Behind the Scenes of 'The Chosen' with Art Director Jeff Staebler

Roll [Music] camera marker and action this podcast is being recorded at the motion picture Institute the oldest film School in Michigan training the next generation of filmmakers today check out the website motionpicturehd an independent film contractor you've done some indie work you've done some big Feature work but You also found yourself in a very wonderful position as the art director for all four seasons of the hit TV show The Chosen y so without further Ado guys we're going to do a little career Deep dive um let's talk Motion Picture Jeff thank you for being here

sir thank you so I guess let's start off simple what is art Direction can you define that for us wow art Direction okay well I mean it really depends on the circumstance he said age old um it's broad it is Broad It depends you know and that's what I'm I want to say like every time I hear somebody like on your previous podcast you had Brandon talking about the different roles of production designer and and our director and and I'm just like yeah you know it depends it depends on the size of the show um

if it's studio if it's independent if it's TV if it's you know talking about the students that are coming right out of MPI and in independent film world that they would Jump into you know that that's going to be completely different the art director could be it you know and they've got to do everything you know so the production designer that I've been working with James Cunningham's super amazing and I've been working with him for well since 2017 and we had um a way of doing work you know so I would do everything and anything

in my power to make his life as easy as possible I mean then that's Pretty much the objective is to make sure that that production designer has all the time that he possibly can to do the things that he does best so so peel that away from me what does that involve like what's your daily tasks oh well I mean right at the beginning so it's like we'd go through phases and so um like season one was a little bit different than season two and a little bit different than season 3 because of just the

growth and the the way that we grew As a as a company and so at the very beginning you know came in and it was you know we we had a lot of pressure so we're trying to make something amazing you know with um with a little bit of money at first from just the fans and so we tried to make every dime count and try and you know make the best of what we could and we didn't have a lot of time because we they couldn't afford to to bring on people to you know

spend a year in pre-production to build all These things before we started filming you know we had three weeks to develop um all the sets for the entire season and and then from there we had to find the locations for all of them and then we've got to go and determine all of the different uh set dressing and everything that needed to be done or obtained for that so I mean there was so many things what I was mostly responsible for were doing all the set designs and the sketches for everything that was being Built

and get that to the construction Department as quick as possible and at first it was like whatever I could do to get something to them quickly and it's a 3D sketch a rendering um quick drawings whatever it might be I mean we started out almost like napkin drawings and then kept growing and growing and we have more complicated drawings more complicated drawings until in season four just now we had set designers from La we had you know construction guy we Had multiple Crews going you know so the art Department The Chosen is huge is the

biggest crew on set and so we've got so many people that need to understand what that expectation is what is the goal you know so we're we're pressed for time and we have to reach the the goal for each episode one you know and in season one I didn't start until episode five so I was there five six seven and eight in season one and then and because when they first started filming they filmed season one In a part one and a part two so I came on in the part two section of season one

and finished all I made I made it on the TV show so um I'm in one of the episodes I'm going to have to figure it out Cameo yeah a little Cameo um one day I'm I'm just looking at my phone and Dallas texted me he said hey you look you made the show so I was in the Final Cut and they can see one of the workers crossing the path in the background it's ridiculous um but I was there and um so Anyways I I bet I could spot you at that iconic scoff yeah

you know and it was funny because like this is my first time time in Texas you know in I think it was July August super freaking hot you know so I was like not real comfortable with you know how I'm supposed to be dressed and everything so one one of the set the set decorator I believe is one came up and said that I looked like a zookeeper you know and so I had the shoes and you know the the hat and that's what is Actually on the TV show so um but funny any so

in season two it just kept getting you know more complicated we had more locations season 2 is when we uh introduced Utah and going there in filming and with that big huge beautiful set you know it was just amazing well that's okay so that's something I want to ask is when you started the show you said episode 6 how far in advance sorry episode five episode five how far in advance did you start designing stuff Well when I landed I mean so it was how much time did you have before that was put onto screen

it would all depend I mean so we're we're trying to see on average we had well over a hundred sets every season so all eight episodes we're shooting all of them and we're not shooting them in order um we're they're trying to they're trying to go episodic with everything and making it easier for um getting through those episodes and then being able to get them to post and Process them and get them off to the the fans but um we end up because of locations and cost and everything having to shoot out of order still

a lot of things and so in Utah we got we were able to access this huge set that was built by the Latter-Day Saints and it's amazing a replica of the temple in Jerusalem you know and the people there are just they're amazing you know and so we had such a great time and so in 2022 we ended up having that whole location As well as Sound Stage and builds outside we were still using a little place in um in Texas to do some of uh the filming where we filmed most most of our stuff

on in the first year but we had outgrown that so just like anything when we first started in season 1 we had this little kind of like a um it was a park it was a Christian park where you could go and um see the ark and all these little things but they also had a little replica of a town in There that looked our you know period and so we used that but we had to you know convert it a million times you know to get through all the different scenes so we had one

