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Hi, Chantel. >> Hi, Lisa. It's good to see you again this week. >> Thank you. >> How's your week been going? >> Um, it's a little worse than last week, but um I mean it's going. I'm just, you know, uh just trying to get through with it. Just a lot going on still. >> Tell me more. Yeah. Tell me more about what's been going on this week. >> Um >> like work or is it your family? >> We're It's my family mostly. Uh in addition uh to well, you know, work. I got the new job

and that's actually going really well. Um, I did have some good >> this week where I started actually seeing clients myself for individual sessions and I was kind of a little bit nervous, but today was my first day seeing clients and it was really it went really well. So, I feel very confident for, you know, tomorrow and the rest of the week because I have like clients booked up. As far as my family, I mean, it's either hot or cold, especially with my husband. I you remember me telling you like we've been separated for like

5 months, but we're still living together. And um I guess today was just one of those days I walked in from the h walked into the house from work and just I just feel so heartbroken right now. I'm so hurt. He just find continues to find ways to hurt me and break me and I just I don't know if I could take it anymore and I don't even know if I want to like I just can't take it anymore. >> Tell me more what's what's happening with that. You guys have been together for how long?

>> We've been together for about 20 years, almost 20 years. It'll be um in January or not January, June, sorry. Um, >> and he's literally like all I know. We have our two youngest children together and I've spent my whole life like just submitting to him and loving him and and holding like my part like the promises that I made to God. And >> he's changed so much within the past like year and a half. And just this year he started coming out with oh I want a divorce and oh this and that and now

we're he's like kept pushing me to like separate and it got to the point where he's like I I'm leaving. I have to leave and >> just he's so verbally abusive, mentally abusive. And I'm barely seeing this now like when I reflect on everything he's he literally like just to like today tried to manipulate me with like I don't know how to explain it. Like can I tell you what he said? Like >> yeah tell me tell me what he said. >> He said because I am like four years older than him and we met

like young. He said um that I controlled him and I messed up his brain because I controlled him when we were young and like it's kind of like he >> like I was the one that like forced our relationship and our marriage and all this stuff and I that's not true. It's totally not true. like he loved me too and like we we both pursued each other and everything. I just feel like it's another form of control that he's trying to like I don't know like manipulation like he wants me to believe these things and

it just hurts my heart so bad. >> Not even >> I've already been >> that's a lot of pain. >> Yeah. I think it's I think it's good that you were able to look at it um from the a real kind of step back and look at it from our perspective of that it wasn't true and to really evaluate your own truth um you know even within that moment but as that happened. So I think that's very positive that you were able to do that you >> even though it was very painful. I >> think

so too. I just and I've never felt like this before in my life, but I and not shake this feeling of I just do not want to like the thought of not like living anymore. I just feel like everyone would be better off without me. And I just makes me so sad. I don't know if it's like a psychological issue or what, but it's just everything else too. I know it's everything else. And I just I can't sh I can't shake it off. I feel like I'm like I've always been hopeful and I not waking

up with hope anymore >> and I just >> I don't know what to do. >> Yeah, I'm sorry to hear that. You have a lot going on. you have a lot going on and when you share these experiences, you know, I hear there's a deeper belief there potentially, you know, that maybe, you know, you're not feeling cared for or that um, you know, you're feeling alone, you know, and isolated even though you're living together. Correct. You're still living together. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. It's It's like walking in on eggshells and I'm just I feel so

like even though our kids are in home and >> I just walk in on eggshells and I I literally isolate myself to the room because I know it's not healthy for us to like fight and argue in front of our kids >> and um >> Yeah. >> So I just feel very lonely overall. I have no friends or anyone to talk to. I just I don't know what to do. I just I'm very very sad. So and I just I'm thankful. Thank you for seeing me. I'm thankful for being here, but I just I don't

