bored through the PVC piping yeah to get water for the tree wow and so adversity causes us to push our Roots down further it's
should it should it should it it should should and so you know I actually just want to address like if you're in a season right now and you're like hey I do not like this season listen don't miss the purpose of your season I love that God has a purpose with every single season what's your favorite season my favorite season is fall yeah and my favorite season is fall as well Autumn and we got married October 2nd because we love that that in between it's not it's not summer it's not winter yet it's in between
you can feel the briskness in the air at night but you still see the things changing and and we just loved I mean we lived in Colorado for so long we loved it when the Aspen would begin to changed and in Colorado that was like two days but and then snowstorm would come but we loved when all of the trees just were like on fire with all of these different colors but there is strength in every single season yes if you recognize the season you're in and too many people you're not recognizing your season and
so you're missing out on your strength so purposes season timing the right thing in the wrong season is the wrong thing well you know I look at First Chronicles I love this actually I'm writing right now and I just spent an entire chapter on this guys John is writing another book another book uh 1st Chronicles 12:32 and it says the sons of issachar who had understanding of the times to know what Israel ought to do yeah so consider this you live in Edmonton Edmonton uh can are you just trying to think of the coldest place
ever am we've been there I'm going to the center of Canada where you don't have oceans warming it Edmonton Canada right or Saskatoon Canada Saskatoon saskat both of us have been there can you imagine it's the middle of January and you work on outdoor Parks right and you dress up for work that day and you put on a pair of board shorts flipflops and a t-shirt what is going to happen you're going to have some damage because you did the wrong thing in the in in that season and when we do the wrong things in
a season then we pay for it there's consequences for it so you can fight against the season or you can cooperate with the season yeah you know I love what it says in Luke 12: 54-56 and this is going to be the message it says then he turned to the crowd and who he is Jesus Jesus is addressing the crowd when you see clouds coming in from the West you say storm's coming and you're right and when the wind comes out of the South you say this will be a hot one and you're right then
he says frauds you know how to tell a chain change in the weather so don't tell me you can't tell a change in the season the God's season we're in right now and you know we've been saying this John I've been having these conversations uh at our dinner table in just our private time together we feel there is such a shifting in the seasons that we have a sense that there is a conflict in the atmosphere you know that that God is like he's poised and there's something that he's waiting for his people to do
and that we need to be aware of what is God saying in this season yes not what he said in last season so what what what we do like you said you don't do flip-flops in Saskatoon Saskatchewan in the winter but you can do that you can do that in July but you don't do it in January and so when you try to actually outfit yourself or walk the way that you walked in one season you're going to actually suffer loss in this season and so many people are living in a past season hey everybody
we'll get back to this episode in just a moment but first we want to thank all the patrons who make this podcast available if conversations podcast has strengthened you we would love it if you would consider becoming a patron today listen your monthly contribution helps us reach more people with crucial conversations plus you will get some great Insider perks including live q&as with us each quarter and as well as other exclusive content so to join the patrons team just click support this podcast in the show's description now let's get back to the program you know
uh let's just talk about my least favorite season which is winter yeah we do know that so I'm asking myself being cold what's the least favorite season that we as Believers experience without a doubt I would say it's a Wilder wildness season and does God bring us into Wilderness Seasons without a doubt Lisa I mean God is the one that led Israel into the desert now his will for was was for them to be there one year I was astonished when I saw this one day I think it was in the book of numbers or
or or Exodus he only wanted them to to be there one year because he sent the spies out the spies go out or the excuse me the leaders sent the spies out one year after they' come out and that's when they made the big mistake so they extended their winter to 40 years wow whereas only you're saying they didn't have to be that long they didn't have to be you could you can lengthen this season but you sure can't shorten it because God Almighty is the one that sent them out there if you look at
Joseph Joseph didn't do much of anything wrong but he goes into slavery he goes to a dungeon you look at David David is the Kings Bearer God says you're going to be anointed you're going to be my servant you're going to be the next king of Israel Saul takes him under his wings makes him his armor Berry he's eating at the table with the sons of the king but the next thing he knows he's having to live in deserts for 12 years that was something that actually God permitted and if you look at Jesus I
think this the one that's just absolutely the most clearcut the Bible says that Jesus was led by the spirit of God Into the Wilderness for 40 days now what is the Wilderness okay the children of Israel didn't cooperate with the season extended at 39 extra years so 40 times more than what God originally intended them to be in because of their behavior they acted incorrectly in that season so what I want to help people with is if this is your winter season this is your Wilderness season don't see it as you've been put on the
Shelf don't see it as God rejecting you don't see it as God ignoring you it's actually God preparing you yeah and I've had some people that reached out to me recently and you know there's so many and this is crazy there are so many young women and young men who are single and they're like I I am so I'm so tired of being single I want to be married how long is this season going to happen and um again I don't I don't know how long that season is going to last but what I would