area of this little section of town where we converted it to five different sets you know over time it it was five different things and then we moved right on the other side of that building and we used it like three or four different times as different things where were're to building up tearing Down putting something up you know just to get to that next thing so then we had to coordinate all those things in a row so that we knew that we could tear down what was there the outside of zeb's house tear that

all down and then build the wedding in that same exact place but this is all happening during filming so and then you know right next door is the wine press while that wine press is actually being filmed we're like within 20 yards of them building the wedding Walls and the wedding for for season one so cool yeah it's great and you know working on top of each other it's and the goal is really just to get it done you know and and get there and get the best product that we possibly can and so we're

always trying to James and I are trying to set the expectation make sure that we're as clear as we possibly can so that all the artists down the road are have a good idea of what it is that they need to do and then the the freedom And time to be able to make their art come to life you know so we're really trying to pass that opportunity to the next person let them do their best and so you know we're open to their ways of doing things we don't want to micromanage because you know

that we don't have time you know we we have to to get through to the next set we've got to make sure that every single one of the outdoor walking sets are you know groomed and we have locations picked for Them so we spent a lot of time initially in the beginning of every single one of the seasons going around and finding pretty much every single one of the locations and I there was a beautiful thing that uh Dallas trusted James and I to go around and find all these locations and we'd find multiple locations

as well to give them options wait so you were also in charge of finding the locations for the sets you guys would build well I mean with um Because James James and I and this is like wearing wearing many hats you know and so during the growth you know of the chosen we just kept doing some of the things that we initially started out doing you know you know what you're looking for right yeah well I mean that's James you know and James and I are sitting there he has the vision of what it is

he wants for this scene and I'm saying I'll go what about this what about this what about this you know and He's like yeah yeah let's let's do this one let's do this let's offer these you know and so how pull those together and then we'll go on a tech Scout or a location scout and I'll share that information I'll just like okay James thinks this one this one and this one are good for this scene you know so initially I mean I would spend hours reading those scripts and just memorizing them and memorizing the

scene numbers and everything so when I'm out On these things I know exactly where we're at you know I know the scene number and I can can share that information I can share what the scene is about and everything so doing that just made it easier for us in the art Department to make sure we had a little check box there and checked for every single one of the locations for every single one of the scenes for the entire show so that we weren't G to miss anything so we weren't just going to go Like

oh my gosh we forgot about that you know no it's not going to happen because we were on top of it and checked every box you know and so we we also have I mean I can't say every single name for the people that are on the chosen I wish I could um but I love them all they're they're just amazing so like when we were in the first parts of season one and then going into Season Two Season Two we got a prop Master that's just phenomenal and so he's been with them Still with

them I believe to this day and um and it changed you know the the need to really get involved in in any of that became almost non-existent we had time to go focus on the other things a big huge draw on us for these sets that all to get done and well of course production designer he's got other things as well that he needs to do so he's relying on me to get those things done as well and um so wardrobe same thing you know they're phenomenal Amazing group working independent James touch's base with them

to make sure that everything is you know working with the brand of the overall film but I mean liila has got it on lockdown she's amazing and her team is just topnotch is that the Wardrobe person yep yeah so liila has been on a ton of shows and she's just amazing at her job and so there's there's never been a failing you know and the obstacles and the things that have been put in front of her and As well as all the rest of the crew as well but I mean the tasks that have been

put in front of them that wardrobe Department are just amazing that they pulled it off you know so so I guess that so that that opens a whole other bag of worms what is the research like for shlock the chosen wow a lot of research so we're just we're constantly looking at well luckily James my boss has got a degree in history so oh that helps yeah yeah that helps and and he's Very knowledgeable um he's a he's a great Christian and so he knows a lot about uh the Bible he knows a lot about

yeah so that was great I learned a ton from him you know I was the guy coming in so he didn't have as big of a background and he was always open to explaining what is the biggest like historical like shock something that you found out about the period you're like oh my goodness I would have never assumed that oh you know I think it's Just an it's an overall kind of feel for it so you know how like you're young and you're going to Bible school and and you're sitting there and you're kind of

thinking about everything in your head and it's like it seems like it's all kind of black and white you know faded and looks almost archaeological fined you know and so but come to realize you know the biggest thing is James brought color into my imagination for that time you know when that time everything would Have been brand new you know so we're looking at it and there's a little bit of a you know a poll in that we have to make some things look old for for the show to make it feel believable and everything

really old but back then it would have been brand new you know so it look Pol looks too polished you know but still the color would have been there you know and the paintings and all the St cool that's real life you know so you see all the plain sculptures now where They're just they're washed of all their paint but they would have been realistic looking you know so even like clothes right because CL you would assume the clothes to be tattered but they would be mended and yeah I mean it depends on where you're

at if you're you know so we had to take a lot of that into consideration when we were building the town the city um which was in season 3 so when we moved on of season two we we started doing um we did the stuff in Utah and then when we came back to season for season three um that's when Dallas was like we need to find a home you know some place just quick question Who is Dallas Dallas Jenkins he is the creator writer Dallas Jenkins is the creator writer of the and director and