know. I I need some kind of help. I don't know. I need to get better or I'm kind of scared the way I feel right now. I just I don't want to myself or anything, but >> those thoughts have been like going through my head lately and it's really scary. >> Yeah, I I can hear you. But I'm grateful that you came as well. So, thank you for showing up today. Obviously that shows that you want to improve. You want to get better. So that's actually a positive thing that you're holding on to hope there

that there can be improvement in it. So I think it shows some resiliency that you showed up today and that you're talking it through and want to work it through. Tell me more about um the kids, their their ages and just what the you know where they are and what what's going on with the kids. I have a 14-year-old and 11 year old. They're both girls. Um, they're both in school full-time. Um, they go to after school programs. Um, I mean, they have a good friend group. They're doing really good in school. Um, it just

all this time like I've been trying to be like, "Oh, I feel like like, oh my gosh, we're getting a divorce." And it felt like like kind of like a failure because I always wanted to like have a family that stayed together and made it work and wanted my kids to not grow up with like a divorced parents. And so that's like heartbreaking. But like my children are even telling me, "Mama, daddy don't love you. Mama, you need to daddy." Like they're telling it. And it it kind of like um not encourages but kind of

like helps me to see like give me that, you know, not the answer but lets me know what I already know I need to do. >> But at the same time, I can't help but wonder like if they're like stuffing it because they're both actually like acting like none of this is bothering them. >> But I'm sure that >> Yeah. I mean, I it's another way to look at it is that you are, you know, helping them cope through it because you're saying that they do well in school and that they're performing well and they're

actually being very mature about kind of guiding you and sticking by you on some of this stuff. So, that obviously shows that you're a very engaged mother. So, you should be proud of that and and how you're how you're walking them through this very difficult time. Well, >> I I do I love my growth. I feel so I am so thankful for them and I'm so glad that you know even though our marriage was breaking apart that I was blessed with my my growth and um that helps give me the will to want to move

on like I really don't want to leave them or I just I can't help but like shake this film and I just I feel worthless. I feel worthless. Like what am I even for? Like and I know it has to be from the enemy. I know it is because I also know what God says about me in his word and >> Yeah. Yeah. Well, I I thank you for sharing that with me and that those feelings of of worthlessness can be overwhelming, but I'm glad that you're um bringing up God and relying on that and

knowing that he does say that you're enough. Tell me more about what you feel um God says about you, the truth >> that you hold. Um, well, I know that he has plans for me. Um, I know that he will never leave me or forsake me. Um, I know that he's true and faithful. Like, even though I didn't have a dad growing up and this and that, like even though I thought I could trust my husband and that he'd be faithful and true and I could trust him when he gave his word, even though he

didn't, I know that I could trust God's word and that he is true and faithful and that he is always with me. He will never leave me. I don't have to doubt what he says and that his promises are true. >> Yes. >> I know I said I don't >> That's beautiful. >> Thank you. I know I said I don't have hope, but if I have any inkling of hope, just a little spark of it, it's it's God. I know he's going to take care of me. I'm just >> I'm just so heartbroken. Heartbroken. >>

Yeah. I'm I'm so glad that you've been holding on to that hope and holding on to God and that faith because that is, you know, a great foundation to have and it sounds like you have a strong foundation. So looking at that and and seeing all that's happening around you and you're still holding on to that hope and that foundation is something that shows that God is your rock and you know is something that can get you through. So tell me more about your feelings. um how deep the feelings run with your you mentioned hopelessness

several times. Does that what does that mean to you and entail to you? Well, it immediately just the lack of it thereof gives me a sense of fear because I have always when I say I'm somebody that has always woken up with hope like no matter how bad things are happening I always woke up to be like you know but God's still God's still in control God's taking care of me but lately this it's not that I don't think he's in control I just feel like I don't I don't know I just I feel like

it's such like my husband is All I know for so long like >> the hope of like what's ne like the unknown of like what's next? Is there even anything after this? Like that's where I'm like hopeless at like because I can't flee it because I'm afraid because I'm I'm just I'm very afraid like where am I going to go? What am I going to do? Am I going to be able to support myself in my because he's literally been like supporting me. I put myself through college. I literally just recently got a very good