say and maybe maybe it's forever maybe you you'll get married maybe you won't but what I would say is don't miss the fruit of that season don't miss what you can do in that season and I remember John we had moved to Colorado this was a long time ago we would have I would have been just getting ready to turn 40 and and I remember meeting some amazing women and being so excited about having these friendships and and then God saying to me I need you to to separate and I was like no no no
no no you don't mean that like I'll just navigate this I I can do this and he's like Lisa I need you to separate I'm like no no I'm always alone and he said you can make a choice whether this is a season of lonely or a season of alone you can make a choice whether I'm inviting you to be with me or you can be sad because you are not with them and I have found in my hardest seasons of Life what you would call A wilderness I have put my head down and found
God to be the most faithful when I felt rejected isolated afraid when I had to go deep and again we're talking about a winter season because we're in Winter right now and in a winter season you know like you go out there and you look at trees and it's hard to know whether they're alive or they're dead because they don't have leaves they don't have fruit but if you go out to a tree and you push on the branch if it's flexible in the season of witer winter it's alive it's going to be alive in
the season of spring but if it's brittle SN and it snaps it's not going to make it and I don't want to see you brittle I don't want to see you angry I don't want to see you yeah stiff neck I don't want to see you offended and find yourself broken because of disappointment in this season and losing fruitfulness in the next season now God will bring it back around again but I believe that God is saying I want to distinguish my people in this season those that pursue God and those that don't so I
want to say there's seasons for a lot of things um there's seasons for friendships there's seasons for positions that we hold ministries seasons of parenting seasons of marriage what season are we in right now we I don't know how to label it summer I think it's summer I'm saying it's Ms season I think it's beautiful fall or summer stop nonstop we're always cuz I get her all to myself um but anyway no um we don't need date nights we are date nights every every night quite a b every night's a date night Lisa you know
I remember I had um a couple people that were very very close and God really used these two people to disciple me and I'm going Way Back 40 years ago and one of them was you know I remember he was best man in our wedding he's still a good friend today but I remember when he made the decision to move and we were in the car together and I started weeping uncontrollably I I was embarrassed almost and I said I'm I'm just so sorry but I knew why were you sorry I said I'm so sorry
I'm crying I said I I I I know I'm probably making you a little uncomfortable he said no no you're not and I knew I I didn't I couldn't say it I couldn't say it to him but I knew our season of real being very very very close in close proximity praying together talking to the word about the word of God to each other was was coming to a close and I was just getting ready to marry you you uh he was just getting married and I I I realized this was a great season but
I can't force this anymore and then there was another guy that I'm like trying to think of who you're talking about but that's okay that's okay you it was another guy we pray together three times a week we would meet me at work an hour and a half beforehand and he was my very best friend and I remember the day I will never forget I was in Houston's airport and I was watching a jet because I had to walk from one ter to the other and the Holy Spirit said I'm going to take him from
your life for a season I was like oh my gosh and it was you know I look back okay cuz this is like 35 years ago I looked back and I had depended a lot on him for my growth MH and now I look back and I realized God was saying I need you to grow with me just like you just said you can make this lonely or you can make this alone with God and I realized I had leaned so heavily on him for my spiritual growth God was pulling me away so I personally
could grow in my relationship with the Lord didn't understand that season yeah at at the beginning I look back now it's so clear yeah so a lot of times hindsight when we look back we realize yeah okay God was really doing something significant important and so what I find is don't fight against it is is the thing you know I I I kept trying to keep that relationship close and it got really awkward I remember got awkward it did yeah because it's like you're you have a season that was a summer season and you find
yourself in a winter life you're walking around flipflops in a relationship where you should be wearing hiking boots yeah you know um the other thing is when you plant in the wrong season it's not going to make it like you know okay so we're we're in Nashville T well Franklin and we did a garden this time which we've never really done Gardens successfully and um there's certain plants though that now that we're in Winter they're still growing they are plants that are actually attached to a colder season and they were dying in the summer in
yes they our heat is so strong they did not like the heat they did not like the humidity they are loving the little bit of chill and like our Swiss chart it is just exploding out there but the Basil's gone the basil is like said I'm sorry y'all you're going to have to you're going to have to rely on the parsley and you're going to have to rely on the oregano I am exiting until the springtime and and the beautiful thing is when the basil exited it left seed and I don't know if you remember
we started finding all these seeds in the soil where I didn't even have to go and buy another basil plant I had the seeds everywhere and that is what happens in a winter season things go to seed but seed has so much potential and life in it and too many things that God wants to plant in your life you're uprooting before it the seed is formed and and you know I remember still I always think of this when I think of seasons do you remember you were out praying and this was I think we had
two kids maybe at the time and you were in that Wilderness season and I mean it was just like every single day we were like God speak to us God tell us we you know just crying out in this incredibly dry time and you saw a field can you talk about that I'll never forget it actually we weren't quite yet in the wilderness um there was a field we thought we were no we thought we were in this field was it was quite remarkable it had Short Grass then it was nothing but dirt and then