director yeah of the chosen of the Chosen and there's multiple writers um and they're amazing too and it's an opportunity that James and I get to speak with the writers and Dallas and And talk to them about the different scenes and what it is that we're creating so I mean that's so it's awesome we were was talking about the sets and you're were telling me I think it was season 3 you had to build a really big set right so Dallas the Creator and so we um James and I started to develop some drawings for

a permanent set a set that would survive and that um fans could come back and visit after we're all done um there was going to be A whole educational concept to it which still could happen um it's it's a matter of working with the camp which we have Camp hell there amazing place it's a Thousand Acre camp fit um they have uh underprivileged children coming there and they've got uh great camps for them they've got music camps we're going to do a film Camp um this will be our third year I'm involved with that and

um I'm helping direct the film portion of it and we've got uh BJ Foreman awesome he's Our art coordinator in the art department for the chosen but he's also a stage manager in Broadway and he's putting on a uh a nationwide tour of Little Women right now but he'll be back down to the chosen soon um but he helps coordinate all this stuff as well and initially we um we were asked to put together a permanent build and then we put together some options where we could build this on the property um keep in mind

we're already in process of Building a sound stage and out buildings to uh to work with the chosen just for the chosen so the chosen creating their own Studio out too so they're creating a studio simultaneously while we're building a city and filming simultaneously so we've got multiple people who are just spread all over the place um but great things are happening you know and so we got to a point where we had a couple options for the city and we flew to LA to talk To Dallas and Dallas is like okay well I like

it but let's go bigger you know and so we came back redesigned again so I think this was like the fourth redesign in a month and then then they accepted the next version which was a fuller scale City I was say how often does that happen you get tall to go bigger that's pretty cool oh yeah know you know it doesn't happen that often so you gotta love it when it does right so yeah we had the opportunity to Go bigger and um we did we did uh we were limited by the space in which

we could create because there was a fort that was on the property in Camp HBL Hill Fort Tas Fort Tas and um we tore that down and built in the same footprint area that was where we agreed upon it's right on the edge of a little Lake and and it's beautiful right there I think I've I've got some aerial imagery that I can oh yeah we're gonna overlay that for sure okay um we've got There's links you can get from The Chosen they've done uh if you go to the chosen YouTube channel and the fan

pag is there they've got tons of video of you know and all of this will be in the links for anyone listening or watching I'll put all of that in the description so they can go check it out okay perfect and then um they they even have like a fly through of like our Sound Stage and and everything so I mean during the process of like developing this I had to Do renderings and everything I had to sell this you know so James and I are sitting there giving presentations to all the stakeholders this is

what's going to happen this is how big it's going to be you know this is the future uses that we're going to be able to use U this is how many sets we've built into it we've got one side of the road looks this way the other side of the road looks this way there's uh educational elements in there we had um we had a Butcher we had a granery and if like a Roman granery um there was a baker in there so we had the oven and everything really cool looking um see some of

the other ones we had mean just straight up markets and all the vendors and we had a blacksmith and really accurate things too you know so that as you go back through there you can really see see you know what the life of Jesus was like and we had to make the different areas so we had to make the kind of the impoverish Impoverished Jewish area and we had to make the the Roman uh barracks and where the soldiers would be and kind of the Roman side of town and everything so we built all of

that and we did it in a very short period of time so once it was approved we got into I had to get an architect as well because we had to get code and drawings and everything done and we broke ground in uh February and we completed a $4 million City roughly um by July the set cost $4 Million roughly I I'm guessing at some prices but I mean some what I've heard but um but yeah it's it's beautiful you know and it's got a lot of potential use I mean anybody to production and and

you anybody can go shoot there you know I mean eventually when Chen's done with it and everything so um but is it's beautiful um and it's on Camp h so like I said you know what um my dear friend's there Casey bilbury is a great friend and we have great conversations and uh And he is the one that's also helping put this film camp on well I think what's interesting about them building such a big set such an expensive set as well is I'd never considered that but when you know just for anyone listening who

hasn't any idea when they build sets for films or TV shows they either pick a location and decorate the shot that they're going to get not the whole set or they build the shot that they're going to shoot in they build that scene That piece just that piece and this is all to cut down cost but what the chosen did which is really really cool is they said we're going to have a show that's going to come back to locations because we're following the character of Jesus and his life he's going to come back to

certain places it'll be way more beneficial to production so you spend The Upfront cost build the entire village with multiple uses that can be refurbished to look like different Locations and then we can just have that for multiple seasons and cut down cost which is amazing what a great foresight where did that idea come from did you guys pitch that to them I started with Dallas I mean Dallas wanted kind of a home you know and it's really he said we got to find ourselves a home you know and so they looked all over the

place what a wonderful what a wonderful way to phrase that as well yeah yeah so and that's where we got the Sound Stage Started going and then we're like okay well we need to build some sort of a little town you know and it started out small it was only going to be like 100 foot by 100 foot you know now it spans 2 Acres you know so it's like yeah it's it's huge and we've got a mikva we've got a a full um oh what's the word tell Jeff is a synagog a synagogue the