job, but still doesn't pay as much as I mean what I would need to be able to live comfortable for my kids. There's just so much stresses like financial I don't know just all kinds of stuff like and then >> still heavy. >> Sorry. >> So things feel heavy right now and >> very >> you know even in your darkest moments because you have so many different things coming at you. The fact that you showed up for our appointment today shows that you're holding on to a little bit of hope. So, I'm glad that you

showed up today and I'm glad that you're walking through it and sharing it. That's a that is a, you know, a positive um step forward and really does show some resiliency on your part to walk through this really hard moment. you >> is there I guess I I guess what I want to know especially what I came in home like is there any way to like how do I stop the verbal abuse from affecting me mentally and emotionally? I feel like it's damaging me. I feel it hurts so bad. I feel like it's like literally

like my heart's being pushed and it's messing me up. It's like almost making me believe the stuff that he's saying to me and I just it makes me question my sanity like and if that's if you're if that's true to you is that true then because that's not what I remember and then it makes me question my own like you know and so >> yeah I mean when you share those you know experiences and those those thoughts when somebody's placing those on you. That can be a heavy weight to bear. But, you know, the idea

that God is your foundation and that God says that you're enough, that that's something to cling to in those moments, right? And it sounds like you have been doing that. You've been clinging to what God says about you rather than uh, you know, any emotional abuse or things that are being relayed to you. So I think that's a very positive thing and something that you could continue, you know. So how deep are these feelings running though of feeling, you know, you mentioned you don't feel like you're enough or um you know that you're feeling a

little hopeless. How deep are these running for you? >> I feel like just recently they're they're getting really deep because he's not it's not stopping. to continually like drip of it. And it's like if I don't keep my eyes fixed on God, it's I'm going to be filled with what the lies are like all that stuff that's being told to me. Like and I just need to make I don't know. I just >> I don't know how to explain it. It's just I don't know. It just it hurts. I don't it hurts because like does

he really believe that like or is he just doing some type of brainwash type manipulation or what do you call it? Gaslighting I don't know like I don't know. >> Yeah. And is it getting deep within your kind of psyche? Is it what what response is? >> I feel like it is like I feel like I have to um like right now like literally before a session it just happened and I feel like um I don't know. I'm just so glad we had the session because if not there was there would be nowhere where I

could like um I guess let it out. But if we did have the session it's going pretty deep in my mind like it's hurting so bad. And it's not just that it hurts like emotionally like it's a it's kind of messing me up. I feel like it's messing me up in the head. >> Explain it. >> So, what kind of thoughts are you having? Are you looking at um taking action on, you know, what are some of the thoughts and what are some of the actions that you've thought about? Well, I feel I don't I

know it's the enemy, but like I feel like again just like if if if I'm that bad, then maybe I don't then maybe I'll just save everybody everybody and the dread, you know, the save everybody whatever bad I am that like he's saying. And I just just maybe I'm better. They're all better off without me. you just I've had like I don't know if they're visions or what, but like just I've never tried that killing myself or anything like that, but I don't know. Sometimes I like get like these things run through my head like

I don't know just like driving. >> So, have you thought of harming yourself >> sometimes? Like driving off going head on into traffic, stuff like that. like words like just I don't know. >> Okay. Yeah. I'm sorry to hear those are that this has been such a hard time. So some of the things that you're thinking you are thinking of harming yourself and and have thought about some of the ways that that could potentially happen >> especially. >> So I'm glad that you're >> Yeah. I'm glad that you're here with me today so that we

can talk through and and maybe break through some of that process. Um because you you matter. You matter and you're enough and I know you know that because you know God is your rock and foundation and that's what he says about us and that is truth, right? >> That is true. >> So wonder if we were to work through a plan. And I know the feelings are kind of rushing through um and overwhelming you, but wonder if we were to work through a plan for the moments that those thoughts get really strong and create a