it had this beautiful beautiful tall grass right and uh the Lord said this is symbolic of what I'm about to bring you and Lisa through he said there's going to be a time in which you've borne fruit and then you're going to go through a very very dry time and he said when you come out of that dry time you're going to Bear much fruit and I said we're at the end of the dirt right cuz I think I'm in the wilderness already I said we're at the end of the dirt and we're getting ready
to come in the call The Tall Grass Holy Spirit said no son you're at the end of the short grass and I was like like why why do you why do you tell me these things I know I came home and told you that I never forget I remember the expression on your face wasn't very happy and um boy did we go into a Wilderness season a season in which people there was a my boss was trying to destroy my life yeah he he literally was and I it was the hardest 18 months I think
one of the hardest 18 months we've lived through as a couple and we we probably would think it was easy now compared to what we go through now two entire books came out of that season that have helped millions of people and I look at those difficult seasons of my life and your life I'm just going to speak for both of us and out of those difficult Seasons more people have been ministered to through those than are great Seasons yeah and so when you are going through that that season of hardship of wilderness where it
seems everything's dry by you can you can look at it one of two ways God's abandoned me my friends have abandoned me you can get bitter you can get upset and that's exactly what Israel did they got offended and so when you get offended your behavior is going to always be counterproductive or you can look at that season as this is a preparation time because Jesus made a statement and the Holy Spirit just brought it up as you were speaking he said you are the branches I'm the vine right and he said bye to me
and let my words Abid in you and he said the branches that bear fruit the branches that bear fruit we're not talking about the bad branches that need to be broken off and thrown into the fire the branches that bear fruit he said he'll prune now pruning is when you cut off branches that used to produce fruit they they produce fruit they didn't do anything wrong but they're cut off yeah because it's going to produce more fruit so what you're looking at is this has been working this has been bearing fruit this has been so
good and then all of a sudden God just comes clip yeah and all of a sudden now these new shoots start coming out well there's an in between you just lost your branches where you expect that fruit to be and now there's a new shoot coming out and you don't even see anything on that new shoot after a season now you start getting twice as much fruit three times as much fruit so that's the way you've got to look at your dry season yeah and I want to say something I as you were talking John
I just felt this so strong as a message for people God is doing a new thing thing and when God does a new thing it's always easier to do the old thing it's always easier to do what you already know what is familiar and what worked in last season Ministry wise yeah business-wise governmental wise polit politics wise it's not going to work in the season you got to know that God is doing a new thing and you don't discover the new thing by looking at what people are saying you discover the new thing by getting
into scripture and seeing what God is saying you discover the new thing by actually really saying God I want you to prune me and pruning is embarrassing pruning is like standing out naked and uncomfortable but I would rather be pruned of last year's whatever comfortable so that I can be fruitful in this year and I think I think people I've hear this from so many people that God is it's like they have a sense like we just in the body of Christ God is like shaking everything and that's a form of pruning when God shakes
things things get Harvest and things that are dead get removed and God is shaking us individually he's shaking families he's shaking organizations he's shaking the Nations he's shaking the government and he's asking us to cooperate with him and one of the things when you said if you abide in me and my word abide abides in you the word abide actually means endure so we need to endure a hard season so that we can move into a different season and I I hope you heard that John said most of our growth in our marriage in our
family ministry whatever most of our growth has happened in a hard season not in in a easy season you know John when we lived in Colorado I would try to grow the things that grow super easily here yeah um I would buy bulbs bulb plants from Home Depot and I would put them in a refrigerator drawer my boy's like what is this this is like a molded thing in our T can we eat this m don't touch it anyway and I would put it in the refrigerator to create a artificial season and then when it
was still 3 ft of snow outside I'd put them in in my laundry room window and I would trick them into thinking it was spring the sun would be coming and it was a process called forcing them and I I and I'm just going to say this I've said this before God has a way of creating seasons in your life to force what is good up and force you to deal with the things that you refuse to deal with in the last season whenever he brings up something that is maybe abort or embarrassing or disgusting
to you it's actually the mercy of God saying can we deal with this can we deal with this so this doesn't continue to you in the next season you know I was thinking John um today I was just on a phone call with somebody and thinking about how it said in time p p God winked at our ignorance but now he commands He commands he's not like hey maybe you guys might want to think about this commands us to repent commands us to repent which is a change in the way we think which is a
changing and walking into that new season where there is humility and dependence on God yes well you know this has been so fruitful I I really believe a lot of you are gleaning such understanding just remember the sons of isachar had understanding of the seasons to know what Israel ought to do what we want to do is leave you with a prayer we want to pray for you that you would know what to do in this season you're in right now so heavenly father I pray for every single one that's listening Lisa and I pray
for them yes that Lord Not only would they recognize the season they are in and the season the body of Christ is in but they would know what to do in that season that Lord God their behavior would line up with the will of God so that they can flourish as that Springtime comes back in or the next season comes back in we ask this in Jesus mighty name and we thank you for it amen amen all right so until the next podcast this has been conversations with John and Lis and before we sign off
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