synagogue yeah and I mean I've gone and I've done a Million tours so like I was saying earlier is like uh we had to pitch this stuff you know so we had to make you know renderings of what it is that we wanted to build and then after we were done with that we had we made a uh a miniature model of the whole thing 4 foot by4 foot of the entire city nice and we took that to um the a good nrb uh National Religious broadcast convention that was in Grapevine in Dallas and um

put it up you know tons of fans and Investors and everybody came by and saw the model and everything and then within a month after that we were locking in the contract the final plans and getting ready to go so it was a lot of fun um it was very stressful um I bet it was surreal when they were building it yeah the whole life size it was yeah you know and the whole thing is like um so here enters in I mean again like I want to celebrate the people that are that have been

on the chosen past people that Aren't there anymore that made a big difference that um did amazing work you know and then there's some that are still there you know just still going on so um and me starting like in season two when we just started talking about the the breaking the ground for the Sound Stage and Dallas wanting to find a home and everything we got this ran into this guy John Hart and he started to do a lot of the earth work for us initially getting us just going in the right Direction and

and he does Kingdom work and so he helped us on season two making just for free you know making a field that we used for melik's farm and making the roads with his bobcat for all the walking talks that we did you know so we got the walkin talks and the park and Barks where we you know have to make tents and camps and everything so he helps us with a ton of things and that led into him being the one to general contract the entire city build so and it Was amazing you know and

we brought he brought on a lot of really great people so I mean his crew of mikee and Mike and Sarah were just amazing and then Dan tuman he came from Michigan one of my friends um also one of uh one of the people that started on the chosen back when it was on the farm in Illinois and a pilot for a church you know and he came on he was critical and in making sure that he was there every single day making sure that so the the people um You know like I mentioned Dan

tuman and he worked with the keys in John's group and John had Mike and Greg and Canon and Zach Zach did like every single piece of foam in that whole place I mean coordinated the whole thing you know so and we had foam suppliers you know rock suppliers for how much foam do you guys go through oh cuz that's like all the shaping right that's the pillars the Rocks you know you see it it it's it's foam how much foam how Much styrofoam just fo is styrofoam I have to ask Zach you know and get

a number or something and see if you can recall how much like there's certain paints that eat styrofoam so you guys have to have like a whole set of just stationeries specifically just for decorating foam right well they did it on the Fly I mean you know these guys learned so you had like guys coming in doing veneer Stone on the side of one of these buildings and these guys had just Got done you know doing you know the typical Kroger Lone Star Steakhouse you know very patterned beautiful looking and so the veneer Stone go

up and like the first couple of times we're just like yeah rip it down and don't use a pattern you know this is like we need to make it look bad you know so it's it's hard you're taking professionals that are spend their whole life trying to make something look perfect you know and then You tell them okay you got to make it look bad you know so because we didn't have this wasn't our crew from the show so what we haded to do is this was a whole general contractor and a whole side project

for the chosen to create a location that the chosen was going to go film in so we had this whole unit here that was building and running while I and James were still running the whole show the um the art for That season 3 and so we're running simultaneously with That as well as trying to be on top of that City being built every single day so we were in between running to our sets and everything we had to do for the show as well as throwing on the the the vest and the hard hat

and going to a construction site that was huge I mean there was 200 people on average there every single day and and it was like super hot you know so there's soldiers but the the the light that emanated from these people The just spirit that they had when they were working together on that city was amazing and then that's what I want to share you know so I'm gonna I'm creating a patreon page you can go to my patreon page and I'm going to be talking a lot about these stories I'm going to be talking

a lot about the people that did all of this work you know and um just sharing those beautiful experience es that I had and that'll be linked we'll put the link to that in the podcast Description yep excellent and so um with those guys in that City and you just go over there and there would be circles where they're just they're praying you know so they started out their day day with prayer they they were so excited to be there at the break of dawn just to get started and then stay there until there was

no more light you know and these people were just there was just so much energy on that build that you felt it you got there and you Were just like oh this is this is phenomenal felt important it felt great you know there was a purpose there was people that were brought there from all over the country that it seemed like everything they did in their life led to that moment in time that they could utilize everything that they did in their life at that moment you know Tim he's amazing Carver you know and I

can include some links to his stuff or whatever too is just you know amazing Sculptor and he handcarved so many things these big beautiful wooden horse heads that are in our stables and I mean just an amazing guy and all the doors like every single one of the doors was custom every single one of the windows really was custom yeah um except for the ones we bought and and um James is an amazing purchaser I mean if there's anything he does super super well is that yeah just for anyone listening so who doesn't know that's

a whole separate Department the film just purchasing items good at it you know and then he just he knows what he wants he can order it and he can get it there and so this thing the city is chocked filled with so many great items you know all the rope and all the vases and the you know it's just it's amazing and then keeping it period as well you know so and then the tile work you know that we got for in there just amazing mosaics and I mean then are artists that came in so