plan that could be something for you to hold on to a little bit. >> Yes. >> Would that be something you'd be willing to do? >> Yes, we made it. I need something. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. because I know sometimes um when our minds race away and and obviously you're still living in the home with him. So kind of creating that um foundation for yourself to be able to stand on and know the truth and bring it back up um is a big one. So if we were to look at it, obviously the goal is

not necessarily to stop all of it. There's a hard moments that are to come and if you're still separated and the divorce is to come, there's still a lot of heart that's to come. but maybe in gaining resiliency and a little bit of um the tools to be able to walk through it. What do you think are some of the things that maybe come up for you? Like if you think about the last time that those type of thoughts where it got to that that point of feeling hopeless or not enough and that you were

actually wanting to do something about that, what do you think um came up for you? What was what was so strong? what was happening around you. >> I was actually driving on the highway to work. >> Um, >> okay. >> That's the scary part of it. But I know that the like the Holy Spirit in me like right away, you know, when you see the Tom and Jerry cartoon, there's the evil angel and that's what I felt like it was right away, but literally right away like immediately like I know it was my spirit and

the holy spirit spirit with me like right away like put up a wall >> and was like no that is not that's something because like I said I've never felt or thought anything like that before in my life ever Like I've never been somebody that has struggled with anything like that. Um >> yeah. >> So I honestly feel like it is an part of an attack, but then the enemy knows where I'm weak. He knows when I'm weak. >> And um >> but I literally when that happened, I literally felt like I literally felt like

I know it was like the Holy Spirit and my spirit right away was like no like no that's no like just no no that's out of it. that something was just but um that >> praise God. >> Praise God that Yes. >> and and that you have that spirit within you and that you were able to hold tight to that at that moment, you know. >> So, thank you for sharing with me this vulnerable >> and you know, thank you for sharing it with me. I really thank you for trusting me with that. So, are

there things that um you know, just so we're we're aware and we create a space where you might know when some of the things are going to come up for you and bring on the hard feelings. If you think about the last time you thought that way, what what brought that? Was it something somebody said? Was it um were you alone? Were you with your husband? What is bringing it up for you? >> It was literally on my way waking up in a good mood. Good mood. getting ready to go to work. Getting ready to

go to work, you know, everything nice, nice, respectful, hi, and then just there there he goes with I don't even want I don't I'm not trying to put him in a bad light, but it's literally like I'm just think literally like just started started in and I'm saying abuse, but like saying stuff, mean like mean hurtful stuff and then so diving on my way to work, that's when I had those thoughts. So it's literally as soon as after after um I guess the confrontation with me and him and then those feelings kind of like sit

and resonate. >> I kind of just feel like I need to escape especially escape when I say escape not just escape myself but escape what has just been told me because they're almost like cursive being spit at me and I'm >> Yeah. And yeah, so that day I mean it was really bad again just like it was today when um on my way to work and that's when I started feeling like I just was like oh I didn't start feeling that but that's when those thoughts went to >> Yeah. So the verbal abuse is there

a lot of anger and aggression and yelling. >> Yeah. >> And those things >> are what are bringing on that response? >> Yeah. like >> and then you're going to be alone. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> Yes. >> So you get into maybe another stressful situation like driving or head headed to work. So maybe it's compounding >> all of the emotions that you're feeling. Is that when you're you have been feeling it the most these these feelings of extreme? >> Actually when I think about it yeah I am usually alone. It's usually when I'm stressed

or in a rush. Like that morning I was actually running. I almost was running late to work because my kid didn't get up in time and well my oldest didn't get up in time and so we were rushing out of the house and I actually made it to work on time but I'm the type like I do not I'd rather be on time to me early. So um I was already pressed for time. So maybe we have a stress and then the sadness and the >> confrontation as well with my husband and everything and just

felt overwhelmed and just like oh now just I don't know. >> Yeah, I think yeah it sounds like you have um when those feelings are coming up you have a lot going on and that's why you're kind of being tugged in a lot of different directions and he's able to kind of dig in deeper. So maybe the multitasking you said you were, you know, getting the kids ready and doing a whole bunch of different things and you were feeling rushed and then obviously after the aggression, you're stepping into maybe, you know, going into the car

where there's more energy and things coming at you. So, um, you know, maybe being aware that these are some of the things that are bringing up these big feelings could be a helpful thing for us to kind of evaluate and look at and put down as as some of the the ideas to um be aware of that when these things happen, they kind of compound and can help bring on these uh stronger feelings. Does that sound about right that these are some of the the the triggers, the things that bring it up for you? It's