the the Contract the contract tractor came and built the city and then our Union crew came in after it was done a handoff and they aged it Scenic and well a lot there was a lot of Scenic and aging done prior to get a setup ready for our Union crew then from The Chosen TV series to come in and add their level of um aging and Scenic on top of that as well as set dress everything you know so and that was all done the the contract build the entire thing and age and dress the

whole Thing done by July starting in February and and the whole time we're like giving tours too so the entire time investors are coming and James and I are like the tour guys you know and so I gave you know 40 50 tours myself so you know it's like you know that's you can buy me a cup of coffee in the link below for anybody that was on a tour with me um Alo Jeff Stabler I mean that's an important question you're talking about all these wonderful people that were Involved and the hands that shaped

the show what about your hands how does how does Jeff Stabler find himself on the chosen you know I'm not sure um because of James you know and James is the production designer that I work for you worked with him beforehand yeah and that's okay so when he got so he got the show and then just kind of said I know a guy and you went along with him I just I go with James you know So I haven't actually gotten any art um jobs other than with him so because you're you're an independent film

contractor so you wear many hats yes yeah I mean I can do location management I do first ad I've done a ton of first ad and so I mean I had to drop a hat and I can go and do first ad tomorrow you know so and I enjoy it I love first ad as well which is great because I mean that was part of what um made James and I work well together was that if we go On to smaller films and everything with my first a background and everything I help coordinate and we

get things done you know and so it's a matter of like we need to keep our diversity so that I can come in and help anybody make any kind of movie from whatever role needs to be filled you know so that's what I want to train a lot of these younger people too is is to keep that diversity and at my age I'm like 51 years old and I'm not going to put myself into one position Right now and say like okay I've I'm I've been an art director with 20 years of experience I'm not

you know but I'm an art director now that has 10 years experience and I can do a pretty damn good job you know for you you know if that's the role that you need filled for your show and right now I've got a couple bucks in my pocket and I'm just having conversations with people and interesting conversations about movies and what it is that they need to have to Get their show complete whatever that role is I will help find the person for that role or perform that role so it's having interesting conversations and really

determining what is the project you know what what it is that you want to work on right now I'm kind of focusing on education and Ai and you know how do we you know get to the next steps of those things so what about art Direction um coach of card what about when when you stepped into that field What is the thing that really took you by surprise that you didn't really expect going in I guess a lack of Standards you know um I mean you've got architectural standards in drawing and how you provide things

to a construction Department so the biggest thing I guess is that multiple um there's multiple standards really so the thing is about getting like a really great construction person to do all of your building and whether That's in Michigan or Texas or Utah you're going to get the best Carpenter what's the most common thing between all of them they're the best okay but they all do it differently so in Utah they believe it's done this way in Texas they believe it's done this way and Michigan they believe it's done this way you know so it's

it's really all about no matter what project you're on no matter what role you're in it's sitting down at the very beginning of the show And determining what those roles are you know so if you've got $10 million you got a pretty big org chart that you got to fill out and you got to make sure that you know who in those roles is doing what right but if you're in a very small budget you've got a lot of things to accomplish and not a lot of people to do them so they are going to

have have to do multiple roles and so that's fine when you're when you're doing an independent film everybody's looking at It going like yeah that's just the way it is you're right that's the way it is and the same thing they say when you get to the studio it's the way it is it's the way it's been it's the way it will be you know so they've got a away and then you got TV shows they got a away you know a decent size independent film they got a away you know a feature film with

a huge budget they got away you know so it's really it's at the beginning into finding those things and What James and I did on our show is we just we supported one another what do you need what do you need great thank you okay on let's go we got a goal to hit this is it we got to do it there are no excuses you know we can't sit there and say like okay well you know we need more time which we do you know we need more information which we do but it's not

going to stop we have to keep going no matter what so we we found a way to work together to make sure that we get All of these things done and it took a lot what is the biggest misconception people have about art direction that you've come across well it's hard to say the first like the first season we were on the Chosen and James and I were going around to the events you know with Dallas and the the producers and stuff and I kept you know trying to push people this is James this is

the production designer and he kept going like people don't know Who the production designer they don't even know what that means you know I mean sure they don't know what art director means if they don't know what production designer means they don't know what art director means you know so it's just it's one of those things that is kind of convoluted as it's gone from you know a small feature to a studio of film what does an art director do what does a production designer to do I think at this point it's more like let's

just Educate everybody on that there is a production designer they're amazing and you know these are the jobs they do and all the people below them help him get that done you know and so in some cases they can afford to have an art director in some cases they can afford to have three you know so in season 4 I was creative art director and we had a supervising art director and as a creative art director I'm doing just the sets all the builds all of the concepts For everything that has to be created you

know so and and because of the amount of time I'm working and getting things to construction you know days before they need them you know and then I'm on to the next thing to get them days before they need it you know my my whole year doesn't slow down until we get to near the very end when there's just no more to build you know and then we have to like start cleaning up and preparing and you know what a strike and You know how this is all this can exit and luckily for me um

and James we don't have to stick around for strike we've got lots of people but people that we trust Andrew and his lead man and you know the these people are going to get everything back to where it goes is it like a storage facility that you guys keep things for like future Seasons yeah I mean they've got an entire set dressing building an out building that's huge 46,000 square feet or something Like that and there's a Mill and there's a wardrobe hair makeup wardrobe building and then a multi-purpose building where we have like a

cafe where we eat our lunches and stuff so there's four out buildings and a Sound Stage and the Sound Stage was I think 60,000 square feet I think that's actually really really cool and they're building another one right now so I think um what's interesting about it is when you got onto the show was it already a big hit Or did you get to see the rise of it become popular um I got to witness the rise it was already on its way but I was there as it just you know just started going over

the top it was great to give people an idea of how big this show is um myself and our technical producer if Jay you want to cut to the Y they give us a little P sign um we work at a movie theater and for like the last two years of my professional career as a film Projectionist every so often we get a chosen Premiere that shows up and they screen the first two episodes or first three episodes depending of the brand new season they did it with season 2 three and four and it is

packed there's a ton of people who come through the theater sells out I'll be honest they're very clean so thank you chosen audience members for leaving your theaters clean please continue to do so but it's really fun and it's it's crazy that that is First off happening it's such a popular show they're like we're going to do our premieres in theaters they're getting sellout tickets which is amazing and then on top of that I get to speak to somebody from that show so it's kind of like a full circle surreal and now I want to

finish that Circle by saying like you know how how does that feel knowing that your work is seen at such a large scale by so many people I don't know I mean just like any of you guys I Mean we're all inil weird yeah you know but it's like we don't think about it much because I mean we all are we have all been on big shows and they go on and do you know $500 million budgets they go on and do great things you know but to be a part of this show I think

is meant a little bit more to me different than the other ones because of the the build that it wasn't so big at the beginning you know and then it just built and built and built and your budget got Bigger with yeah and the budgets got bigger too you know which was great because we needed it you know and um just to maintain the speed in which we you know they want to try and get this stuff out to the fans is that it it takes money you know and if we've got a city you

know a city's got to be dressed you know or we're taking and robbing from one set to dress another set and you know there's only a day between you know and and it doesn't always work when We've got so many sets and so many places to be so we had to get more dressing more set dressing more sets more you know all this stuff and just keeps adding up so so that we can get these deadlines so that we can get this stuff to the theater for the fans you know which is awesome and I

love it that they're doing the fathom events at all these theaters and popular man it's very popular it is it's great and you know I'm I'm a big fan of the show so and I Mean okay so add to that now is there any advice you would give to someone who's starting out in the art department or someone who's trying to get into the art department or currently in a very similar situation to yourself trying to like handle the you know the chaos and the grace that comes with it is there any advice or industry

Insight you'd love to share with them plan planning planning planning the more time you can plan the better I mean Especially when you're young and you're just doing you know starting out um you realize that if you're G to make a feature film or even a short film you know you are you're working a lot ahead of time you're prepping so much it's not just about principal photography the day on set it's all leading up to it so whatever you're working on art director every art director should be planning planning planning get as much out

and in front of the executive producers the Directors the writers as you possibly can at the very beginning so they can make decisions so that you've got more time to get everything accomplished so it's all about you know setting those expectations I love that I think that's a very fair point for every Department as well it's like as soon as you put an idea out out there the quicker you do that the quicker it's going to get notes the quicker you can go back to the drawing board and you realize that that Process is never

going to be let me spend a ton of time perfecting it before I show it because then they have the opportunity to say no and you've lost all that time but the quicker you start that back and forth the quicker you're both going to find that middle ground and then nail it in yes I love that which I guess takes me to my favorite topic on this podcast thus far and you are the certified expert oh no AI is here the artificial intelligence has Arrived and you've done some really exciting work I think you've done

some seminars here at Motion Picture Institute in educating upand cominging filmmakers about this technology so I just want to give you the stage and take it away tell us about what to expect what's coming and what's here yeah I mean there's a lot here so I mean that's it's the Divergence and convergence of an idea AI is in Divergence right now it's just you know the world Is possible you know AI can do anything so they say right but it's that exact thought that is keeping anybody from doing anything you know it's just like if

there's too many possibilities there are none you know so it's really trying to find within AI what tools can be used to assist in doing what you already do but just do it better do it faster I mean if anything in this industry we need a break our crews need a break you know anything that AI can do to help a Crew member survive a film set because we all know that you know you work hard and you work some long days it's usually pretty it's grueling work right and so if AI can help improve

that life a quality of life for people on set behind the scenes in a production I'm all for it so it's finding those things right now and of course some of the things that are going to help initially with anybody making any kind of a film is those storyboards you know and and Getting an idea of what it is that you're trying to accomplish so even at the very very beginning of somebody's wanting to get to pitch and get a show visuals you know and you start getting those visuals those visuals answer a lot of