>> exactly. Yeah, it's exactly. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. So, when when the thoughts um happen, before the thoughts happen, um what do you notice? Is there anything you can notice in yourself like things that are being stirred up? >> I want to cry and I'm hurt. I feel like Yeah, I want to cry. Um but I can't because I'm on my way to work and I want to mess my makeup. But not just that, I I want to cry and I feel like a deep sorrow or pain. I feel like a like a failure because

most of the time when he's telling me this stuff, it's like just stuff like like he wants me to believe about myself like like today you you controlled me. You forced us to get us to get married. You were the older one. You you literally warped my brain. Uh something like I don't know what the heck you said, but it's just something like you warped my you controlled my brain so it made me I don't know. just he's out on a whip. Like stuff I could have never imagined him saying. But it's just stuff like

that. Like it makes me feel like I don't know. It just makes me feel like bad. Makes me feel bad. Like dang, did I for like did it makes me question my reality. Like did I like I thought you loved me back. Like did I force you? Did I? >> Because I've never ceased that way. Like we were a family that were together united. We loved each other and we made a covenant with God and we made promises and we were a good family that used to be in the word and did Bible study and

go to church and play with our kids and >> um >> Right. >> Yeah. >> It just and that's >> seeing it a whole different way. He doesn't see that. And that's what's like oh my gosh. >> I don't know. >> Yeah. That's a lot for you to process. That's a lot for you to process. and a a difference in in truth if that's where he's taking it can be very painful and hard. Um but you know standing firm it sounds like you're doing on your truth and questioning that and bringing back reality standing in

the reality of this is the actual truth. Right. So I think that's wonderful. So tell me more like just if there's any signs in your body just so we can start evaluating so you can be aware like when you feel them um you know when we things that may be impacting the thoughts of you know harming yourself or going in that direction um might come up. Is there anything that like do you stop eating? Do you lose your appetite? Do you shut down? You said you cry, but you mentioned you cry, but are you shoving

that down or are you actually >> crying down because I hardly Yeah, I don't >> I hardly don't cry. Like I'm usually just I don't know if I'm stubbing at it or what, but um I'm not trying to share it with family because I don't know. I just don't want to burden anybody with it and they already know what's going on. So >> I I feel like like probably if they would like give my blood pressure, I probably have high blood pressure at the moment. I feel very tense. I feel tense. I feel stressed. I

feel like I can't think. >> Um I feel like short-tempered. Like maybe like right at that moment if like he was saying, "But mama, can we do this?" I'm like, "Hold on just a minute. Let me you know." >> Um >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So in those moments, are there things that help? >> Also, you know, if you're feeling Yeah, you're right about like I I lose my appetite. >> Um what helps in the moment? >> Me just taking a break. Like me just trying to um I guess um praying praying definitely helps. Like it

it does like even if I don't see it right, right? But like it helps as long as I I just I'm in continuous prayer to God no matter what. And I just I ask him to help me to see. >> That's a that's a wonderful >> Yeah. >> Yeah. That's a wonderful um And have you tried um other uh like when the thoughts come? >> What else has helped? I think the main main thing that really really helps and I I I I know it helps and even though when I'm like I feel like I'm

being persecuted or like attacked like this sometimes it takes a moment but I know it helps me a lot is is immediately forgiven like immediately and letting go of that and um because if I hold on to the unforgiveness along with everything else it just makes more chaos. So I I that does help like I forgive him >> and then >> um I know God tells me to like love like just love him. Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you. So that's what I do and continue to try and some days it's

hard but I pray for him like I pray like >> so that does help >> forgiving. That's wonderful. >> Yeah. >> I mean that's that is I mean you really that's a very hard thing to do at any time but especially right in the moment. So that's a good foundational tool to step into. So the prayer and then you know um working on forgiveness. Do you do anything else like walking? Have you tried journaling? Anything along those lines help process it? >> I haven't walked in a long time. I would love to walk again. Um

I haven't had time. I need to make time. Journaling. I haven't gotten into journaling. It's like I put all those on my to-do list, but I don't get around to um >> Yeah. And I don't want to put another thing on your to-do list u because obviously you have a lot but just in the processing of thinking maybe what has helped in the past when you've had hard struggles or you know what has worked you know does it help to stop and and breathe for a minute or even a quick walk standing up and and

doing some quick stretches can can kind of shift the thoughts and get us out you know a little bit outside of ourselves. So that might be a good plan is to look that. Is there anything that has even worked um in the past? >> Actually has helped. Yeah, I used to be a walker. Like I used to walk every day and I used to get my little miles in my my Fitbit and all that back in the day. But um I was just I would love to start walking again because it really did help me

like um process through stuff and think like it helped me be clear. >> Also I was able to spend more time with thought you know while walking. So I think that's a very good idea. >> Yeah. And certainly obviously you can put those together. What? Right. A prayer walk might be something that we could put down as part of your your plan to say when you know when these feelings are coming up and and you're kind of going in that direction to look at just immediately uh stepping into some sort of prayer walk that that

will you know physically move you but also spiritually move you and keep you connected to there. So, those might be some good tools for you um to kind of put in there. >> Yeah. I mean, any of those activities, I mean, even anything from hopping in a cold shower, splashing cold water on your face, any of those things can kind of change and stop the projection of the mood. So, um, maybe we could continue, you know, exploring some of those things and and maybe you could try some of them when these thoughts happen when we

start to process or we going to maybe a dark place to pause and try some of these. Obviously, the walk has worked, prayer has worked. >> Has have you tried breath work or um any of those things as well? >> I I think not. No, I mean I've heard of breath work and I think I've tried it just for fun before, but I've never like actually tried it when I'm like something. >> So that try often. >> Yeah, we can start we can work on those in the next sessions just just to be aware of

maybe what will help you in those moments. Um because you know there's as they come up just knowing what could shift you just even a little bit is is helpful for sure. So, are there um just people or or just any kind of setting too that could maybe, you know, distract you or get you outside of your that that >> hard? I love being around my kids. >> Yeah, I love >> Yeah. >> So, what do you love doing with them? >> Spending time with them. I I like now that they're like older, I try

to do what they're interested in. Like tonight, we're going to have like a movie night and draw and tell her and stuff. And my youngest, she loves doing art. So I'm going to like sit with her and do art and stuff with so so our bedtime. >> So that >> I love that. >> I'm excited actually for that because we haven't done it in a while. >> Yeah. I mean, even now looking at you when you talked about your kids, you can see that your demeanor changed and there's an excitement there. So, I definitely think

as part of, you know, looking at at at your plan of like moving forward, looking at those activities you can do for your kids, and I'm proud of you for already including that. You had it planned already tonight. >> So, it sounds like you're already doing a lot of these things and the kids. So, if some of the stressors are are in your home, is there other spaces that also might be a place? Yes, sir. >> We're about to actually move. So, about a week and a half, I'm going to move. I found my own

place and so I'm moving on. Um >> my daughters will go back and forth, but um >> yeah, I honestly it's that another thing, but I'm very I'm actually kind of excited about it. >> Not Yeah. And I Yeah, and I don't want to feel guilty about that either, but I mean >> No, no, you shouldn't. this is a a movement forward and you've taken a bold step to make it a more positive environment. So I'm proud of you for doing that. >> Thank you. >> And moving forward. So some of the things that you