questions for you too you know so you get some visuals for your little short story and all of a sudden your visuals show you that it's going to take you $10,000 to make this happen because the way that you wrote it you know so these Things are just they're bringing light to what it is that you're going to have to accomplish and so anything you can use AI for to help get that done faster um more of it the better you know so so I would say initially um use it whenever you can to do

the things that have seemed monotonous to you or that you were never given enough time to really do so these are things that are digging into um tasks that you have to already accomplish you know so I've Already got to make the schedule I've already got to you know do all this over here what if I use AI to help me do these things a little faster maybe a little bit more accurate don't know we have to see and mean a thing about AI right now is a little messy um you always have to check

it um um never take it for what it produces always look at it because it's not replacing you doing something it's helping you do something so you look at it and if you just Totally trust it and say like well it's just going to do it for me you're going to end up with some pretty crazy stuff surpris you know yeah the six fingers and you know it's just a weird stuff just you know there yeah little artifacts everywhere there's artifacts in the writing there's artifacts in everything you know so you really got to pay

attention to what it is that you're using aii for and initially just to get yourself a little bit further ahead than You were before and it's a perfect assistant to help you do that breaking down a script you know and just saying okay let's have a conversation like the back and forth about my script you know talk to me with AI have a conversation about the 3A structure so some of the things that I would do at the beginning of the chosen is I would actually take a sketch pad and I would draw some lines

on it to designate time and then I would put all the characters down the side and I would draw out their Arc their story arc this would let me know how many of them are where you know where's each Apostle in this story because in the writing you got to analyze in the story you're just saying okay like these two are talking at this particular location but it doesn't say like oh well the other five Apostles are standing right behind them because that was in the last scene mentioned that they were walking up with Them

so we just got to remember okay yeah they're all still there they're all still there you know so we got to make sure okay now we're in this room now this room's got to be big enough not just for two people it's got to be big enough for camera and six more and we've got scenes where we've got all the apostles you know so we got like 14 people so the sets are getting bigger to accommodate more people more crew more uh equipment you know and there more Camera and everything you know so so um

at the beginning I would use you know I I didn't have ai you know it was so new and and that's the thing is like a lot of the people right now are saying like Okay well AI yeah you know that would be super great but I'm already doing my job and I'm so busy doing my job I don't have time to go and dive into AI to figure out how it's going to help me do what I'm doing better than I'm way I'm already doing it which takes a lot of Work actually you know

it's it's trying to get AI to do something that you're already doing is not as easy as it seems you know it it takes work it takes a lot of uh commitment to making that happen and then fixing all the problems that come along with it and ironing it out getting rid of those artifacts and everything to make it something that's tangible that you could actually use to improve your time you know so I never had that opportunity when I was on the Chosen because it was never to that point where I could use it

and also have the time in my already crammed crazy to figure out how to make it work you know and how to integrate it so now that I'm off right now and I'm working on smaller gig jobs I've got some time to dig into it and then get into it with people that are actually doing projects right now so that's really where I want to get is involved in some projects where we can apply it and say like yes These These are definitely things that we're going to do so one of the things we are

doing with AI is we're working with the chat gpts so the gpts you can create custom gpts where assistants that are have a specific Focus so in a GPT just like chat GPT you can just start a you know a prompt and have a conversation in that one thread in a GPT you can actually like give it Focus say I want you to take these things specifically into consideration when I'm Talking to you about this so I can just say I'm going to create a GPT specifically about film making and then so I can have

a conversation with chat GPT specifically about film making with these specific things in mind so I can load the knowledge base with information about what it is that I want to talk about with my film and then it's got all of that already preloaded into its you know machine learning and then you ask the questions and have those Conversations with um chat gbt as a filmmaker so what in the link below you'll be able to see um the link for MPI is going to create a a GPT that is going to be helpful for the

students to kind of review and understand all the things that they were taught while they were here that's so cool and they can go back and reference forms and reference procedures of you know how things work in the production management side of the film World so we're making this kind of Film Production management so I've got a couple and we'll link those in the description below as well but they're gpts and you can just go to them try them uh you have to have an open AI Pro membership which is just it's like $9.99 a

month but it just gives you unlimited access to the open AI open chat gpts and everything so totally worth it because you can get so much more done with it than um just the straight chat GPT and Something I love about how you're going about AI how you're preaching it is it's very practical and you're advocating from a firsthand experience being on a big TV show dealing with scheduling and dealing with the intensity that comes with the workload Lo and how much is expected of just a person I think a lot of people don't understand

how much work goes into these big shows from an individual level oh it's an ungodly amount of work and it's done out of Passion this is the one time where work is done out of passion and for a show like that you say yourself the passion is tenfold so where chat GPT and all the other AIS come in by alleviating that work I love what you're promoting and I love the idea of it just Rel leaving that extra pressure taking it's I see it as this great funnel it funnels all this chaos and information into