know can kind of shift in you know helping you with distraction is you know being around your kids not even have to talk right you're going to draw with them or sit with a movie so you don't even have to process those things at that moment. Just be present with them. Yeah. And then this new environment, new apartment obviously is is a new place as well. >> Yeah. Yeah. So that's great. And and do you like you said you like walking too, so getting outside probably is something that's helpful. >> Yeah, definitely. I'm excited. So

like we we um definitely once it warms up and everything, uh we're definitely going to take walks. So, if we, you know, we're talking about a lot of strategies to try to help if, if let's say the strategies, it really was a lot because I know you have a lot coming up in this next week and a half. You're going to move out that's going to bring up obviously not just feelings in you and your girls, but your husband as well. So, if things were to get really heavy or hard, um, are there people that

you could um, ask for help? I mean, I could call my mom. She lives in >> Okay. >> She lives in South Dakota, but I could call my mom. Definitely. She's She's for me. Like, I just don't like to trouble them with anything, but she wants to know what's going on with me. Like, >> so I could definitely call my mom. Um, I do have like one girlfriend that's um she's older, but she does she's pretty she's caring, too, and nice. She's a good friend. I could call her. >> Good. And what's her name? >>

Her name is Wendy. Wendy. Okay. >> So, Wendy would be a person that you could actually reach out to >> like local. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. It's kind of like thinking about who you would want to know that you're struggling. >> Yeah. >> You know, >> and I've alreadyated Yeah. She knows what's going on. So, >> yeah, she she would definitely like meet up with me realistically. >> Yeah. So, that's good. So you >> you have um a couple people that are strong support system that you could reach out to immediately. >> Um sorry my

connection was um unstable. It says it's raining so bad already. >> Oh that's okay. Um, so the, um, you know, there are obviously agencies that you can call and do you have those those tools or those phone numbers if if it did get even harder and darker? >> I actually do because where I work, I work at a mental health um, organization. So, we give the crisis line numbers to our clients every day. So, I almost know them by heart and I have them like logged in my phone and I have like more than one.

So, >> that's great. Yeah. >> Yeah. So, you have the obviously if it gets really bad, you just call 911 or go straight to the ER and walk straight up and let them know, right? >> But it's good that you have some of those, you know, uh obviously you can text, there's a quick text, the 7417415, that's a great resource. So, having some of those available should be part of the plan. Um but you know we have all these other tools but just making sure that we have that and um you know and that you're

be you're aware of you know where the tools are. You mentioned when you go to the dark place um just even the car >> right is where you >> your thoughts went dark is that that's pretty much where you thought of the driving off cliff and some of those other things. So, what would make that harder? So, so if we're thinking about and processing um these feelings when it gets really hard, what do you think would help knowing that that's that's where you went with the car? What do you think would help? >> Like I'm

thinking maybe putting your keys somewhere that might be harder for you to get. >> Oh, definitely. Definitely. >> Yeah. and maybe even having, you know, having it where there's, you know, they're they're put away. So, you have to pause long enough, you know, to be able to um access them, you know. >> Yeah. >> So, I know we want to have those ready and available. But, if that's the the space that you're going, >> Yeah. >> right to be able to put those away. What do you think about that? And >> Well, it actually happened

when I was like in the middle of driving. So, it's not like I I was thinking it and then I got in the car and drove. So, I think it would be kind of like um I think my best bet with that would be like for me if I felt so strongly about it, I like either pull over immediately or you know get off the highway or you know >> um >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Go into prayer immediately. >> Um >> right, >> ask for help, ask for protection. >> Yeah. Utilizing all the tools that

we talked about are a better route. But what I want you to think about is if that is where the dark thought goes and you've only mentioned the driving off a those type of things is to um look at not stepping into a car during those moments, right? Utilizing some of the tips like going for a walk or doing art with your kids, engaging with one of your kids, calling your mom, calling Wendy, reaching out and doing our plan to make sure that we're not in a situation where those thoughts are coming and you're in

the middle of driving. >> Right. understand. >> Yeah. So, just kind of being very aware of that and aware of of and utilizing some of these tools and making a phone call before jumping in a car and and and going in that direction. Does that sound some like something that might be helpful to look at? >> Yeah, that's very >> Yeah. So, um obviously the thing that that is most important is is for you to know that you are enough and it's worth living. So, if I were to ask you, what's the one thing that

um makes it worth living that just lights you up? I bet I can guess, but I'll ask you. >> Uh um the one thing is that I know that I have a hope in a future. I mean, I know where my eternity lies. And again, I'll go back to where God says he's true and faithful. So, I know um I have to want to live for myself before I want to live for my kids or, you know, anybody else. They're definitely honest obvious obviously right there with with with the Lord. I love them with all

my heart. I love >> I love God with all my heart and I know this is the his his plans for me are to prosper me, not to harm me. So like doing stuff something like that say that I I did give in at the moment that would be just it would be a very sad thing and it would hurt a lot of people and it and >> yeah, >> that's not what I want. Yeah, just really thinking about what God wants for us, but also um you for your girls, you know, and and thinking

about the times that you're going to have moving forward in your new place. You're going to have more art and more drawing and more laughter and more movies and popcorn nights and all of those things and just really holding on to those beautiful pictures um and and looking at at what's to come. So, I know that you're walking through a really hard season. I'm so thankful that you're sharing it with me and that I get to walk through this with you. I'm proud of the the steps that you're taking and you know, you are taking

big bold steps. You've gotten yourself an apartment. You know, you're looking forward on things with that and um planning a move. Um those are all really, you know, solid things to do. So, um showing resiliency and strength through a very, very hard season. So, you should be really proud of that for sure. >> And, you know, I'm glad that you shared with me the deep struggles that are coming and kind of the hopelessness. And hopefully this plan that we placed forward can give you a little bit of maybe an anchor to hold on to um

you know, and looking at um some of the tools, you know, we talked about. So the there's the you know techniques of the walk the praying the walking that you have you know your mom and Wendy that you could call you have phone numbers that you can access if it if it gets even um darker on that or harder on that. And then being aware of some of the things that come up right we talked about that too. We talked about some of the things that come up for you and really it's the aggression and

the anger and the kind of things that are being said that does not reflect your family or what you're doing and some of those um come but also it seems like you know you mentioned that they're coming up when you're rushed >> and so multitasking. So being a yeah being aware of that and being present that that you know um that you maybe need to slow down a little bit or try not to interact with him during those moments of rush if you can get away from that so that you're not overwhelmed and then looking

for some of those um triggers within your body and being aware that there you know I'm in and letting some of them happen right letting the tears flow and and release those things from your body and and and letting that happen would be um maybe some positive ways to walk through this season. I think you're doing it with great grace and you're relying on prayer and um you know, so I'm I'm grateful that we're here together and I'm I'm happy I get to walk through this with you. >> Thank you so much. Thank you. >>

Yeah. Thank you. I I hope to I look forward to getting to see you um next week as well and you could reach out um to me if you need me and you have these tools. Do you feel like um this tool that you know kind of our are our um you know very useful. Yes. And I'm definitely going to um do like work on this like you know each one like I'm going to work on it and then I'm going to try to do prevention um again. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. and and ask for

help when you need it. So, I I really do appreciate you mentioning all that today. Um because I some of the stuff I didn't even think of it. A lot of it actually I didn't even think, you know, think to even, you know, do do those things. I didn't know it could be help with. >> Yeah. Yeah. No, I mean I really see somebody that's trying really hard and working really hard and I'm glad that you're open to looking at suggestions and just digging a little bit deeper to see, you know, where some of that

um those thoughts come from and you were already aware that the enemy was there. You know, you described it um so well with the devil and the angel and all of that and fighting out against that. So, um, you're a very strong, resilient person and I'm excited to see and hear about your new place, too. >> Thank you. >> I'm excited, too. Thank you. And, um, so I come the same time next week. Is that okay? >> Yeah, that'd be great. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. I'll see you then. >> Okay. Bye. >> Okay.