like bite-sized stuff that you can easily swipe yes or no and just decipher for Yourself what your plan is and that just makes it so much more beneficial because we hear all these horror stories in our own industry of people who work themselves into early Graves people who are sleep deprived and die in car accidents this happens all the time in Atlanta Los Angeles New York a lot of P a there's so much simple stuff that can be eradicated by our gift as creators sorry ourselves we are creators our own right and we're creating this

technology And it should able us it should help us it should better the process the whole point of film making is to make in your own P personal Pursuit is to make your process as streamlined as possible and AI is going to help us do that it can it can that makes me excited yeah totally totally I believe it 100% I think it's great and I mean it's taking AI the the first step in it is just something that anybody can really do and it's what needs to be done for a lot of People just

to kind of go in there and understand what are the things that it can do for me and a lot of people right now there's I mean there's not going to do much other than making a cute picture of a kitty cat or something you know I but there are this bunny cuter right whole thing exactly but I mean think of like what AI can do with a things that we're already doing that haven't been affected yet the simplest things that we do and it's like okay um using like Grammarly oh I love grammarly I

love grammar grammarly thank you so much for the work you do you sponsor this okay um but we're we're basically we're making it sound right and everything okay well now with AI how come our emails don't look any better I mean they should be straight up Graphics piled in there with animations that are automatically created for instructional purposes I mean the thing is it could it could be so much better an AI could help You with that you know it's it's those next steps that are just going to make the little things we are already

doing just that much better you know and so it's the same thing you're thinking about what do we do in film you know so at the very beginning just the beginning of the pitch process you can have all these visuals you know helping create the lookbooks helping be able to create uh great communication between a director that has like no art artistic Skills at all whatsoever and them be able to type in and get some sort of a an image generation back that they can give to their production designer that's saying like hey this is

what I got in my head you know these are kind of the things in the direction I'm I'm going with this and the production designer can take it to a whole another level you know but they've already got something where they can start having that conversation about where are you at Where am I at you know and now we know we're on the same page so it's really what else can we do that with we can do with budget we can do it with roles and responsibilities you know and so if you write out this

is the expectation for my art department and these are the things that need to be accomplished you can figure out who you're going to need to make it all happen and getting those things worked out at the very beginning utilizing AI to help you just dot the Eyes cross the te's figure out what it is that you're going to need is based upon what those expectations are and when you first start out and we're having conversations all over the place with people that are just bringing a script to the table a script the written word

I could I could translate that A Million Ways you know so it's all about having those conversations right at the beginning to figure out what does this really look like in the end so that We're all happy so that in the end where there are no surprises this is what we're getting you know Jeff I don't think I could say it better myself um it's been a pleasure having you I want to give you some time now to just let us know where we can find you on social media your patreon I'll obviously have those

links down below and then if there anything you want to promote real quick I'd love to hear about it okay um great yeah below I'm gonna Have the only um link I'm GNA have is a patreon link um I don't have any of the other social medias um just literally being in the business too is like I don't have the time for it I just I felt like those are one of the things that I was going to push to the side to make time for other things you're a nomatic I respect that yes so

um but you can find me on patreon and there I will be talking about um the things that I'm working on as well as uh some of the Things my friends are working on and um what I'm going to do is because I didn't have the time while I was doing it the last four years of the chosen is is I'm going to go back in in in retrospect I'm going to be grateful for all of my opportunity that I was given I'm going to regenerate I'm going to generate some art for um the 300

plus sets that um I had the privilege of being involved with and I'm just going to you know little quick story about you know what was so Cool about it and and my own interpretation of kind of the sketches that were important and pivotal in making that happen um as well as just new art um because like you were saying earlier when you're going really fast you don't have time to make it pretty I mean this is just like Scribble Scribble Scribble that no no scribble scribble scribble that no no okay scri you know it's

like the quicker I can get to a know the better and so I've got some Stuff that's just like quick now I'm take the quicker I can get to I know the better I love that yeah so I'm I'm taking the time now to to go back and look at all those and generate some stuff and so my patreon members are going to have you know a monthly image of one of the sets and you know eventually I'm just going to get all 300 of them done too and just my reflection on such a great

time and with all the people that I you know I love so um and Then also in July camp hitel we're going to be doing chfa which is Camp hell Fine Arts camp and um it's got a theater aspect and a film aspect and um there'll be a link in the description below for registration for that um as well as just the city that we built and just a huge shout out to all of the contractors and workers that were on that because they made it what it is and um the the keys you know

Seth and Zach and Greg and Dan and I mean just all those guys working For John um and John Hart htx if you need anything in Texas that's the guy he's your man oh look a big congratulations to the chosen all four seasons their continued success and more so to you Jeff congratulations oh thank you and um it's been a pleasure sir thank you for your wisdom your time and your experience and I hope that this is the first of many conversations I would love you to be a friend of the Show excellent this has

been great thank you Let's um that's it guys that's let's talk Motion Picture This podcast is brought to you by Motion Picture Institute a film School located in Troy Michigan if you'd like to know more about our extensive one-year film making program please check out the website at motionpicturehd [Music]